See posts from Jason Stoddard of Schitt on some of their designs where they measure great but sounded like crap and the lesser measuring designs sounded better.
I would imagine that there is a certain minimum that measurements need to meet below which things will sound bad for most people, not that I have any idea what that level is, but I assume that was what the DIN standard for hifi in the 70’s tried to be. After that it must be up to listening what each person prefers and what the designers want their gear to sound like. The Walkman designers clearly had a specific sound in mind
See posts from Jason Stoddard of Schitt on some of their designs where they measure great but sounded like crap and the lesser measuring designs sounded better.
Yes and no. It always depends on what have you measured, why, how, what should your device have been able to do, why did it fail to archive.
Most devices that measure exceptional also sound exceptional. Devices that measure exception and sound bad are the exception.
And the best measuring device for audio is everything but the ear. Even the mood you're in when listening to a DAP can influence how it sounds. Its the most unreliable instrument in the chain.
What is your proof? Where are you getting your information from? And how creditable is it? What does it even mean? Why does it even matter?
I am NOT putting my Sony up for sale because of your post. I don’t even know what 144 db means in relation to hi res or CDs or even matters in the big picture. It all sounds like wa wa wa, yes Charlie Brown’s teacher.
Dynamic range is the difference in dB between the softest and the loudest sound that a recording can make. Long story short, the theoretical 144dB dynamic range isn't useful. A quiet room is 30dB, and to be able to discern the entire range above that floor, you would have to output enough volume to rival a jet engine, after which you would quickly go deaf. Most equipment, Sony's DAPs included, do not reach these levels - and it's probably a very good thing, too. And most recordings don't have more than 20-30dB of dynamic range anyway.
ASR did measurements but refused to spend time listening to the Walkman 1A. They determined that is was a very poor sounding device, way worse than a phone. They did a review of the Walkman 1A without decent listening tests; they explained that listening was not needed?
I don’t believe in measurements or ASR for that matter. There are many things we are incapable of testing for. IMO
Dynamic range is the difference in dB between the softest and the loudest sound that a recording can make. Long story short, the theoretical 144dB dynamic range isn't useful. A quiet room is 30dB, and to be able to discern the entire range above that floor, you would have to output enough volume to rival a jet engine, after which you would quickly go deaf. Most equipment, Sony's DAPs included, do not reach these levels - and it's probably a very good thing, too. And most recordings don't have more than 70dB of dynamic range anyway.
ASR did measurements but refused to spend time listening to the Walkman 1A. They determined that is was a very poor sounding device, way worse than a phone. They did a review of the Walkman 1A without decent listening tests; they explained that listening was not needed?
I don’t believe in measurements or ASR for that matter. There are many things we are incapable of testing for. IMO
They are just measuring. I mean an LG phone or a dongle do have better SNR, that's true. Their measurements are correct.
But plug the Z1R into them and it sounds like crap.
S-Master HX is prone to noise, but noise that is still inaudible.
It doesn't matter if the noise is more or less inaudible because it is still inaudible. It's like whose invisible friend is cooler. Which religion does have the best god.
When you listen at a volume of 100db which destroys your hearing in seconds, the noise of the WM1Z us still at -8db
The WM1Z sounds the way it sounds due to the choice of materials and mostly it's capacitors. Those capacitors did only fit into the WM1Z and work the way they work because they went for the S-Master HX and the S-Master HX is prone to noise.
The WM1Z is limited by space, simple as that. You can't have everything, there is still physics.
Imho, what Sony was able to archive, given the size constrains, is actually very impressive and even though the numbers in paper are bad, the sound it produces is excellent. It's a masterpiece of engineering with excellent sound quality, no matter how it measures
They are just measuring. I mean an LG phone or a dongle do have better SNR, that's true. Their measurements are correct.
But plug the Z1R into them and it sounds like crap.
S-Master HX is prone to noise, but noise that is still inaudible.
It doesn't matter if the noise is more or less inaudible because it is still inaudible. It's like whose invisible friend is cooler. Which religion does have the best god.
When you listen at a volume of 100db which destroys your hearing in seconds, the noise of the WM1Z us still at -8db
The WM1Z sounds the way it sounds due to the choice of materials and mostly it's capacitors. Those capacitors did only fit into the WM1Z and work the way they work because they went for the S-Master HX and the S-Master HX is prone to noise.
The WM1Z is limited by space, simple as that. You can't have everything, there is still physics.
Imho, what Sony was able to archive, given the size constrains, is actually very impressive and even though the numbers in paper are bad, the sound it produces is excellent. It's a masterpiece of engineering with excellent sound quality, no matter how it measures
ASR it’s true it’s hard to determine what they are saying. But your right all they are talking about are measurements. Yet it is worded to not say measurements, because to them measurements ARE listening. Which is absolutely ridiculous, you can’t hear with your eyes reading a graph. If you read the article they used only one full-size headphone, not even trying to get any results with an IEM. Who is to say if the 1A was even good with that one (full-size) headphone? Yet to them case is closed and they move on to the next review. They have stated the definitive review; no more testing required!
But really (as far as they are concerned) you don’t need to listen as all you need is there in the graphs.
ASR it’s true it’s hard to determine what they are saying. But your right all they are talking about are measurements. Yet it is worded to not say measurements, because to them measurements ARE listening. Which is absolutely ridiculous, you can’t hear with your eyes reading a graph. If you read the article they used only one full-size headphones, not even trying to get any results with an IEM. Who is to say if the 1A was even good with that one (full-size) headphone? Yet to them case is closed and they move on to the next review. They have stated the definitive review; no more testing required!
But really (as far as they are concerned) you don’t need to listen as all you need is there in the graphs.
I own the TA. Surprised you’re selling all the Sony stuff. Good luck with the sale. My only next items are the DMP and M9. For now, happy with what I have.
This database provides a lot of interesting info on DR by album/artist. Interestingly (to me) my Herbert von Karajan classical albums are among the best - and they generally still top out in the low 20s (and CD vs. vinyl vs. download did not matter). The absolute highest DR commercial albums topped out in the low 30s.
All in all, I would say that a DAP not being able to output all 144dB of theoretical 24 bit dynamic range is a non-issue. Even the 105 dB that the WM1A/Z are allegedly capable of will never actually be utilized.
I must admit that I'm surprised that the max dB swing would be 26dB, I would have imagined that something like a classical symphony where at one point only a piccolo flute is playing quietly and the next moment the full orchestra plus an organ is playing at full blast would have more than 26dB difference (Saint-Saens Organ symphony). Also Telarcs 1812 overture with church bells and real live cannons ought to give much bigger swing (for this one I had the original lp and the grove distance and swings is clearely visible to the naked eye when the cannons go off)
This database provides a lot of interesting info on DR by album/artist. Interestingly (to me) my Herbert von Karajan classical albums are among the best - and they generally still top out in the low 20s (and CD vs. vinyl vs. download did not matter). The absolute highest DR commercial albums topped out in the low 30s.
All in all, I would say that a DAP not being able to output all 144dB of theoretical 24 bit dynamic range is a non-issue. Even the 105 dB that the WM1A/Z are allegedly capable of will never actually be utilized.
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