[Drewligarchy]

Someone located in Korea listed their 23R in the classifieds and claims there is a new firmware release targeting improved granularity in the volume control. Does anyone know about this? If true it appears that current units would need to go back to the distributor for updating?

Each time of firmware update comes out units will have to return to the distributor? This seems a little convoluted?

I agree. Sending an amp back for a firmware update is no fun. That said, the amp is so good I don’t mind. And it’s perfectly useable in its current form. It’s really to die for with my Susvara and LCD 4 & LCD 5 especially. With the Abyss, it softens it just a touch, while retaining the slam and dynamics of solid state - which I really enjoy. That said, I still prefer the Abyss on the Wa33 va the 23r. It’s nice when looking for a change of flavor with the Abyss.

 

[IanB52]

I owned the diana phi and own the 1266 TC...the bottom end on both with the formula s/powerman is phenomenal for me so I am not sure what to say here...I am lucky enough to own the 13r which is essentially the same as the 23r and I use it with my susvara....the formula s combo is simply stunning with abyss HP's IMHO

This is what I keep hearing. I'm using this with a pretty high end EMM Labs DAv2 DAC via XLR and it just sounds like bass instruments are playing softer, lighter, more rounded than everything else and some bass notes and kick drum hits actually get a bit lost in the mix. It definitely doesn't sound wrong or broken, but maybe a bit too languid or reserved. All I really want is more punch and for the bass notes and kick hits to stay consistent and strong.

 

[paradoxper]

I use the dave/blu2 with it and love it ..go figure

Haha.

 

[IanB52]

I had a Formula S and Powerman for a year, and I think the 23r is significantly better. I didn't have them at the same time mind you, but I know what that amp sounds like. The 23r is faster, more liquid and more transparent. Soundstage and Bass quantity are about equal - but I never found the Formula S lacking in either with the Abyss. Bass quality on the 23r is better, fasture and more textured. When it comes down to it, IMO, the 23r is - overall - much more musical.

The 23r is easily the best solid state amp I've had by a fair margin - and the best one I've heard. These include an Auralic Taurs mkII, Violectric v281, Simaudio 230HAD, Formula S & Powerman and Benchmark HPA4. In my opinion the 23r is an upgrade from the Formula S, not just a different flavor.

For Abyss headphones, is there any downside as far as tuning goes to switch from Formula S to Enleum? More speed, liquidity and color do appeal to me if the synergy is good. I know most are using these with Susvara.

I can probably afford to own both amps at once to see for myself, but also I probably shouldn't.

 

[Drewligarchy]

For Abyss headphones, is there any downside as far as tuning goes to switch from Formula S to Enleum? More speed, liquidity and color do appeal to me if the synergy is good. I know most are using these with Susvara.

I can probably afford to own both amps at once to see for myself, but also I probably shouldn't.

Formula S might have a touch more space (both soundstage width and depth), but 23r is more transparent. Significantly. Things like cymbal hits come across much cleaner. I don’t see any synergy issues other than a slightly smaller stage.

If forced to choose between the two for the Abyss, I’d pick the 23r. Granted I had fatigue issues with the formula s, but even if I didn’t I’d pick it anyway. As I mentioned, the Abyss can come across as a little dry, and the Formula S doesn’t help it. The 23r does.

If it matters, I am also using a superconductor cable. I’ve listen to to both with and without, but my evaluations are with. Depending on amp, the SC cable changes the sound signature so much more than any cable has any business of doing (but fortunately in a good way),

For cable skeptics, I’d love to have them try the abyss with and without the SC cable. It’s just such an obvious difference.

 

[iFi audio]

I demoed the Susvara with it at Audio46. It sounded great, but it was only a 10 minute audition - so I can’t fairly judge it. The thing that sticks with me is how expansive the stage is.

It got me to buy the Susvara, only to return when I wasn’t as happy with how it sounded on the v281. I then bought it later again, but it took the 23r to make me really appreciate it.

From the short time I demoed it, it’s a steal at its price.

Edit: it was a couple of years ago, so it may have been a previously model, if the Pro ICAN is new. That said, it looks the same.

We now have Pro iCAN Signature which looks very similarly to its predecessor, but careful estimations are that it's about 20% better due to a higher-tuered power supply and several important internal components. Thanks for your feedback!

If true it appears that current units would need to go back to the distributor for updating?

It seems that any updates would have to be done inside the product and probably via a special diagnostic tool. If so, then folks interested in upgrading would have to send their units to the manufacturer, I think.

 

[jlbrach]

For Abyss headphones, is there any downside as far as tuning goes to switch from Formula S to Enleum? More speed, liquidity and color do appeal to me if the synergy is good. I know most are using these with Susvara.

I can probably afford to own both amps at once to see for myself, but also I probably shouldn't.

I own the formula s/powerman and the 13r which I assume is pretty much the same as the 23r...if you are going to listen to abyss HP's particularly the 1266 tc I highly recommend you stick with the formula s combo..if you do not have the powerman then that is a different discussion

 

[Drewligarchy]

I own the formula s/powerman and the 13r which I assume is pretty much the same as the 23r...if you are going to listen to abyss HP's particularly the 1266 tc I highly recommend you stick with the formula s combo..if you do not have the powerman then that is a different discussion

Don't rely on us ... Jaguar Designs has a 45 day trial for the 23r. Headphones.com let's you return stuff for a year. Buy it and compare the two. You'll quickly know which is better suited to your preferences.

 

[iFi audio]

Don't rely on us ... Jaguar Designs has a 45 day trial for the 23r. Headphones.com let's you return stuff for a year. Buy it and compare the two. You'll quickly know which is better suited to your preferences.

I agree. Although the community here is immensely helpful in pretty much every way possible, nothing beats trying out stuff for yourself. It's also awesome that most audio shops respect their customers' right to returns

 

[Drewligarchy]

I agree. Although the community here is immensely helpful in pretty much every way possible, nothing beats trying out stuff for yourself. It's also awesome that most audio shops respect their customers' right to returns

Yup - but there are always going to be differing opinions, like @jlbrach and mine - that’s the beauty of the hobby. And I never buy something with the intention of returning it, but with fewer hifishops to demo things it’s really the only way. It’s not like you are buying a printer - where it either works or doesn’t - you are buying something that will either work with your system and ears or won’t.

 

[Sound Eq]

i got the amp 23 to use with susvara, it is the best amp period i heard

i have one question i know changing from low to high gain is via remote control, can that not be be done without a remote control

 

[Tachyon88]

Don't rely on us ... Jaguar Designs has a 45 day trial for the 23r. Headphones.com let's you return stuff for a year. Buy it and compare the two. You'll quickly know which is better suited to your preferences.

Do they price match as well ?

Edit: Never mind, website says "Trial Periods apply only to new products purchased at the full retail price." Too bad..

 

[devilboy]

i got the amp 23 to use with susvara, it is the best amp period i heard

i have one question i know changing from low to high gain is via remote control, can that not be be done without a remote control

I believe that can be done by pushing in the volume knob for 5 seconds then adjusting gain.

 

[Drewligarchy]

I believe that can be done by pushing in the volume knob for 5 seconds then adjusting gain.

That's on the 13r. I do think you need the remote on the 23r to change between low and high gain, but I'm not certain. You can doublecheck the manual.

 

[devilboy]

That's on the 13r. I do think you need the remote on the 23r to change between low and high gain, but I'm not certain. You can doublecheck the manual.

Ok. I could be wrong. I thought I read somewhere that it was the same as the 13r.