[James-uk]

.sigh, you really understand that graph??? whatever, I do not want to continue this conversation here. It is HD800 thread. 

Yes I understand that graph. So should you. If you are interested in this hobby go and learn!!!!!

 

[pearljam50000]

Does anyone here own both the HD800 and the Abyss and can shed some light on the subject?

 

[James-uk]

Yes I understand that graph. So should you. If you are interested in this hobby go and learn!!!!!

 

[62ohm]

There was once someone who compared some TOTL headphones based on their graphs, and the Abyss did not pass as a 'true flagship' according to his comparison, whereas the HD800 did.
 
https://docs.google.com/presentation/d/1wi8M-HSeK0JF33P-5ypydQjQ4OshRQhvWM0IX2h0NQ8/edit?pli=1#slide=id.p 

 

[chengka7]

OKOK, I will learn...haha, I certainly never understand this industry enough. 

 

[James-uk]

OKOK, I will learn...haha, I certainly never understand this industry enough. 

One thing I think is very important to remember in this hobby is that music is art but sound reproduction is science. I know which headphone I want to listen to to hear the musical art as intended.

 

[koiloco]

One thing I think is very important to remember in this hobby is that music is art but sound reproduction is science. I know which headphone I want to listen to to hear the musical art as intended.

That's where science ends.  Our ears are not at all the same and response differently to frequency ranges.  So unless, you could claim that your hearing is flat, the saying of hearing music as intended is getting really old.  Well, at least, for me it is already for over 20 years.  If we are all robots with calibrated hearing, it might make some sense but obviously, it's not the case here. This is why some of us enjoy the abyss while others prefer HD800 and even Beats HPs  

.  Let's stop throwing technicality at each other as the standard.  
I do agree with you about the abyss not being better than HD800 though.  I wouldn't pay more than $1500 for that HP.  $4000?  Forget it.  I'll take stax 009 any day.

 

[ToddTheMetalGod]

One thing I think is very important to remember in this hobby is that music is art but sound reproduction is science. I know which headphone I want to listen to to hear the musical art as intended.

Be careful saying things like this. I'm just warming you ahead of time. There are plenty of people that like coloured, more unnatural sound... some of which actually deny the fact that it isn't as natural. They let their beliefs dictate what they do, and claim audio science is hogwash. They think that we can't measure every part of the audible spectrum (which doesn't really make sense as we created these devices, as well as more complex and perfect devices like hearing aids).

Sorry for ranting, but do take this seriously.

 

[ToddTheMetalGod]

That's where science ends.  Our ears are not at all the same and response differently to frequency ranges.  So unless, you could claim that your hearing is flat, the saying of hearing music as intended is getting really old.  Well, at least, for me it is already for over 20 years.  If we are all robots with calibrated hearing, it might make some sense but obviously, it's not the case here. This is why some of us enjoy the abyss while others prefer HD800 and even Beats HPs   .  Let's stop throwing technicality at each other as the standard.  
I do agree with you about the abyss not being better than HD800 though.  I wouldn't pay more than $1500 for that HP.  $4000?  Forget it.  I'll take stax 009 any day.

Honestly hearing doesn't make as much of a difference as people say. Really, most people's hearing only has a couple of troughs or peaks that are 1-2 kHz wide, and only 1-2 dB higher/lower (my hearing is like this, which isn't perfect and cuts off at 14 kHz). Then again, between 200 Hz - 8 KHz my hearing measures perfectly as tested by an audiologist. Ear and head shape are much more significant, which might be why some people think the HD800 doesn't image well.

This is likely why people perceive the HD800's as bright whereas other people perceive them as smooth. Which explains why some people will like the LCD-3 or others better than the HD800. But these differences definitely aren't enough to consider Beats for example to sound better than the HD800, that's purely subjective .

My point is, most people's hearing is much more flat than say a flat headphone. While this does translate to slight differences in perception, it doesn't change as much as subjectivists state. It doesn't change that the HD800 is very close to neutral.

 

[koiloco]

Honestly hearing doesn't make as much of a difference as people say. Really, most people's hearing only has a couple of troughs or peaks that are 1-2 kHz wide, and only 1-2 dB higher/lower (my hearing is like this, which isn't perfect and cuts off at 14 kHz). Then again, between 200 Hz - 8 KHz my hearing measures perfectly as tested by an audiologist. Ear and head shape are much more significant, which might be why some people think the HD800 doesn't image well.

This is likely why people perceive the HD800's as bright whereas other people perceive them as smooth. Which explains why some people will like the LCD-3 or others better than the HD800. But these differences definitely aren't enough to consider Beats for example to sound better than the HD800, that's purely subjective

.

For some people, there're definitely enough differences.  Regarding the term "hearing", for me, it would include everything that affects the final audio reception; ear/head shape, ear wax, subjectivity and other things...all included 

  

 

[BournePerfect]

You're absolutely right-we can't measure everything we hear.  Only a fool would believe auditory science has reached it's peak. Word of warning to those who can think for themselves.

 
Either way this isn't the place for this discussion, obviously. The Sound Science forum exists for a reason. So the Odac/O2 guys can justify their tinnitus by saving a buck.

 

[ToddTheMetalGod]

For some people, there're definitely enough differences.  Regarding the term "hearing", for me, it would include everything that affects the final audio reception; ear/head shape, ear wax, subjectivity and other things...all included    

It definitely does make a difference, but preference is preference. 1-2 dB in a couple of areas isn't going to radically change hearing. You'd probably barely notice if someone EQ'd your headphones that much. Of course it does affect which headphones we choose, I'm not claiming it doesn't. But neutral is still neutral, both the HD800 and LCD-3 are considered neutral even though they are slightly difference in response... much like the differences in our hearing .

 

[ToddTheMetalGod]

You're absolutely right-we can't measure everything we hear.  Only a fool would believe auditory science has reached it's peak. Word of warning to those who can think for themselves. :rolleyes:

Either way this isn't the place for this discussion, obviously. The Sound Science forum exists for a reason. So the Odac/O2 guys can justify their tinnitus by saving a buck.

Yeah sorry, I just read a thread I got annoyed by but didn't want to dig it up and cause arguments. Of course, being a stubborn fool I couldn't stop myself .

Also, I own an O2 because it's a good cheap amp.. not because I think it's the god amp .

 

[pearljam50000]

I'm sure people at the abyss thread would claim the abyss is better than HD800 ,in any case i read it has much more bass than HD800, so i'm sure i would not like it.

 

[kothganesh]

Without doubt. SR-009 and HE6 are the only other productions phones that can hold a candle to the HD800.

IMO, more the SR 009 than the HE 6.