Stax SRM-007t XLR polarity
Sep 10, 2007 at 9:09 AM Thread Starter Post #1 of 24

mikeliao

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I recently purchased a used Stax SRM-007t amp. The XLR connectors show pin 2 cold and pin 3 hot. Curious if other 007t owners can confirm this polarity as well.

All my other balanced gear runs on pin 2 hot. Changing the polarity inside the Stax amp doesn't seem to be an option. Should I build some reverse polarity cables or just run the amp on reverse polarity? Any comments on if the amp sounds different on reverse polarity?
 
Sep 10, 2007 at 2:43 PM Post #2 of 24
There is a switch on the back of the 007t for changing input 2 between RCA and XLR. Do you have this properly set for XLR?
 
Sep 10, 2007 at 3:35 PM Post #3 of 24
The switch simply grounds the - input of the amp when it is set to RCA mode. It doesn't alter the polarity. You could reverse the wires on the volume control or somewhere else on the way to the amp board but a modified interconnect would probably be easier to do.
 
Sep 11, 2007 at 3:39 AM Post #4 of 24
Spritzer, reversing the wires on the volume control is not a bad idea. No wires really but lemme look into that and see if it can be done without altering the RCA inputs.

Thanks Hirsch for reminding of the switch. Have you guys every flipped the switch while listening to music? Besides the slight volume change you can do a quick comparison between balanced and unbalanced.

Listening to the amp now with pins 2 and 3 reversed sounds just fine, but I'm not that familiar with the 007t. Will build a modified IC anyway and see theres any sound differences.
 
Sep 11, 2007 at 5:34 AM Post #5 of 24
The problem with the wiring that exists is if you've got both single-ended and XLR hooked up to your CD player, that player is likely to use pin 2 for its hot signal. If the 007t is hooked up, setting the switch to RCA will ground the hot signal, and a single-ended output on the CDP won't function. The 007t will work fine. Remember that it has to generate a + and - voltage at the outputs regardless of whether the signal is balanced or not. So, the 007t is going to have the capability to produce a phase-inverted signal, at least if one is not already present. When you flip the switch, you're using an internally generated instead of one from your source. Note that the actual phase of the amp is not determine at the input, though, but at the output. If the amp inverts the phase of a balanced signal, then using pin 3 as the "+" connector, while pin 2 receives the (-) signal, which is the reverse of normal practice, might result in correct phase at the outputs, which is where it matters.

Note that the amp receives the single ended input in parallel with pin 3, so it's going to be inverting phase of a single-ended signal also, unless phase is inverted back somewhere in the amp, in which case it's simply not going to matter.

Check phase at the output of the amp. If the + pins of the output connector have a + signal, and the - pins of the output connector have a - signal, then the signal going to the headphone will have correct absolute phase, regardless of pins used on the inputs, and anything you do with rewiring inputs or a cable mod is just going to screw the phase up.
 
Sep 11, 2007 at 3:56 PM Post #6 of 24
Balanced amps will always ground the the - (cold) signal when running single ended to be non inverting. Just swapping the connection to the amp board would be an easy fix but hanging the IC's won't void your warranty. I've never heard that much of a difference with the headphones wired up the wrong way but we all listen for different things.

I built a cheater plug, that reverses phase, some time ago to see if I could improve the HE90 by reversing the wiring as this is an old Stax trick but the difference was small and very recording dependent. I don't listen to a lot of "natural" recordings so that might be a factor.
 
Sep 17, 2007 at 4:42 AM Post #7 of 24
Well, I built the reverse polarity cables and checked that the output polarity is now correctly in phase ++ --. You know what, it sounds the same. I really can't tell the difference. Even playing a mono source and using a normal cable on one channel and the reversed cable on the other chanel, it sounds identical.

I've built the cables already, so will just continue to use it. Thanks for the help everyone.
 
Sep 17, 2007 at 6:53 AM Post #8 of 24
Quote:

Originally Posted by mikeliao /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Well, I built the reverse polarity cables and checked that the output polarity is now correctly in phase ++ --. You know what, it sounds the same. I really can't tell the difference. Even playing a mono source and using a normal cable on one channel and the reversed cable on the other chanel, it sounds identical.


Great to know that I am not missing out of much (anything).
Cause I have not made any additional steps when I ordered my XLR interconnect. Hence I might be using reverse polarity as well...
rolleyes.gif
 
Sep 17, 2007 at 8:09 AM Post #9 of 24
Quote:

Originally Posted by mikeliao /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Well, I built the reverse polarity cables and checked that the output polarity is now correctly in phase ++ --. You know what, it sounds the same. I really can't tell the difference. Even playing a mono source and using a normal cable on one channel and the reversed cable on the other chanel, it sounds identical.

I've built the cables already, so will just continue to use it. Thanks for the help everyone.



I've heard a little difference with some recordings but it was minimal. Stax did wire some of the past headphones out of phase so it could depend on the driver design.

Quote:

Originally Posted by krmathis /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Great to know that I am not missing out of much (anything).
Cause I have not made any additional steps when I ordered my XLR interconnect. Hence I might be using reverse polarity as well...
rolleyes.gif



You might very well have the correct polarity since it's the American manufacturers that are using the wrong standard, while the rest of the world uses the correct one. It really depends on if the ECD-1 was intended for the American market.
 
Sep 17, 2007 at 8:57 AM Post #10 of 24
Quote:

Originally Posted by spritzer /img/forum/go_quote.gif
You might very well have the correct polarity since it's the American manufacturers that are using the wrong standard, while the rest of the world uses the correct one. It really depends on if the ECD-1 was intended for the American market.


I have not thought about this earlier.
Pretty sure there are notes besides the XLR connectors on the ECD1, which show which is the warm and cold side. I will check it out when I get home...
 
Sep 17, 2007 at 9:05 AM Post #11 of 24
Quote:

Originally Posted by krmathis /img/forum/go_quote.gif
I have not thought about this earlier.
Pretty sure there are notes besides the XLR connectors on the ECD1, which show which is the warm and cold side. I will check it out when I get home...



Please do and report back.
 
Sep 17, 2007 at 3:25 PM Post #12 of 24
Quote:

Originally Posted by spritzer /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Please do and report back.


Seems I have been running reverse polarity since last summer, without knowing so.
wink.gif

Cause the ECD1 have the following configuration:
1. GND
2. + (hot)
3. - (cold)

While the SRM-007t have the following configuration:
1. GND
2. - (cold)
3. + (hot)

I just have to live with it, since I already have my final cable. he he
 
Sep 17, 2007 at 5:18 PM Post #13 of 24
Quote:

Originally Posted by krmathis /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Seems I have been running reverse polarity since last summer, without knowing so.
wink.gif

Cause the ECD1 have the following configuration:
1. GND
2. + (hot)
3. - (cold)

While the SRM-007t have the following configuration:
1. GND
2. - (cold)
3. + (hot)

I just have to live with it, since I already have my final cable. he he



You could always open up the ECD-1 and reverse it or send it to the factory and have them do it but for something barely audible...
rolleyes.gif
 
Sep 17, 2007 at 5:30 PM Post #14 of 24
Quote:

Originally Posted by spritzer /img/forum/go_quote.gif
You could always open up the ECD-1 and reverse it or send it to the factory and have them do it but for something barely audible...
rolleyes.gif



From what I understand there are minor to no audible difference, so I conclude that its not worth it.
But I will keep it in mind next time I buy a new amplifier...
 

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