[alecsus27]

Thank you, Evshrug and Phthora, for your kind and detailed answers. Looks like, indeed, I should buy myself an amplifier, at least if I want to enjoy them even more than I would if just straight out of my laptop.

I did find iFi Audio Zen Dac V2 here, at a price slightly less than the HD 560S (although it's called Dac, I take it it's a mixture of dac and amp for the headphones) - and indeed it's quite praised. It's still probably far from that $799 amp you have, Ecshrug, but considering this will be my first gear of this kind, I should be more than satisfied. Thank you for the recommendation.

I will let you know of my impression after the first auditions, but when this will happen, I don't know. All the best!

Later edit: unless you were referring to iFi Audio Zen CAN, which is indeed an amplifier, with a bigger price. But this one does not comprise a Dac, as I can see.

 

[morningcrow]

I was so impressed with the 560s on its own I held off on purchasing an amp for a couple months. Sounded amazing just through my HP 840 G5 Elitebook or my Technics receiver, even on a little ipad nano it's solid.
I didn't feel like anything was lacking from the sound, but eventually I got curious and purchased a Fiio K5 Pro amp/dac (approx $150) and like Evshrug said, it gave it a "better sense of depth and separation of distance, better clarity...", but with or without, I'm hooked on this. Its been fun adding the amp/dac to the mix, but not required to be wowed by these. This is exactly the sound I was after.

 

[alecsus27]

I see. So I shouldn't hurry to buy an amp after all...This is good news.
Thanks.

On second thought, I see your laptop has audio by Bang&Olufsen, so probably that's why it sounded amazing directly out of it.
Mine has Realtek Audio...

 

[Evshrug]

I see. So I shouldn't hurry to buy an amp after all...This is good news.
Thanks.

On second thought, I see your laptop has audio by Bang&Olufsen, so probably that's why it sounded amazing directly out of it.
Mine has Realtek Audio...

That doesn’t mean much when it comes to the headphone jack, probably more to do with the laptop speakers.

I would phrase it as you don’t have to hurry to buy an amp. It ought to be pretty good. But it will hold back the HD 560S from its full potential you would get from discrete components.

 

[alecsus27]

Well, I already placed the order an hour ago (for Zen and 560s). The guy from the store adviced for the New Fiio K3 as cheaper and should suffice to drive them well, but I still preferred the Zen Dac V2.

They say Zen is great as a Dac, but a bit underpowered as an amp (in this regard, Fiio K5 Pro would have been better) - hopefully it should be good enough for the 120 ohms of Sennheiser HD 560s. Anyway, I should have the option to return the Zen if I will not particularily enjoy it, and replace it with the New Fiio K3. The problem though is if I will like the latter even less...!

Eager to unpack them, probably in a couple of days.

Thank you for the tips!

 

[Evshrug]

I have a friend who really, really liked the Zen DAC (signature?), but I’m not well acquainted with anyone who has tried the amp out. iFi does make good gear and I had good experiences with other amps from them, so you should be good

 

[alecsus27]

The cans and amd/dac arrived today. The box of Zen was dented, probably someone dropped the package. The amp itself was alright though, and so were the headphones. I gave them a 2-3 hours listening, on the laptop, with Flac files of mostly classical music. First impression: a bit underwhelmed. There was a veil on almost everything, a lack of transparency.

Bass was enough (as expected), but not well defined. That veil seemed to hide the definition of both highs and lows. On the other hand, I noticed the sound of some instruments of which I was not aware before - or they were more clearly present now. That's probably a sign of a good rendition of mids.

There was no problem with the volume, I tried a few times the gain button from Zen but it was not needed - so the power was OK (I don't listen too loud anyway). The bass button at first didn't seem to add much, then I realised it did, and for the most part I left it off. Overall, I was not pleased by the sound, maybe I was expecting too much. It had a dark tone, and for now I can only relate it to a defficiency in transparency. Clearly the highs were not articulated enough, they lacked definition. Also the lows - especially the drums/percussion had almost no contour, no definition. Very present, indeed, but...muffled.
So no trace of the thin or even piercing highs of Senn 560s I was reading about - as if this Zen amp/dac managed to almost completely tame them out.

To compare, I disconnected the dac/amp and plugged the cans directly on laptop: the lows were even more present, with an added hollowness.
Then I plugged the mobile phone headphones, and (as expected) the same highs became utterly defined, and transparency was back. Of course, lows were almost missing (this, I knew).


For now I took a break. Later, I will plug the Senn 560s to my Denon AVR 2113, to which I will listen to some Malher on SACD from Sony UBP X-800.

At first the pressure of cans on my had was quite obvious. After two hours, it bothered me less (or I found a better positioning). But hey are clearly less heavy than my previous Senn PC350.

 

[Evshrug]

The cans and amd/dac arrived today. The box of Zen was dented, probably someone dropped the package. The amp itself was alright though, and so were the headphones. I gave them a 2-3 hours listening, on the laptop, with Flac files of mostly classical music. First impression: a bit underwhelmed. There was a veil on almost everything, a lack of transparency.

Bass was enough (as expected), but not well defined. That veil seemed to hide the definition of both highs and lows. On the other hand, I noticed the sound of some instruments of which I was not aware before - or they were more clearly present now. That's probably a sign of a good rendition of mids.

There was no problem with the volume, I tried a few times the gain button from Zen but it was not needed - so the power was OK (I don't listen too loud anyway). The bass button at first didn't seem to add much, then I realised it did, and for the most part I left it off. Overall, I was not pleased by the sound, maybe I was expecting too much. It had a dark tone, and for now I can only relate it to a defficiency in transparency. Clearly the highs were not articulated enough, they lacked definition. Also the lows - especially the drums/percussion had almost no contour, no definition. Very present, indeed, but...muffled.
So no trace of the thin or even piercing highs of Senn 560s I was reading about - as if this Zen amp/dac managed to almost completely tame them out.

To compare, I disconnected the dac/amp and plugged the cans directly on laptop: the lows were even more present, with an added hollowness.
Then I plugged the mobile phone headphones, and (as expected) the same highs became utterly defined, and transparency was back. Of course, lows were almost missing (this, I knew).


For now I took a break. Later, I will plug the Senn 560s to my Denon AVR 2113, to which I will listen to some Malher on SACD from Sony UBP X-800.

At first the pressure of cans on my had was quite obvious. After two hours, it bothered me less (or I found a better positioning). But hey are clearly less heavy than my previous Senn PC350.

Fair enough. I’m not sure which headphone you’re used to, but the HD 560S should sound noticeably less veiled and more transparent than the PC350.

Some tips that might make SMALL differences:
•Leave the DAC and amp on overnight.
•Turn Windows volume up to 100%.
•Double check your music player is using exclusive mode or ASIO, and not re-sampling your music files.

It may sound weird, but solid state amps sound a bit more transparent and unrestrained once they warm up vs a cold start. You might not need all night, but that way you don’t have to worry about it. It’s best to control volume with your amp… lowering digital volume in Windows throws away Sonic information in order to compress the dynamic range, it’s not actually changing gain/volume. Lastly, the Windows audio stack is okay for general purpose use, but bypassing it with bitperfect playback (or even using your smartphone adapted to the Zen DAC’s USB input) might give you a tiny squeeze of greater transparency. I recommend against VLC player… I use Amarra or Apple Music on my Mac, but if I was on Windows I would probably use Foobar in ASIO mode.

@Sebastien Chiu may have some more iFi specific tips for you, he works with iFi

 

[alecsus27]

@Evshrug: thank you. I just wanted to post that I started listening to a Carmina Burana flac file and, for some reason, the highs are better (also the sound volume is higher). Possibly just a better recording/processing of flac file. I will leave the amp/dac connected to the laptop all night, as instructed (I'll have to do this only once, or should I leave it on each night? .

On the other hand, I now realised I didn't download/install the drivers (just read on the description they're necessary, if using the amp/dac with a pc/laptop), I'll do it now. And yes, I was using VLC - I'm going to replace it with Foobar.

When reconnecting this evening the amp/dac to the laptop I noticed the volume of Windows was to 100% (I never use it this high, of course) and also the brightness level was 100% - clearly Zen messed with those controls If I click on the volume bar of Windows, I hear the 'ding' signal, but no matter how I slide the volume it stays at the same level. Is this the sign that VLC is on ASIO mode? I'll leave Windows sound, as you said, at 100%.

Thank you for the help!

Edit: I installed the driver, but that Tidal/MQA installation seems a bit complicated, I'll leave for later. Will that provide me with free Tidal access for a period of time?

 

[alecsus27]

I tried today the cans on the receiver&BDP but, for some reason, the sound was only in the left can. Probably I had to change something on settings (before it was mostly on multichannel). Okay, the Malher symphonies on SACD sounded already a bit dark even on MA speakers.

Still, yesterday I listened on laptop (with Zen-Senn combo) to a file with Dire Straits, which I already knew the tonality of (from multichannel listening on Denon/MA 5.0): while on the receiver/speakers the highs were exceptionally present (crisp and bright), on the laptop with Senn/Zen the same highs were...accurate, clean - but not bright.

So I would say the Sennheiser HD560s are, of course, very good, only that the highs (and this possibly concerns all frequencies) have a sort of dark tone. Their presence is never too bright. I will keep listening to other files though.

Maybe I am not used to a linear rendition of all frequencies, so I'm expecting a brightness which, in real life (concert hall etc.), is not that present?
Unfortunatelly, the pressure of HD560s on the head is still high.
And to make matters worse, in the past 2 days I've got headaches.

 

[alecsus27]

It's sad, because I've began to really like the headphones, and still I'll have to return them, as the low frequencies, coupled with the pressure on skull, give me headaches.

Later: I returned them this morning. Thus ends my short experience with Senn HD 560s & iFi Zen Dac V2. They are both very good products and I'm sure I was going to soon get accustomed to their sound - and I think it was about me getting used to neutral tonality. Now I realise I will never be able to enjoy great sound on headphones (that is, with great low frequencies included) because of my headaches. I briefly considered replacing them with in-ear headphones, but I didn't want to bother the seller by returning those too: I'm sure putting them inside my ear would have caused additional problems. Not to mention that I (think) wouldn't be able to get high definition on music with those, at least not at a price similar to what these Senn cost.

Oh well, I will stick to external speakers - for the "joy" of my neighbours (I live on a flat apartment, and this was the main reason I was looking for a good pair of headphones). Thank you all for the advices.

 

[bluenight]

Is there any reason getting this when you have hd 650 for an all-rounder . To complement HD800S on peaky sibilant recordings? My hd 650 headband have collapsed and is flat so its not comfortable anymore but i saw i could buy replacement pad.

Could it be better then hd650 and bring something new to the table?

 

[Luckyleo]

Is there any reason getting this when you have hd 650 for an all-rounder . To complement HD800S on peaky sibilant recordings? My hd 650 headband have collapsed and is flat so its not comfortable anymore but i saw i could buy replacement pad.

Could it be better then hd650 and bring something new to the table?

I love the 660s, but I also have the 6xx (close to, if not the 650). My personal advice is to spring for new factory pads and don't look back.

 

[bluenight]

I love the 660s, but I also have the 6xx (close to, if not the 650). My personal advice is to spring for new factory pads and don't look back.

I was talking about the 560S though. I would never get the 660S it doesnt compell me.

 

[SchwizzelKick66]

Is there any reason getting this when you have hd 650 for an all-rounder . To complement HD800S on peaky sibilant recordings? My hd 650 headband have collapsed and is flat so its not comfortable anymore but i saw i could buy replacement pad.

Could it be better then hd650 and bring something new to the table?

I have the 6xx, 660s and 560s. I don't however have the 800s. I feel like the 560s is sort of unnecessary if you already sprung for the 800s.

What sets the 560s apart from the 6xx/660s is it's wide soundstage, while retaining close to the same detail and sound quality of the 6 series. You already have the 800s though, so you've already got the soundstage angle covered.