[RustA]

Quote:

Like I said, its a logical assumption. I said as such.

However, it is LOGICAL.

The other...isn't. But okay, wait for the obvious to happen.

 
It is quite logical (I quite agree personally)... Still, it's only an opinion and we could very well be completely wrong.
 
Personally, if I had the money, I would buy the Annies, enjoy them until the K712 pro comes and then eventually sell them to fund K712 purchase... This way, you could still get enough funds from rather rare Annies and decide personally whether the final price of K712 is acceptable or not.
 
As I am short on budget right now, I rather suggest to wait since there really are going to be opportunities to get Annies in a good shape and for a good price (probably used but still near-mint since these were released only few months ago).

 

[Impulse]

The other big manufacturers don't change anything at all. Senn HD650 has been around for 10 years. Hd600 for 15. And they cost exactly as much as they did when they were released. The same goes to the Beyer headphones in the same league.

False and false. Prices for both of their old flagship lines have fluctuated quite a bit in time, up and down. Senn's prices recently went back up as they started enforcing their own pricing policy on retailers and Beyer's continue to swing wildly (by as much as +/-$100) depending on the phase of the moon and Amazon's whacked out algorithms... Talking US prices here, maybe they're more stable in Germany or Europe at large? Doesn't sound like they're any cheaper there tho, which would be the logical thing.

Both manufacturers have made lots of under the hood changes without ever being open about it, for a variety of reasons. Senn lost molds during factory fires and played around with baffle materials (a lot) and other structural changes for a while. Beyer's models were tweaked in 2005 yet the model numbers weren't changed. Oh and those are just the bigger changes that we know about because they're plainly visible during disassembly, there's probably been even more.

Hell, while we're on the subject of what other manufacturers do or don't do... Senn will sell you an HD25-1 II (which as you can guess from the model, has gone thru a few revs itself) with a blue cable/pads and three blue Adidas stripes on the cup for a hefty $100 premium over the standard model, lol. This is a headphone on which the R&D was paid out over a dozen years ago and they sell it like candy to broadcasters (look at any basketball announcer and what they're wearing), yet a consumer version that doesn't look like crap commands a 50% premium.

Amperiors are the same thing with metal cups, 75% premium (+$150). I don't care how many times they milled a prototype cup, that doesn't take a big R&D budget. Probably easier to research than pads. Senn had a 580 anniversary edition that turned into the 600 btw. Point is, everyone does the same thing in one way or another, at one time or another... And the undisclosed changes are just as bad as the random rebadges if you ask me. I'm not a big AKG fan, but it seems hating on their 7xx model scheme has just gotten too trendy.

 

[Mad Lust Envy]

That's the difference between AKG and those companies. AkG's 70x line has been known to be very, very consistent, with almost zero variation from its target frequency response. The only time it was different was with the old K701 which was tbinner and more bass light due to a different material in the pads, which they have since changed to the pads known today.

With this K712, it's (my logical assumption, based on how AKG has done things) that they not only took the design off the Annie, but kept the same drivers that they have used for the 70x since forever, leaving it to the pads to add that quoted '3db' boost in bass, which is what the Annie does. So unless they decided to completely change the driver, and let THAT do the 3db bass boost, and not the pads, well... it doesnt make sense, based off how they do things.

 

[KetchupNinja]

New video up for them on Youtube, anyone care to translate? 

 
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PkU2C0uBAsw
 

 

[Mad Lust Envy]

DURKA DURKA Mohammad Jihad?

 

[Impulse]

Is it me or are those two Austrians talking about rockabilly when they were discussing the mic? Think he mentions pricing before he puts each of them down, no clue what it is tho. The K712 highlights almost look closer to red than orange there but it could be the show lights or my phone's display.

 

[Mad Lust Envy]

All I understood was 'Mini XLR'.

BTW, I would GLADLY eat my words if these weren't a re-colored Annie. But honestly, if you truly believe it's gonna be different, well... I'm sad for you.

 

[HiFiGuy528]

I want both.

 

[Mad Lust Envy]

Knowing you, you WILL get both. You still have the Anniversary? You're the first person I thought of that could compare them directly, though you did initially botch your unboxing of the Anniversary, saying the pads were the same as the standard model.

 

[RustA]

Quote:

All I understood was 'Mini XLR'.

BTW, I would GLADLY eat my words if these weren't a re-colored Annie. But honestly, if you truly believe it's gonna be different, well... I'm sad for you.

 
In the end, you are probably right... Annies also look like a re-colored K701/Q701 with different pads for 2x higher price (reports speak so). These may be the same case for 3x the price.
 
===> Annies are less fail... But they are still a fail in my view (regardless my interest). ===> AKG should really re-do K1000 to get head-fi people seriouly interested again.
 
K701, K702, Q701, K702 65th anniversary, K712 pro, ... Audeze still call their phones LCD-2 at least.

 

[Mad Lust Envy]

How are they a fail though? They are the best balanced headphones I have heard to date, and noticeably better than the standard 70x models to me. No longer bass light, no longer peaky in the upper mids. Juuuust right.

Don't know how something perfected is a 'fail'. Other than pricing them a bit high. However, when you compare them to the HD650 and HE-400 which are both at or over $400, these are right where they need to be. I feel they are better than both, so the sound quality warrants the price.

 

[RustA]

Quote:

How are they a fail though? They are the best balanced headphones I have heard to date, and noticeably better than the standard 70x models to me. No longer bass light, no longer peaky in the upper mids. Juuuust right.

Don't know how something perfected is a 'fail'. Other than pricing them a bit high. However, when you compare them to the HD650 and HE-400 which are both at or over $400, these are right where they need to be. I feel they are better than both, so the sound quality warrants the price.

 
Offering the same headphone with different pads for 2x higher price is fail in my opinion... Look at Audeze, for example (different headband, different wood, different pads, different drivers, same price).
 
By the way, HD650 are around 350USD in Europe... K702 anniversary is around 600USD at least here (yes). Even HE-400 are significantly cheaper than Annies here and offer two different pads to customize the sound to your needs!

 

[Mad Lust Envy]

However the LCD2 pad difference (I've had both side by side) sound 99% the same (basically a very slight tonality change, much less than the standard vs Annie difference which is like 20%). The Annie is a noticeable improvement and different in sound over the standard pads, so it's not comparable. You're paying for a beneficial improvement in sound, comfort, and looks. The LCD2 is just a preference in comfort.

If you were to get a standard K70x and buy Annie pads, it'd jump up in price by quite a bit, and that doesn't even include the bumpless headband which further adds to the cost.

I feel sorry that the prices are that horrible over there.

 

[RustA]

Quote:

However the LCD2 pad difference (I've had both side by side) sound 99% the same (basically a very slight tonality change, much less than the standard vs Annie difference which is like 20%). The Annie is a noticeable improvement and different in sound over the standard pads, so it's not comparable. You're paying for a beneficial improvement in sound, comfort, and looks. The LCD2 is just a preference in comfort.

I feel sorry that the prices are that horrible over there.

 
I understand your point, don't get me wrong... I just don't find myself applauding to Annies just because AKG polished their pads a bit and raised the price when others are doing the same (almost) for free.
 
As for the prices, yes... Annies are really 600 - 700USD here. The same extravagancy goes with Audeze and Hifiman as well (and other brands). You can buy HD800 for the same price as LCD-2 here - well, at least until Sennheiser raised the price few months ago. HE-500 is also near 1000USD here. That's why I imported LCD-2 instead of buying them here... Well, HD800 FTW.

 
In general, buying audiophile stuff here in Europe is really painful... Americans really don't have a clue how fortunate they are when they can easily demo almost everything for free and still have the lowest prices in the world.

 

[Impulse]

Demo almost everything for free? Maybe if you live in one of the big cities with nice boutique shops (and enthusiast meets every year), or if you just a abuse the hell out of Amazon/other's return policy... Most of the population ain't that lucky tho! Anyway, I can understand Audeze/Hifiman being more expensive since they're based over here, but What, AKG are made over there! That one really doesn't make any sense.

The used market here's probably nicer than anywhere else tho, just cause of the sheer scale.