THE COMPOSER OPEN BACK FLAGSHIP by AUSTRIAN AUDIO

[FritzS]

If you ask him questions you feed him. He doesn’t know what he wants. At some point he talks bad about the headphone and the company. And at the same time he says he wants to buy the composer. In any way he doesn’t seem like someone who has insights into the audio world and seems like a troll (or half troll) to me.

Just my nice try - I'm already accustomed to trolls from other discussions.

 

[RuslanG]

Well said. Thats also exactly the point why I think AA does not release a graph.

ingredients composition on the sausage label is unlikely to tell us fully about its taste

 

[Daiyama]

But I can pretty much derive from this list if I will like this sausage or not (I am from Germany, so I am expert in sausages )

And by the way there are companies who publish frequency graphs like ZMF and explain their tuning choice with these graphs.
See here: Atrium Closed Thread

 

[DarginMahkum]

But I can pretty much derive from this list if I will like this sausage or not (I am from Germany, so I am expert in sausages )

And by the way there re companies who publish frequency graphs like ZMF and explain their tuning choice with these graphs.
See here: Atrium Closed Thread

I don't know why we are still here discussing a product that is a few weeks away from purchase and nobody other than a few people has. Measurements not being available with a HP directly from the manufacturer is more a common thing than an uncommon one. So, why the impatience and bad mouthing based on assumptions? Besides, I would rather see measurements from people that I have been following: ASR Amir, headphones.com, Jude and crinacle. Others for me are rather just nice to have.

For the ZMF, I don't like ZMF HPs and I don't like their tunings, and some other things. ZMF is a different company, rather a boutique HP manufacturer, unlike Austrian Audio which comes more from a corporate culture inherited from AKG. So, it is a different approach.

Again, although I would prefer frequency and distortion measurements for a HP out of the factory, I rather prefer to see those from a trusted source I have been following for a long time.

 

[Daiyama]

No bad mouthing here from me, just a comment on the comment about the value of measurements to me and that there are expamples out there where companies (boutique or not) publish measurement data.

P.S. I have my own opinion why people getting impatient about measurements, but I will keep this to myself.

 

[SolarCetacean]

I've been following this thread for a bit, and I'll put in my 2 cents regarding measurements. I think it's important to recognize that measurements are a source of bias themselves. Anything that we see of a headphone prior to listening to it ourselves (review, measurement, physical appearance, price, etc.) will bias our listening because humans prioritize visual input over anything else (see McGurk Effect). A number of headphone designers (including Harman-adherent Dan Clark) have mentioned that when they're in the process of tuning a headphone, they won't measure the effect of a change before they listen, because they don't want the measurement to tell them what they're supposed to hear. Every manufacturer measures their headphones; it would be impossible to have any sort of production consistency never mind good engineering if they didn't use measurements internally.

Because measurements will affect what people think of a headphone, in my opinion the only reason for a manufacturer to release their own measurements prior to a headphone's release is to control the pre-release narrative in the graph-following community. That's basically what ZMF does, I think because people have lambasted their headphones in the past for their FRs, so they try to pre-empt that crowd. In other words, a manufacturer's FR graph is a continuation of advertisement with other means. My background is in computers, and to me, a first-party FR measurement is about as trustworthy as a first-party claim by a CPU manufacturer of their performance increase in a new product, i.e. not at all. I like when a headphone manufacturer explains their tuning choices in the FR like ZMF or DCA do, but that is no substitute for 3rd party measurements and has no validity unless the manufacturer's measurements align closely with 3rd party ones.

 

[chesebert]

Oratory supposedly had the cans for a while now. Not sure why he has not released the FR. Given this FR was the company's mid range offering we are just skeptical here:

 

[Nomax]

Who knows, maybe the measurements for the Composer of Oratory will reach us next year...I don't have any stress with it
Someday they will come, and until then I chill with my headphones and with the tacks of my choice

Why sceptical?



NOMAX

PS.lol

 

[Daiyama]

I conected also AA always with the X-55 and 65, did not know that the x-60 had a much more conventional tuning.

 

[Daiyama]

I've been following this thread for a bit, and I'll put in my 2 cents regarding measurements. I think it's important to recognize that measurements are a source of bias themselves. Anything that we see of a headphone prior to listening to it ourselves (review, measurement, physical appearance, price, etc.) will bias our listening because humans prioritize visual input over anything else (see McGurk Effect). A number of headphone designers (including Harman-adherent Dan Clark) have mentioned that when they're in the process of tuning a headphone, they won't measure the effect of a change before they listen, because they don't want the measurement to tell them what they're supposed to hear. Every manufacturer measures their headphones; it would be impossible to have any sort of production consistency never mind good engineering if they didn't use measurements internally.

Because measurements will affect what people think of a headphone, in my opinion the only reason for a manufacturer to release their own measurements prior to a headphone's release is to control the pre-release narrative in the graph-following community. That's basically what ZMF does, I think because people have lambasted their headphones in the past for their FRs, so they try to pre-empt that crowd. In other words, a manufacturer's FR graph is a continuation of advertisement with other means. My background is in computers, and to me, a first-party FR measurement is about as trustworthy as a first-party claim by a CPU manufacturer of their performance increase in a new product, i.e. not at all. I like when a headphone manufacturer explains their tuning choices in the FR like ZMF or DCA do, but that is no substitute for 3rd party measurements and has no validity unless the manufacturer's measurements align closely with 3rd party ones.

I completely agree to that.

 

[Nomax]

What should I do in your opinion?
When one of my favorite reference test tracks sounds with the Composer like never before with the Score One?



My ears tell me it can not get any better, because I have never heard it so grandiose
This lightness and aeration of the space of the performance...heavenly
But my Head tells me it is an analog unbalanced amp and without Pentaconn
Should I buy it anyway?
(If I were omnipotent/almighty,I would fly in 10 headfiers to make the decision for me)

NOMAX

PS.lol

 

[plakat]

Oratory supposedly had the cans for a while now. Not sure why he has not released the FR. Given this FR was the company's mid range offering we are just skeptical here:

The X55 sure was special, and that was easy to hear. Asking them about that and why it was not superseded by the X60 (which has a much more conventional tuning) they told me that this is for some specific kind of studio work/need and that's what they keep it in the portfolio for.
The Composer sounds nothing like that one.

 

[ThanatosVI]

(If I were omnipotent/almighty,I would fly in 10 headfiers to make the decision for me)

NOMAX

This made my day

 

[plakat]

I've been following this thread for a bit, and I'll put in my 2 cents regarding measurements. I think it's important to recognize that measurements are a source of bias themselves. Anything that we see of a headphone prior to listening to it ourselves (review, measurement, physical appearance, price, etc.) will bias our listening because humans prioritize visual input over anything else (see McGurk Effect). A number of headphone designers (including Harman-adherent Dan Clark) have mentioned that when they're in the process of tuning a headphone, they won't measure the effect of a change before they listen, because they don't want the measurement to tell them what they're supposed to hear. Every manufacturer measures their headphones; it would be impossible to have any sort of production consistency never mind good engineering if they didn't use measurements internally.

Because measurements will affect what people think of a headphone, in my opinion the only reason for a manufacturer to release their own measurements prior to a headphone's release is to control the pre-release narrative in the graph-following community. That's basically what ZMF does, I think because people have lambasted their headphones in the past for their FRs, so they try to pre-empt that crowd. In other words, a manufacturer's FR graph is a continuation of advertisement with other means. My background is in computers, and to me, a first-party FR measurement is about as trustworthy as a first-party claim by a CPU manufacturer of their performance increase in a new product, i.e. not at all. I like when a headphone manufacturer explains their tuning choices in the FR like ZMF or DCA do, but that is no substitute for 3rd party measurements and has no validity unless the manufacturer's measurements align closely with 3rd party ones.

Very good points, I can relate to this. Yes, pre-launch publishing of FR charts looks like message control (don't you just love how politics invade other areas of life?)

I've recently read a book by a neuroscientist, explaining some of the quirks of our brains... there's so much postprocessing of the often very indifferent signals generated by our senses done by our brains that we simply can't talk about truth. Having an FR chart in the back of our minds can bend our perception for sure. As can our mood, the weather, our food, a fly, a thousand other things. But while measurements are (at least in the best case) reproducible and reliable, we then tend to give them authority over what we perceive, looking to "verify the graph". I think its better to listen with an open mind and later maybe check if the FR looks like what we heard.

 

[FritzS]

Very good points, I can relate to this. Yes, pre-launch publishing of FR charts looks like message control (don't you just love how politics invade other areas of life?)

I've recently read a book by a neuroscientist, explaining some of the quirks of our brains... there's so much postprocessing of the often very indifferent signals generated by our senses done by our brains that we simply can't talk about truth. Having an FR chart in the back of our minds can bend our perception for sure. As can our mood, the weather, our food, a fly, a thousand other things. But while measurements are (at least in the best case) reproducible and reliable, we then tend to give them authority over what we perceive, looking to "verify the graph". I think its better to listen with an open mind and later maybe check if the FR looks like what we heard.

Past time ago I see some interested lectures about human hearing.
Many of these contributions (all in German) are unfortunately no longer available online.
The AES Vienna lecture, however, is - but also in German.

Vortrag "Von 'Die Lehre von den Tonempfindungen' bis zu TWO!EARS: Entwicklungslinien in der Psychoakustik" von Armin Kohlrausch am 27.04.2017 in Wien

Dieser Vortrag ist als Stream auf der AES (AES Vienna) Facebook-Site zu sehen:
https://www.facebook.com/AESAUSTRIA/videos/1804477999865178/

——

Diese Dokus liefen vor einiger Zeit im TV
Wie Klänge unser Verhalten beeinflussen - scobel im Rahmen des NeuroForums 2012
http://www.3sat.de/page/?source=/scobel/163143/index.html

Musik - Feuerwerk im Gehirn - Wenn Töne Sinn ergeben
http://www.3sat.de/page/?source=/wissenschaftsdoku/sendungen/162968/index.html

Fröhlich oder melancholisch? Ohne Musik wären unsere Gefühle sehr still
http://www.3sat.de/page/?source=/scobel/163300/index.html

Wie Klänge unser Verhalten beeinflussen
http://www.3sat.de/mediathek/?display=1&mode=play&obj=31561

Musiktherapie
http://www.3sat.de/mediathek/index.php?display=1&mode=play&obj=31560
https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=musiktherapie (da müsste ich noch weiter recherchieren)

Macht Musik schlau? Mehr Konzentrationsfähigkeit und Selbstdisziplin
http://www.3sat.de/page/?source=/scobel/163302/index.html
https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=Macht+Musik+schlau? (da müsste ich noch weiter recherchieren)


Neu hinzugekommen:

Macht Musik schlau?



Quarks & Co - Die Macht der Musik

Musik-Heute
Beiträge zum Stichwort ‘Strebetendenz-Theorie’
http://www.musik-heute.de/tags/strebetendenz-theorie/

Unfortunately, I did not save these programmes locally in my media library at the time.