[bcowen]

Here's a guide I use...

This is what I've always used too. Can't remember who put this photo together (wasn't me) but thanks to him for doing it.

 

[attmci]

https://www.ebay.com/itm/383567216972

 

[thomaskong78]

I am listening to "The Wall" .

I am happy that Line Magnetic 508 fitted with 1578 can drive my speaker Lansche 4.1 with such full force and control of bass.

It also give widest and deepest soundstage with holographic layering in my listening room so far.

If you are bass freak or soundstage mania, then you shall try 1578 Melz


Since having 1578 in my 2 channel system, I spend less time on headphones..

Headphones could not match dynamics and excitement of 2 channel system, although I have decent headphones, Raal Sr1a, Stax009s and HD 800s.

 

[LoryWiv]

Yikes, I did order a pair of Brimar's from Menifee, forgot they were same folks as BangyBang which I knew to steer clear of. The photos and test results looked favorable and price reasonable. I should have them in 4-5 days and will report if concerns.

The Brimars arrived and they are flawless with clean pins, no appreciable noise floor or microphonics. Arrived just as advertised. Sound is an interesting blend of lush / warm with rich but organic sounding mids. Female vocals in particular excel, rich and soaring but free of sibilance Treble extension and bass tightness are a bit less than I'd like but the good news on bass is no bleed, and instrument layering is very good. I've paired them with Tung-Sol 7236 powers which are quite neutral, and will continue to assess. But as for Menifee Audio, no complaints from me.

 

[Paladin79]

This is what I've always used too. Can't remember who put this photo together (wasn't me) but thanks to him for doing it.

It has always been what I used myself and it did take some time but I got to know some Russians I can rely on. When testing the 1578's they would often offer the ones with obvious noise issues at a lower price or include them at no charge. I got several 1578's free or at little cost after replacing the solder in the pins. They would only test them for a short time so others would develop issues as they were used. You just have to remember that some are forty years old and others are 60 or more years old before the solder started breaking down as is the case with Fotons from the 50's.There are some who just re-flow that old solder but I prefer to remove it, use fresh rosin and a higher grade solder with silver content so I only have to do the process once and never have to concern myself with a noisy tube in my system. In all honesty I have not run into the solder issues with tubes from RCA, Sylvania, Tung Sol etc. from the same time periods.

As far as hearing what one tube is like compared to another, it has never been about speakers compared to headphones for me, it has been about how can I isolate that tube sound and give the signal the purest path I can build so the differences are more obvious. This process also shows the weakness of many tubes, noise is more obvious. I personally cannot hear it as well if I stick two tubes or four tubes in an integrated amp or pre-amp or when adding a power amp to the chain. I get calls about once a week from folks all over the country wanting to tell me about their $50k or $100k or $250k system. My favorite was from a guy who had $250k in a two channel system, until the divorce lol. Many of my local friends are like that and they might spend $1,000 to $2,000 on a tube but in various systems could not tell me in blind listening if they had a Brimar, or GEC, or Marconi they were listening to so I sought to remedy that. To me there is also what an individual hears and what that individual likes. One person might prefer a 1578, another a RPBG Tung Sol in blind listening. Take fifty people who listen to tubes a lot and the consensus might be a black glass Ken-Rad VT231 or an RCA grey glass in blind listening. It also gets interesting when you stay inside a brand and have folks try to tell you which tube is the Bad Boy out of a group of Sylvania tubes, or the BGRP among Tung Sols. A $10 tube compared to a $250 tube because someone thought of a catchy name people might remember, or wow the tubes are going for $250 each, they must be worth it!

 

[bcowen]

The Brimars arrived and they are flawless with clean pins, no appreciable noise floor or microphonics. Arrived just as advertised. Sound is an interesting blend of lush / warm with rich but organic sounding mids. Female vocals in particular excel, rich and soaring but free of sibilance Treble extension and bass tightness are a bit less than I'd like but the good news on bass is no bleed, and instrument layering is very good. I've paired them with Tung-Sol 7236 powers which are quite neutral, and will continue to assess. But as for Menifee Audio, no complaints from me.

Glad to hear you had a good experience! The price was quite reasonable for those particular tubes, and while that's a departure from the normal Menifee approach there's certainly nothing wrong with that. Perhaps they are changing their ways, or one can at least hope.

 

[JKDJedi]

My problem with such things is buyer expectation. You have heard what others think or how much something costs and to me that can really affect how you might rate a tube. Another factor is equipment choice, I have had eight tubes used in a blind challenge that were used as buffers in a pre-amp, in hybrid amps, etc. Can you pick that tube you like so well and describe in such detail when you hear it with seven other tubes and some may be better, some worse? What headphones, what speakers? What music choices? Are you A/B testing or are you going from memory? I know of two people who can pick the same tube consistently when offered eight different 6sn7's for blind listening. Eliminate cost and brand and suddenly less expensive tubes can do very well and if you re-read an evaluation will it be anywhere close to the same as when you received a tube that was thought to be wonderful and was uber expensive.

With one of my headphones, you really have to concentrate to hear differences in preamp, the other...right away, no quess work. So yeah, I can see how that plays out. Lot of fun.

 

[Paladin79]

With one of my headphones, you really have to concentrate to hear differences in preamp, the other...right away, no quess work. So yeah, I can see how that plays out. Lot of fun.

Now imagine a fairly simple circuit in four identical revealing headphone amps, and you switch back and forth between them using the same music. Same headphones, in this case Sennheiser 800's, then as you get down to your two favorite tubes, you just switch between those two. Quality switch boxes are used, each amp is as identical as I can make them and built for those headphones.

Twenty-five criteria are generally used and the music exhibits each of those criteria so you know you are listening for sound stage, or decay or bass or whatever. Then you score each of the criteria and compare just that difference between the tubes. 52 tubes are involved, four at a time. At the end you can even take your top six or eight scores, and really concentrate on those tubes. You do not know till after the test which tube is which. Top score is 100 and that top tube chosen by 50 people could be a $20 tube or a $200 tube. Price, brand,previous opinions all go out the window.I have been through similar tests on equipment that could take 8-10 hours, this will be over a weekend for obvious reasons and currently it stands at four people listening at a time but with more headphones, the splitter setup is not too tough to do.

 

[JKDJedi]

Now imagine a fairly simple circuit in four identical revealing headphone amps, and you switch back and forth between them using the same music. Same headphones, in this case Sennheiser 800's, then as you get down to your two favorite tubes, you just switch between those two. Quality switch boxes are used, each amp is as identical as I can make them and built for those headphones.

Twenty-five criteria are generally used and the music exhibits each of those criteria so you know you are listening for sound stage, or decay or bass or whatever. Then you score each of the criteria and compare just that difference between the tubes. 52 tubes are involved, four at a time. At the end you can even take your top six or eight scores, and really concentrate on those tubes. You do not know till after the test which tube is which. Top score is 100 and that top tube chosen by 50 people could be a $20 tube or a $200 tube. Price, brand,previous opinions all go out the window.I have been through similar tests on equipment that could take 8-10 hours, this will be over a weekend for obvious reasons and currently it stands at four people listening at a time but with more headphones, the splitter setup is not too tough to do.

It'd be interesting to see the results of that test. Maybe a cool little documentary to post on YouTube.

 

[Paladin79]

It'd be interesting to see the results of that test. Maybe a cool little documentary to post on YouTube.

It is a group thing and not exactly mine to share. I can tell you in PM why the music cannot be shared I have a relatively small part to play. I know @sam6550a is an engineer and if I showed him a bit of my schematic he would probably get it and understand. If I sent him a loaner amp, he would really get it lol. One of the best descriptions is tubes that used to sound 60/40 difference now sound 100/50 when compared. A gentleman here provided that info and I am going from memory.

 

[JKDJedi]

It is a group thing and not exactly mine to share. I can tell you in PM why the music cannot be shared I have a relatively small part to play. I know @sam6550a is an engineer and if I showed him a bit of my schematic he would probably get it and understand. If I sent him a loaner amp, he would really get it lol. One of the best descriptions is tubes that used to sound 60/40 difference now sound 100/50 when compared. A gentleman here provided that info and I am going from memory.

Music is something we use to listen to our tubes..lol. was this a test on the Sound Of Music or just the tubes in general? It'd be interesting to know how the tubes compared in that test. You could mute the music.

 

[Paladin79]

Music is something we use to listen to our tubes..lol. was this a test on the Sound Of Music or just the tubes in general? It'd be interesting to know how the tubes compared in that test. You could mute the music.

The virus has delayed testing. The music just helps demonstrate parts of the sound spectrum. I am just saying I keep being asked for a copy of the test music and that will not happen, a ranking of the tubes I should be able to provide. In the last couple years I have been able to get one friend in as a listener. She has the ability to tell me when she hears OFC wire compared to silver plated, compared to litz, compared to solid silver etc. In a DAC test she was the only person whose answers matched the combined average of a 50 person group and her abilities with tubes is pretty scary lol. Another person with remarkable abilities is @bcowen and while he and I kid each other, I say this quite seriously.

 

[sam6550a]

It is a group thing and not exactly mine to share. I can tell you in PM why the music cannot be shared I have a relatively small part to play. I know @sam6550a is an engineer and if I showed him a bit of my schematic he would probably get it and understand. If I sent him a loaner amp, he would really get it lol. One of the best descriptions is tubes that used to sound 60/40 difference now sound 100/50 when compared. A gentleman here provided that info and I am going from memory.

Thank you for the compliment Tom, I really would like to see the schematic!

 

[Paladin79]

Thank you for the compliment Tom, I really would like to see the schematic!

I will PM you part of it when I get a chance. Enough so you get the idea lol.

 

[Ripper2860]

Here's the Readers Digest version of the schematic...

SIGNAL ------> TUBES ------> EARS ------> AUDIO NIRVANA