The (new) HD800 Impressions Thread

[magiccabbage]

  By approximate price give or take a few hundred - not in order of sound quality - and only in relation to HD800.
 

• Vali - extremely resolving for price. tube wetness. hint of warmth in bass. smooth, but neutral treble. monotonic timbre, but not gonna bitch for $120. I use it myself.
• mStage - warmish solid state if input caps are left in place. lacks resolution and microdynamics compared to tube brethen.
• Vahalla 2 - not the Vahalla 1. probably top 1/3 of this list in terms of SQ. yes, that's how good it is. fast, clear, resolving - more than Crack. not as warm though / neutralish. does not work nearly as well with low Z or orthos. best to stick with high Z Senns or Beyers.
• Crack - must have speedball upgrade for use with HD800. warm (but again tubes play role). not resolving enough to take full advantage of hd800. this is why most owners say it better with HD6XX than HD800.
• Super 7 (available used only) - bassy and thicker. darker sounding than best. balance can vary though quite a bit depending upon tubes. great slam and microdynamics. very good resolution.
• HDVD600/800 - I had my doubts, but great match with HD800. very refined sound, but probably lacks the slam the better amps have. balanced mode a must for staging, layering, separation, openness. not an exceptional amp, but very very solid choice considering price.
• Luxman P1u - basically sounds like a Super 7 lite. slightly more veiled, slightly less fast, but just a euphonic in a no hassle ss package. Sounded dated and is less technically competent than most other amp in list now. But again, how you can get ECZD sound in a SS package?
• Bryston BHA-1 - delineated treble attacks, but actually works well with HD800. neutralish. some reports of MOSFETS getting hot resulting in bass mud galore. Good staging though.
• ZDSE - euphonic sounding amp. luxorious ride in mercedes. slightly veiled when compared to the bigger boy toob stuff. good stage. warm and euphonic, treble is the sharpest of all EC amps, but all other EC amps tend to sound "not bright" (didn't want to use dark, because that may imply something else.) I've noticed most ZDSE owners have a thick copper cable with HD800.
• Stratus - slightly wet sound. latest version and upgrades is better all around with better bass articulation, staging, blackness, etc. Intimate sounding and actually good with cheap chinese toobs. works straight out of box with HD800, although with latest upgrades, care must be taken with source. I love this amp and Donald is so fricking smart, but he never comes off that way.
• LG - had some of the more laid back 6sn7s and worked well with HD800. Has Cavalli trademark smooth sound with a very refined character which suits the HD800 tendency toward dryness. tubes make a huge huge deal, the point of the amp, so YMMV.
• ECBA - neutralish amp, especially with new cinemag transformers. best staging, layering, separation, openness of any of the amps here by far because of high-frequency AC heater stolen from outer space satellite military applications. need to be careful of source. sometimes not a forgiving amp (I had to resort to anax mods), but toobs can make a difference.
• EC 4-45 - best production amp for HD800 period. Take the BA and turn things up a notch in realism. Not forgiving of source. i was touched by the hand of god when i first heard this. avoid if you like artificial warmth - it's a 45 tube after all. But goshdarn kicks hard as hell.

 
Lots of other amps, but I only mentioned the ones which gel well with HD800. Honorable mention is Woo WA5, but the time you are done with cap upgrades, and the necessary x2 mega regulator tubes to avoid HD800s from sounding limp-dick, plus x2 driver tubes, plus x2 300B... you get the point. and honestly, it doesn't compete as well with the other big boy toob amps. but its sound is considerable lusher than any of the others. keyword is lush, so certainly a consideration.
 
I avoided mention any amps which gooified the HD800 because I feel HD800 gooification is just plain wrong. You are better off with an LCD2 instead of gooifying the HD800.

Eh purrin could you please re-do the list for quality first? I am just wondering where you would place the DNA Stratus. Does he Stratus (with upgrades tubes) in your opinion come close to the EC BA or EC 445 ?

 

[purrin]

   
Please , please , take some time to try the Sonett 2 one day and tell us where the "litlle" DNA sits in your list

 
Yes definitely. I owe Donald a listen. Will do so at the LA meet this weekend. Just a lot on my plate.

 

[purrin]

  Thanks for the list, Purrin; it’s a genuine eye-opener! Did you really mean to say that the Valhalla 2 belongs in the top third of your list!? Wow. That’s a pleasant surprise indeed.  Would you say that the Valhalla 2 is a significant upgrade from the Vali? I love how my Vali and HD800 pair, but I confess I bought the Vali because (a) I’m often pathologically and irrationally frugal, and (b) because you praised this little amp so highly. (Awesome recommendation btw.)
 
But now, I’m ready to stomp my frugal nature into dust—though, I admit, purchasing the Valhalla wouldn't exactly qualify as a budget busting demonstration of my commitment to audio lavishness.  Anyway, I would sincerely appreciate your input. Thanks a million.
 
Paul.   

 
Paul, now that I look at the list - maybe middle.
 
I didn't realize I had added so many great (but costly) amps to the rest of the list. I think the Vahalla 2 can compete with a stock Super 7. In some ways less (not as much slam, not as crazy dynamic), in some ways better (less thick). I hate to say it, and if Craig ever reads this he will kill me, but Schiit basically made an Eddie Current lite amp.
 
While Vali is king of value, Vahalla 2 is the sweet spot of the curve - the knee - before pricing gets astronomical geometrical. The Vali has a few issues with microphonics (manageable), and as I indicated, tends to be monotonic in timbre. it has a certain timbre which seems to pervade everything. The Vahalla 2 gives you the full tube goodness. It's not particularly tooby - very different from Vahalla 1.

 

[jbarrentine]

  Would you say that the Valhalla 2 is a significant upgrade from the Vali? 

 
Same question here. I got the Vali based on his recommendation and have been exceptionally pleased. I'm looking at the Valhalla 2 to use with my T90 and eventually with HD800. 

 

[Madmollusk]

   
Paul, now that I look at the list - maybe middle.
 
I didn't realize I had added so many great (but costly) amps to the rest of the list. I think the Vahalla 2 can compete with a stock Super 7. In some ways less (not as much slam, not as crazy dynamic), in some ways better (less thick). I hate to say it, and if Craig ever reads this he will kill me, but Schiit basically made an Eddie Current lite amp.
 
While Vali is king of value, Vahalla 2 is the sweet spot of the curve - the knee - before pricing gets astronomical geometrical. The Vali has a few issues with microphonics (manageable), and as I indicated, tends to be monotonic in timbre. it has a certain timbre which seems to pervade everything. The Vahalla 2 gives you the full tube goodness. It's not particularly tooby - very different from Vahalla 1.

Excellent!  You just sold me on the Vahalla 2. Your advice and experience is always appreciated. Thanks again, Purrin.

 

[purrin]

  Eh purrin could you please re-do the list for quality first? I am just wondering where you would place the DNA Stratus. Does he Stratus (with upgrades tubes) in your opinion come close to the EC BA or EC 445 ?

 
Slightly different sound / different priorities. I could take either depending upon mood or cycle of moon. So hard to rate. DNA Stratus is wetter, more inner warmth, more intimate. BA w/ Cinemag OPT more expansive and solid-state precise. Both slam like fugk and are super resolving as fugk. Again, caution with source. Two philosophies from the two best tube amp makers for headphones period.
 
EC 4-45 is just on another level. Transformers were designed from scratch, development took forever, and there was probably some luck. But again, the 45 tube does sound different from 2A3 or 300B. So preference of tube can outweigh technicalities.
 
I'd like to point out that any item in that list of amps is quite wonderful with the HD800.

 

[purrin]

  Excellent!  You just sold me on the Vahalla 2. Your advice and experience is always appreciated. Thanks again, Purrin.

 
Again, I urge caution. The Vahalla 2 is not an artificially warm sounding amp, so I have concerns with HD800 pairing depending upon source. If you already find the HD800 bright, I recommend Anax mods or DPEQ (digital parametric EQ) to tone down the brightness. Personal taste and choice of recordings will matter of course.

 

[SoupRKnowva]

Yeah I saw that in the for sale thread and got excited until I notice he's in Korea. I'm not into purchasing over seas, too much trouble. Plus, I told myself to not buy anything until I can trim down my headphones with only the hd598 and hd800.

I'm in the Air Force stationed over here, it'd ship via USPS Priority to anywhere in the states since we have a normal us post office on base

 

[magiccabbage]

   
Slightly different sound / different priorities. I could take either depending upon mood or cycle of moon. So hard to rate. DNA Stratus is wetter, more inner warmth, more intimate. BA w/ Cinemag OPT more expansive and solid-state precise. Both slam like fugk and are super resolving as fugk. Again, caution with source. Two philosophies from the two best tube amp makers for headphones period.
 
EC 4-45 is just on another level. Transformers were designed from scratch, development took forever, and there was probably some luck. But again, the 45 tube does sound different from 2A3 or 300B. So preference of tube can outweigh technicalities.
 
I'd like to point out that any item in that list of amps is quite wonderful with the HD800.

thanks and i love the way you said "both slam like ****"!

 

[purrin]

  what about gsx-mk2?. many said that he is the best amp for hd800

 
Do you see it in my list?
 
Seriously, I know many people who love the GSX-mk2 + HD800, but personally I hate it for the HD800. Why not just light up an arc-welder in my face? Sounds etched, strident, grainy and also lacks balls with HD800 - flat sounding. Antiseptic. Analytical. Not my kind of sound. It even sounded that way with an MSB Analog DAC which is as smooth and buttery as it gets. How the amp makes such a great DAC sound that may makes me wonder. To be fair, the GSX2 is very clear and detailed.
 
First time I heard the GSX2, it was with the HE-500 briefly and I thought it was pretty darn spectacular. Resolving and clear sounding. But after getting more successive exposure to it with other headphones, I disliked it more and more. Just flat. Soulless. It's probably the most #1 overrated amp ever, with a mystery cachet enabled by the fact that they are so rare with production taking 27 months. I'm so sick of hearing that line "it's worth the wait" as sort of a lame excuse. While I am not going to say "it's not worth the wait", I'm definitely going to say "nothing is worth that kind of wait". Especially since there are DIY guys out there who may be willing to build you a Dynahi or balanced Dynahi for similar price, which is sort of like a GSX on steroids.
 
It's hard to fight legends, but I'm in a legend fighting mood today.

 

[zerodeefex]

 
Do you see it in my list?
 
Seriously, I know many people who love the GSX-mk2 + HD800, but personally I hate it for the HD800. Why not just light up an arc-welder in my face? Sounds etched, strident, grainy and also lacks balls with HD800 - flat sounding. Antiseptic. Analytical. Not my kind of sound. It even sounded that way with an MSB Analog DAC which is as smooth and buttery as it gets. How the amp makes such a great DAC sound that may makes me wonder. To be fair, the GSX2 is very clear and detailed.
 
First time I heard the GSX2, it was with the HE-500 briefly and I thought it was pretty darn spectacular. Resolving and clear sounding. But after getting more successive exposure to it with other headphones, I disliked it more and more. Just flat. Soulless. It's probably the most #1 overrated amp ever, with a mystery cachet enabled by the fact that they are so rare with production taking 27 months. I'm so sick of hearing that line "it's worth the wait" as sort of a lame excuse. While I am not going to say "it's not worth the wait", I'm definitely going to say "nothing is worth that kind of wait". Especially since there are DIY guys out there who may be willing to build you a Dynahi or balanced Dynahi for similar price, which is sort of like a GSX on steroids.
 
It's hard to fight legends, but I'm in a legend fighting mood today.

 
 
I've spent time now with both the GSX and the MK2 and I'd take my previously owned balanced Dynahi over either. 
 
I dumped the Dynahi for an EC amp and never looked back. Purrin's spot on here. 

 

[magiccabbage]

   
Do you see it in my list?
 
Seriously, I know many people who love the GSX-mk2 + HD800, but personally I hate it for the HD800. Why not just light up an arc-welder in my face? Sounds etched, strident, grainy and also lacks balls with HD800 - flat sounding. Antiseptic. Analytical. Not my kind of sound. It even sounded that way with an MSB Analog DAC which is as smooth and buttery as it gets. How the amp makes such a great DAC sound that may makes me wonder. To be fair, the GSX2 is very clear and detailed.
 
First time I heard the GSX2, it was with the HE-500 briefly and I thought it was pretty darn spectacular. Resolving and clear sounding. But after getting more successive exposure to it with other headphones, I disliked it more and more. Just flat. Soulless. It's probably the most #1 overrated amp ever, with a mystery cachet enabled by the fact that they are so rare with production taking 27 months. I'm so sick of hearing that line "it's worth the wait" as sort of a lame excuse. While I am not going to say "it's not worth the wait", I'm definitely going to say "nothing is worth that kind of wait". Especially since there are DIY guys out there who may be willing to build you a Dynahi or balanced Dynahi for similar price, which is sort of like a GSX on steroids.
 
It's hard to fight legends, but I'm in a legend fighting mood today.

hahahaha - that's the first time i have heard anyone slam the GSX like that. I nearly bought one second hand a while back but went with the Stratus in the end. There aren't that many people I know who have heard both but its nice to know that the 2 others did prefer the Stratus over GSX for HD800. 

 

[preproman]

What a load of crap..I'm talking straight BS 

 

 

[magiccabbage]

  What a load of crap..I'm talking straight BS 

 

In come the hawks......... this could get interesting!  

 

[preproman]

  In come the hawks......... this could get interesting!  

 
I don't own the amp anymore.  However, the amp is far from what was described.