[Strale]

right i have just been comparing my Phonitor SE to Violectric V200.
please bare in mind i am not great at describing what i hear. and my ears are old!.
as far as background noise goes , to me there is no difference.
at listenable volume levels i hear no noise whatsoever from either when using my most sensitive cans Denon AH-d2000 (25 ohm, sens 114.3 dB/V).
i used the d2000 purely to check the noise floor.

the V200 does seem to be slightly warmer in tone and seems to reach deeper into the bass region, however the SPL seems to have better control and tightness to its bass.
mids seem more forward to me on the SPL and slightly better in clarity.
i get the impression of better treble resolution/ extension from the SPL.
the biggest difference to me between the 2 amps is the much wider soundstage on the SPL.
both amps are very enjoyable, to me, but if i had to pick one to keep right now it would be the SPL.

my 2 prefered headphones at the moment are Sony mdr-z7 m2 and JMaudio XTC (300 ohm).
the Sony is warm sounding and the XTC is tuned "warm but detailed".
the V200 is regarded as on the warm side, so i feel the SPL better compliments my headphones of choice.
dac is Qutest, btw.

Thanks, nice comparison! I think this clarity of SPL is the key for smoothness I felt - there is no grain in the sound. So even if mids/highs are more forward compared to V200 (as you described), SPL is still non-fatiguing for me, even on brighter headphones like K712.

 

[Gggggas]

Thanks!

Sound from a Phonitor XE is very natural. Tiny details in the voices are making it so 'organic' sounding. Really nice sounding device.

Despite the fact that Phonitor doesn't provide impression of completely 'black background' sound signature which I was seeking for (more details on 'black background' or 'silence between the notes' meaning could be found in this thread), Phonitor still seriously draw my attention. I am wondering if Violectric provides more silence between the notes...?

Exactly like you said it, a totally black background that I tried on the +22DB gain max volume and I was impressed. One thing that is not mentioned often is the extremely big soundstage that this amplifier offers, I personally think that they certainly deserve more credit especially considering the left and right channel control which is very handy for those with hearing imbalance and the crossfeed that is actually very cool and definitely not a gimmick.
I remember being extremely impressed testing it playing certain tones as I was increasing the width and the crossfeed level. It is not something noticed in all songs but on certain tracks and situations it is incredible. A song you can try is "Fly Away" by Lenny Kravitz.

 

[Strale]

Exactly like you said it, a totally black background that I tried on the +22DB gain max volume and I was impressed. One thing that is not mentioned often is the extremely big soundstage that this amplifier offers, I personally think that they certainly deserve more credit especially considering the left and right channel control which is very handy for those with hearing imbalance and the crossfeed that is actually very cool and definitely not a gimmick.
I remember being extremely impressed testing it playing certain tones as I was increasing the width and the crossfeed level. It is not something noticed in all songs but on certain tracks and situations it is incredible. A song you can try is "Fly Away" by Lenny Kravitz.

I think I was a bit misunderstood....I will try to explain.

I said that Phonitor does NOT have black background sound signature, IMO. But, when I say black background, I am not thinking about noise floor. Noise floor itself is really fantastic on Phonitor (as you said even on +22dB gain everything is completely silent, although I didn't try any IEMs). What I meant under the term 'black background' is a specific sound signature which I have only found in my Astell&Kern SR35 DAP so far. There is a thread specifically dedicated to 'black background' sound signature here on the head-fi, it is here:

https://www.head-fi.org/threads/recommendation-for-a-dac-or-amp-with-black-background.967643/

In short, it is very hard to precisely define black background (like everything in this hobby) but here is the summary from the thread above:

I am looking for recommendations. After spending couple of years trying out various (mostly affordable) DAC/AMPs, I realized that my preference decidedly tilted towards gears with "black" background. I hope you know what I mean

The most black background I've ever come across in a DAC so far is Audio-GD R2R-11. For AMP that has to be Violectric V200. This is the kind of silence I am looking for - shall I say the ability to render notes out of nothingness? Dare I say "sound of silence" ?

This has nothing to do with measurements because Topping L30/E30 had the best measurements of everything I owned but I felt the air was filled with something. It's not simply about "rolled-off treble" thingy either, because Asgard 3 had rolled off treble (for lack of better term) and it still had something saturating the air, instead of having completely void space.

The first time I experienced that black background was on Astell & Kern SR35 DAP. That somehow separates it from the rest. With that, everything was raised on the next level, everything sounds better on the black background. I would say it is the blackness between the instruments - like the notes appear from nowhere and then disappears back in the same 'abyss', or simply as you said: ''to render notes out of nothingness''. I still do not know what that actually is. I suppose it is not just low background noise, but together with it maybe fast transients, high clarity/definition, great micro-dynamics,...

Yes, cleanliness and high level of detail is completing a definition of a black background. You can really follow all individual instruments and low level details in the background like you have several drivers in your headphones. But it is never aggressive, bright, harsh...a contrary - it is doing all that very politely, with rounded edges. That is the point, black background should not be mixed up with bright sounding devices which are trying to raise the level of details by reducing bass and emphasizing high tones, ending up in fatiguing sound.

At this point I am prone to think this black background impression is born mostly out of fast transients in the amplifier. I noticed people usually link black background to the background noise (hissing sound), but here we are not talking about it, so no bat's ears are needed for that to be noticed

Finally, Phonitor is a fantastic amp, no question about it. But it does NOT have black background sound signature as per the definitions given above. Its noise floor is great but black background is something else. I think Phonitor has some deep bass reverb which somehow fills the 'air' in the background (it is not noise!). It is very liquid sounding and that is probably the reason why someone who is get used to a tubes could like the Phonitor as well. So, there is no a 'void' space between the notes. The easiest way to test that is on some acoustic tracks. With Phonitor, a natural reverb from acoustic guitar would be more extended, thus filling the space. Maybe transients are a bit relaxed...

 

[Gggggas]

I think I was a bit misunderstood....I will try to explain.

I said that Phonitor does NOT have black background sound signature, IMO. But, when I say black background, I am not thinking about noise floor. Noise floor itself is really fantastic on Phonitor (as you said even on +22dB gain everything is completely silent, although I didn't try any IEMs). What I meant under the term 'black background' is a specific sound signature which I have only found in my Astell&Kern SR35 DAP so far. There is a thread specifically dedicated to 'black background' sound signature here on the head-fi, it is here:

https://www.head-fi.org/threads/recommendation-for-a-dac-or-amp-with-black-background.967643/

In short, it is very hard to precisely define black background (like everything in this hobby) but here is the summary from the thread above:






Finally, Phonitor is a fantastic amp, no question about it. But it does NOT have black background sound signature as per the definitions given above. Its noise floor is great but black background is something else. I think Phonitor has some deep bass reverb which somehow fills the 'air' in the background (it is not noise!). It is very liquid sounding and that is probably the reason why someone who is get used to a tubes could like the Phonitor as well. So, there is no a 'void' space between the notes. The easiest way to test that is on some acoustic tracks. With Phonitor, a natural reverb from acoustic guitar would be more extended, thus filling the space. Maybe transients are a bit relaxed...

Okay I got you now mate, thanks for the detailed explanation including quotes. I will have to agree especially talking about the reverb that is more extended like you said which is actually filling and increasing the size of space. I guess this is a reason why it has such a huge soundstage? Feels like it makes everything sound bigger.

 

[Strale]

Okay I got you now mate, thanks for the detailed explanation including quotes. I will have to agree especially talking about the reverb that is more extended like you said which is actually filling and increasing the size of space. I guess this is a reason why it has such a huge soundstage? Feels like it makes everything sound bigger.

I think you hit the point! I would just maybe add that together with that reverb, also those very crisp, clean and extended highs ('airy' sound presentation) are contributing to the big soundstage. When I was switching from Zen DAC to Phonitor, increase of the soundstage was immediately noticed. Soundstage is certainly one of the Phonitor's strongest points.

I would just add that I also tried closed back low impedance AKG K371 on the Phonitor, and somehow I did not like how it sounds on the Phonitor. It seemed to me like that reverb was too much on K371, somehow dominating the sound (it became way too 'bloomy'). Now I do not know if it is due to low impedance of K371 (32 Ohm) which might be low for the Phonitor (some people were mentioning that Phonitor is not good for low impedance cans) or maybe due to slightly elevated sub bass of K371 which is not synergizing well with the Phonitor (or something entirely else...).

 

[Gggggas]

I think you hit the point! I would just maybe add that together with that reverb, also those very crisp, clean and extended highs ('airy' sound presentation) are contributing to the big soundstage. When I was switching from Zen DAC to Phonitor, increase of the soundstage was immediately noticed. Soundstage is certainly one of the Phonitor's strongest points.

I would just add that I also tried closed back low impedance AKG K371 on the Phonitor, and somehow I did not like how it sounds on the Phonitor. It seemed to me like that reverb was too much on K371, somehow dominating the sound (it became way too 'bloomy'). Now I do not know if it is due to low impedance of K371 (32 Ohm) which might be low for the Phonitor (some people were mentioning that Phonitor is not good for low impedance cans) or maybe due to slightly elevated sub bass of K371 which is not synergizing well with the Phonitor (or something entirely else...).

It's exactly what I was thinking, paired with those crisp clean and extended highs it sounds huge. Very interesting points regarding low impedance closed pack headphones and I have the Focal Celestee which are at 35 Ohms though I don't recall hearing them getting bloomy even after a 1h listening session today so maybe they are an exception.
I don't have the K371 to try but it is not strange to have synergy problems with amps

 

[oldson]

oh dear
my phonitor just died
happened on power up. phones already connected.
heard a small pop in right channel, which is now completely silent.
left channel very faint sound.
hopefully the seller will accept a return.

 

[Strale]

Ohh...too bad to hear that. I read a lot about very bad build quality of the Phonitor amps. They just die a lot. Various issues. Honestly it is one of the bigger reasons which holds me back from buying it. It is inadmissible. Hopefully you will return it successfully...

 

[Jetblack08]

oh dear
my phonitor just died
happened on power up. phones already connected.
heard a small pop in right channel, which is now completely silent.
left channel very faint sound.
hopefully the seller will accept a return.

Did the seller accept the return? I too have a broken Phonitor X.

 

[ardilla]

Ohh...too bad to hear that. I read a lot about very bad build quality of the Phonitor amps. They just die a lot. Various issues. Honestly it is one of the bigger reasons which holds me back from buying it. It is inadmissible. Hopefully you will return it successfully...

That's unacceptable - especially from a major professional audio manufacturer.

Bryston has 20 years warranty. Audio gd has 10. Just saying

 

[schs]

oh dear
my phonitor just died
happened on power up. phones already connected.
heard a small pop in right channel, which is now completely silent.
left channel very faint sound.
hopefully the seller will accept a return.

Ohh...too bad to hear that. I read a lot about very bad build quality of the Phonitor amps. They just die a lot. Various issues. Honestly it is one of the bigger reasons which holds me back from buying it. It is inadmissible. Hopefully you will return it successfully...

Oops. I recently bought a Phonitor. Do you have somewhere more information about these various issues?

Did the seller accept the return? I too have a broken Phonitor X.

Do have an idea what's the reason?

 

[oldson]

Did the seller accept the return? I too have a broken Phonitor X.

i bought from ebay member "audioclear" and luckily they are part of "SCV distribution" the main uk importers of SPL and other brands.
they collected, repaired and re-delivered in just over a week.
i had bought without warranty, so they really did provide exceptional customer service.
not sure, but i may have caused the fault in the first place.

whats the symptoms with yours?

 

[Galapac]

not sure, but i may have caused the fault in the first place.

What did you do that may have caused it? Did you have the volume pot turned up when turning it on while using a 1/4 inch jack?
That is one of the gotchas of these. Not sure why it would be engineered this way.
It best to use the balanced jack as it doesn't have this issue and you can get a convertor if needed for a 1/4 jack.
I never use the 1/4 jack and have had the Xe version for several years without issue.

 

[oldson]

my model is the SE , so it only has single ended output.
it is possible i did not have the headphone jack fully in when i powered the unit up.

i have read of this causing a problem on other make of amp but cant find the information again now.
i believe, whenever you plug or unplug a single ended stereo jack it causes a momentary short across 2 of the terminals within the socket.
most amps can cope with this momentary short but not the SPLs (and some others).

if mine goes again, i will get it repaired and part-ex it in for something else.