[DJJEZ]

For reference, I placed my order direct on 3/31. On 4/3 I got an update email stating a 3-week wait, so this is almost exactly 3 weeks. While I'm glad I'm getting my headphones much faster than expected, I feel for those who ordered through dealers and are waiting much longer. Direct is the way to go. (But hopefully with the new CNC machines everything will keep speeding up.)

 

[Orlok]

Back about the AIC-10 bit, you're totally right and sorry for stepping on your toes about that. I appreciate your kindness in talking about that. I hope you're able to get one and find out it sounds just like you're saying. It slipped my mind for a bit about the comparative and "questing" side of all this.

I think one amp or brand of amps I want to try like that are the Aries Cerat ones. I've always just sorta thought they were cool and must sound great.

As for your guitar rig, that's hilarious. I feel like I'm in good company now. I get caught up in that approach a lot too and my brothers have been making fun of me about it my whole life. When I read the part about "pro artist friends" checking out your rig and saying it was over the top even for them, I felt a kindred spirit. Hahaha. I loved it.

Hey, no worries. Sometimes it's hard to read the meaning behind some posts and I totally get that. Yes, so many amps and other gear to try and trade shows can only provide a brief glimpse. One really has to live with a piece of gear for a few weeks to determine if it's a keeper or not - especially once your system is pretty much set up.

Yeah, I can get over-the-top and I've certainly wandered into the right hobby for indulging in that. Haha. That rig I built was so ridiculous. Even pros would see it and say, "This rig... and you, my friend... are INSANE!" It was a demo "concept" rig for the shop I owned around 20 years ago but I did consider it mine for a while. I thought, "I only get a chance to build a dream rig like this once in my life so let's spend all this money I have for inventory on this."

Eventually, I built a whole new slimmer and more modern rig around 5 years ago based on the latest technological developments and this is actually way more versatile and sounds even better - just not as huge sounding! Haha. I sold it to the company I run so I can get started with this audiophile hobby but I can still access and play this rig at work anytime I want and I can even crank it up as loud as my ears can handle so it turned out for the best.

 

[Orlok]

My thoughts when people say “show me the measurements” is the brain is far more sensitive than any test rig. And I listen with My ears and My brain, Their test rig doesn’t matter. My Schiit Modius tests far better than my WA33, but you can guess which one I think sounds better. To each his own I guess.

This reminds me of the love-hate relationship that musicians have with audio/sound engineers. During recording in studios and/or soundcheck before a live show, musicians and engineers would often get into disagreements about sound that would sometimes turn into shouting matches. They'll think each other are idiots and they have no idea what they are doing.

Some bands - when they can afford to - hire their own engineers to take on tour because they don't want to deal with other engineers they'll run into at different venues. Musicians (and listeners as well) hear things a certain way and they want things set up a certain way. And then these engineers with audio science degrees will tell them, "No, no. That's not how you should do it." And musicians will say. "Well, I really don't care what you think. This is how I want to do it." When things get like this, producers and managers with both musician and engineering backgrounds will come in to mediate and try to work things out.

Musicians typically have one thing to say to audio/sound engineers: "You do what you need to do but don't get in my way, okay?"

 

[Orlok]

Let me know when the sound science forum comes up with a way to measure what happens after sound enters your ear and gets “translated” by your brain...
https://www.nidcd.nih.gov/health/how-do-we-hear

Very good info. I should try to understand what's going on inside the ears more as well as the whole auditory perception subject. Bookmarked and saved in my 'Audiophile Archives' folder for future reference and further investigation.

 

[Roasty]

The Apollon and Denafrips Athena are a great match. I tried the combo with my speakers (Ascend Acoustics Sierra 2EX) and when the bass line hit, I literally laughed in amazement.

Superb with the Susvara and TC.. The Apollon simply takes away the worry that I'm not sending enough power, and the Athena dials it all in with such a beautiful presentation. Sweet highs, lush natural mids, and a weighty meaty low end.. Wonderful! And yet, with a sensation of such ease and effortlessness!

This pre and power combo definitely rank highly on some of my favourite purchases so far in this hobby.

*edit

I must add, i find myself actually listening at lower than usual volumes. It's odd, that with this combo, I find I don't need to raise up the volume as loud to get better mids or stronger bass. With my other amps, I find I need to turn up the volume before I can get the enjoyable mids/bass, almost like the mids/bass have to play "catch up" with the volume knob.

Also, I find that at lower listening volumes, I get to enjoy the music subtleties more eg imaging, soundstage width and depth, layering, and I get to hear more of the little details. Rather than having the volume up high and getting bombarded with everything in one big dollop.

 

[zenlisten]

Yes, SE is more transparent, but XLR has more power, which I have read owners of AB-1266 appreciate (but you need an adapter).

Here I tried to collect the relevant comments from the past:

Received the headphones today and they work flawlessly when connected to the XLR outputs of the Chord Hugo TT2 via the NEUTRIK female-to-female joiners.
I had to order this pair without being able to listen to them beforehand (due to living in a small country + COVID).
Now it's clear that it's been an excellent decision. They sound truly amazing. Never heard headphones like these before. Very happy.

My advice on TT2 driving efficient loudspeakers has not changed - it's perfectly capable of doing it, both from a dynamic current POV and thermally when you use the single ended output - but I don't recommend using the XLRs as it will thermally trip into 8 ohms or less. If it doesn't thermally trip then you do not need the extra power, as single ended will do.

XLRs into 16 ohm loads or greater is fine. But 18v RMS is a lot of voltage to feed into a headphone!

Whilst on the subject of XLRs, some amplifiers on the XLR inputs short pins 1 and 3 together. This can cause damage to TT2, so take care that XLR inputs are truly balanced.

On the Abyss though, the HP is 47 ohms and 88dB SPL with 1mW. Using the XLR outputs you can get a max of 7W RMS per ch - hot smoking ears. And the SPL would be a deafening 126 dB. Single ended is 1.8W, and still too much at 120dB SPL. So I would stick with single ended even with the Abyss AB-1266 Phi...

So I just tried the front panel 6.3mm jack with a few tracks, and the 1266 sounds nice. Via the XLRs the same tracks sound amazing. The difference is easy to perceive (unfortunately I am not trained to put it into words). One is alright, but the other is so good, I don't want to stop listening. (Based on this experience it would be probably a good idea to test different amps.)

EDIT (Jan 21): Turns out the two modes were not volume matched. According to @Rob Watts the difference is 6dB, and indeed if this is kept, the perceived difference in the sound disappears. Looks like there is no need to use the XLR outs.

So going from single ended to balanced will always result in a small loss in transparency in absolute terms as you have added an extra stage of electronics. In the case of a headphone, it doesn't care if negative voltage or ground - the driver is electrically floating so can't "see" the balanced connection - only the difference in voltage from positive to negative. So if you do not need the extra voltage or power, you will hear a loss in transparency.

But the case for connecting to power amps is more complex. The benefits of balanced is that it can reduce noise with long cable runs and in noisy environments. Indeed, I have heard some cases where balanced sounded much better than single ended, when going into true balanced inputs, and here it depends upon the amp, and the cabling as to which is best. But most often, single ended is the preferred approach.

I have posted before that on paper at least single ended is more than capable of driving the Abyss 1266 phi - up to an ear damaging 120dB SPL.

The most likely explanation is people are not turning down the volume by 6dB when doing the comparisons - listening tests must be volume matched. Of course there are other possibilities such as cabling and connectors affecting the SQ also. Then of course we have placebo which is a very powerful effect too! Then there are the unknown unknowns; the fascinating thing about audio is very, very tiny things do matter, and knowledge is not perfect.

Happy listening, Rob

Thanks for the insight, @Rob Watts. After testing it again carefully with the help of this number (6dB) that difference I perceived earlier has disappeared. Looks like I was mistaken because of the difference in the volume, just as you write. The SE front panel jack on the TT2 is indeed powerful enough to drive the Abyss AB-1266 Phi TC, there is no need to use the XLR outs.

I regret my mistake, and corrected the earlier post accordingly. I wish people would stop spreading that XLR outs are better for such headphones.

 

[SuperBurrito]

Ever since I got the Abyss AB-1266 TC headphones last Christmas my question was whether my TT2 is enough to drive them. However, in this small country I haven't had an easy chance to try them with a recommended amp (see https://www.head-fi.org/threads/the...ressions-thread.666765/page-882#post-16088128). Well I didn't until yesterday when @mammal wrote that our common dealer now carries the Formula S amps. I asked them and they were so nice that they have lended out one to me.

I haven't heard the Formula S yet. But its' Abyss' favorite solid state amp, from what I understand.
Sure seems like a simple design and implementation.

 

[zenlisten]

So I've been up quite late now, switching between direct TT2 and TT2 and Formula S, trying to avoid the volume bias trap (I was reminded by the earlier comments) and I am not sure anymore that I like the Formula S better. Was it a placebo? New gear, high expectations? Tried many different kinds of music and overall I like the transparency of the direct TT2 connection (front SE), and I don't seem to miss anything in bass, sound stage and overall. Formula S is clearly good but the question is: do I really need it after the TT2? Will try again tomorrow.

 

[Roasty]

I haven't heard the Formula S yet. But its' Abyss' favorite solid state amp, from what I understand.
Sure seems like a simple design and implementation.

I think someone posted another pic of their amp internals in the formula thread, and there was a difference between the two units? Can't remember if there was a reason given.

 

[littlej0e]

Given your comparisons, I'm very curious as to what cables you've decided upon and why. What did you end up getting?

You will likely be one the few to understand most of this, but here goes...

• AudioQuest Fire XLR Interconnects - crystal clear, highly detailed, and fantastic tonal balance. This is the only cable I tried that gave me all three. Literally nothing else came even remotely close.
• AudioQuest Firebird Power cables - Excellent tonal balance. It has less detail than a few others I tried (namely the Danacable Nirvana - just...wow), but I chose tonal balance over sheer detail and clarity for the reasons outlined below. The Snake River Audio Cottonmouth Signature was a very close second. Much better clarity than the Firebird and better tonal balance than the Nirvana, but a little high-leaning for my liking. The cottonmouth might actually be the best choice on my warm-leaning system. We shall see when my WA 33 EE JPS arrives.
• Final Audio Callisto USB. - Unexplainable awesomesauce. I tried like 15 different USB cables and maybe heard a very slight difference on like 2 or 3 of them. I was pretty sure USB cables weren't going to be worth upgrading, then I tried the FAC. It made a jaw-dropping difference in the rig I was listening on. It just lit everything up like flipping a light switch in a dark room. That's the best way I can explain it. I haven't a clue why or how this happened, but my eyes instantly widened and I shouted at the dealer over the music, "yeah...I'll take this one!" I hope it has the same effect on my personal system.

My only regret is I didn't get to try any JPS cables as I couldn't find a local dealer that carried them.

FYI, I've noticed I get maximum effects from the following (In order of greatest effect)

• Tracks with a lot of varied and deep 3D imaging, especially those with "trance-y" vocals and deeper tones do bizarre things to my mind and body (see trippin' BALLZ). Sometimes the music triggers visual scenes in my mind that I am physically transported to. One track in particular, "October" from Feverkin transports me to a forest with a brunette woman without a face wearing an elegant white flowing robe. I walk a kerosene lamp-lit path with her holding hands throughout the song until I hand her coins to pay my way across a long wooden bridge. The song eventually gets too "busy" and I snap out of it, but I still feel the powdery dirt and occasional tiny pebble on my feet during the walk along the path and smell the the grass and pine in the air. Holy guaca-friggin-mole...
• Highly detailed and balanced tones. Grand pianos, clean/tight impactful bass, and bass-rich vocal harmonies work especially well and make me feel I'm floating in space or "chasing the fireflies" (I figured you would know what I mean by this). But anything too high, trebly, or bass-heavy cause my ears and mind to focus and snaps me out of it almost immediately. I discovered tonal balance is key to concentration, immersion, and subsequent effect.
• Strongly delivered vocals with excellent pitch. Makes me feel like I'm physically riding on sound, sometimes falling out of my chair due to due the way it can mess with my equilibrium. Other times it feels like I'm getting pulled abruptly in reverse away from my chair and outside of my house. Some live performances have also made me feel like I was "falling around the room" and I could actually feel the heat off of the candles burning in the catholic church cathedral in which the performance was being played.
• Very well recorded and mastered music. Discovering this single-handedly ruined 95% of my previous musical library and tastes. Now, I find myself chasing music for the effects instead of what I used to enjoy listening to. In other words, my synesthesia brain just got a whiff of musical excellence and now demands nothing less. Clearly, there is no going back.

These are most of the places the SR1a + HS1b + Holo May KTE have taken me thus far. God help me when my TCs and WA33 EE JPS arrive. Also, the Holo May KTE was an enormous upgrade over the RME ADI-2. Infinitely more warmth, detail, and soundstage. It matches incredibly well with the SR1as + HS1b. Helps round off the sharpness/peaks and makes things sound like a perfect bell skipping across a clear lake.

What a long, strange trip all of this is...

 

[DJJEZ]

So I've been up quite late now, switching between direct TT2 and TT2 and Formula S, trying to avoid the volume bias trap (I was reminded by the earlier comments) and I am not sure anymore that I like the Formula S better. Was it a placebo? New gear, high expectations? Tried many different kinds of music and overall I like the transparency of the direct TT2 connection (front SE), and I don't seem to miss anything in bass, sound stage and overall. Formula S is clearly good but the question is: do I really need it after the TT2? Will try again tomorrow.

Alot of people say the powerman makes a pretty big difference so you should probably try it with that first before making a final judgement. Have you tried the TT2 with rear XLR cable as well?

 

[ra990]

So I've been up quite late now, switching between direct TT2 and TT2 and Formula S, trying to avoid the volume bias trap (I was reminded by the earlier comments) and I am not sure anymore that I like the Formula S better. Was it a placebo? New gear, high expectations? Tried many different kinds of music and overall I like the transparency of the direct TT2 connection (front SE), and I don't seem to miss anything in bass, sound stage and overall. Formula S is clearly good but the question is: do I really need it after the TT2? Will try again tomorrow.

It's good you did that. It is very easy to be blown away by new gear, our brain plays tricks on us. My first impression with the Pass Labs XA25 was WOW, then after a week I switched back to the TT2's XLR outs and realized most of it was in my head because it sounded great and I didn't miss the XA25. You have to switch back after the honeymoon period to really determine objectively if the new gear adds significant changes that you need/want.

The TT2's XLR outs deliver ~7watts to the Abyss, that's no joke. Adding another amp and hearing all kinds of wonderful things is fine, but you're hearing the amp's character, and introducing color (tasteful distortion) into the path. The TT2 has more than enough power for the Abyss (and I know power isn't everything, that's my point).

 

[SuperBurrito]

Also, as someone mentioned earlier in the thread the SC seems to loose a little bass quantity compared to stock. But after playing with fit that is fixed. I basically rotated the pads one notch and adjusted slide in a little. This restored the bass while keeping the midrange improvement. The TC now feels more musical, I always felt it could be a little analytical.

Just curious, which way did you rotate the pads? What o'clock are the seams on the pads at right now?

 

[JLoud]

I will check when I get home. But I believe 3 and 9.

 

[ctop]

You will likely be one the few to understand most of this, but here goes...

• AudioQuest Fire XLR Interconnects - crystal clear, highly detailed, and fantastic tonal balance. This is the only cable I tried that gave me all three. Literally nothing else came even remotely close.
• AudioQuest Firebird Power cables - Excellent tonal balance. It has less detail than a few others I tried (namely the Danacable Nirvana - just...wow), but I chose tonal balance over sheer detail and clarity for the reasons outlined below. The Snake River Audio Cottonmouth Signature was a very close second. Much better clarity than the Firebird and better tonal balance than the Nirvana, but a little high-leaning for my liking. The cottonmouth might actually be the best choice on my warm-leaning system. We shall see when my WA 33 EE JPS arrives.
• Final Audio Callisto USB. - Unexplainable awesomesauce. I tried like 15 different USB cables and maybe heard a very slight difference on like 2 or 3 of them. I was pretty sure USB cables weren't going to be worth upgrading, then I tried the FAC. It made a jaw-dropping difference in the rig I was listening on. It just lit everything up like flipping a light switch in a dark room. That's the best way I can explain it. I haven't a clue why or how this happened, but my eyes instantly widened and I shouted at the dealer over the music, "yeah...I'll take this one!" I hope it has the same effect on my personal system.

My only regret is I didn't get to try any JPS cables as I couldn't find a local dealer that carried them.

FYI, I've noticed I get maximum effects from the following (In order of greatest effect)

• Tracks with a lot of varied and deep 3D imaging, especially those with "trance-y" vocals and deeper tones do bizarre things to my mind and body (see trippin' BALLZ). Sometimes the music triggers visual scenes in my mind that I am physically transported to. One track in particular, "October" from Feverkin transports me to a forest with a brunette woman without a face wearing an elegant white flowing robe. I walk a kerosene lamp-lit path with her holding hands throughout the song until I hand her coins to pay my way across a long wooden bridge. The song eventually gets too "busy" and I snap out of it, but I still feel the powdery dirt and occasional tiny pebble on my feet during the walk along the path and smell the the grass and pine in the air. Holy guaca-friggin-mole...
• Highly detailed and balanced tones. Grand pianos, clean/tight impactful bass, and bass-rich vocal harmonies work especially well and make me feel I'm floating in space or "chasing the fireflies" (I figured you would know what I mean by this). But anything too high, trebly, or bass-heavy cause my ears and mind to focus and snaps me out of it almost immediately. I discovered tonal balance is key to concentration, immersion, and subsequent effect.
• Strongly delivered vocals with excellent pitch. Makes me feel like I'm physically riding on sound, sometimes falling out of my chair due to due the way it can mess with my equilibrium. Other times it feels like I'm getting pulled abruptly in reverse away from my chair and outside of my house. Some live performances have also made me feel like I was "falling around the room" and I could actually feel the heat off of the candles burning in the catholic church cathedral in which the performance was being played.
• Very well recorded and mastered music. Discovering this single-handedly ruined 95% of my previous musical library and tastes. Now, I find myself chasing music for the effects instead of what I used to enjoy listening to. In other words, my synesthesia brain just got a whiff of musical excellence and now demands nothing less. Clearly, there is no going back.

These are most of the places the SR1a + HS1b + Holo May KTE have taken me thus far. God help me when my TCs and WA33 EE JPS arrive. Also, the Holo May KTE was an enormous upgrade over the RME ADI-2. Infinitely more warmth, detail, and soundstage. It matches incredibly well with the SR1as + HS1b. Helps round off the sharpness/peaks and makes things sound like a perfect bell skipping across a clear lake.

What a long, strange trip all of this is...

+1 for the Final Touch Callisto

I'm a big believer of cables...interconnects, speaker cables and power cords...in fact, I have the Superconductor cable already even though I'm still waiting for the 1266TC...but not so much with usb until I tried the Callisto after numerous reviews and recommendations.

I share your observations also with the Holo Audio May when I upgraded from RME ADI-2.