[ronnielee54]

Stick with ipod. IMO the difference in the improved SQ some claim their DAP's have over the ipod does not offset the versitility the ipod has over them. There is no DAP as versitile as the ipod IMO.

 

[iriverdude]

Quote:

There is no DAP as versitile as the ipod IMO.

Snigger. The ipods aren't versatile. You mean locked in? The only benefit from latest ipod's over my DAP, is storage, and a bright colour screen.

Cowon has 250GB, I guess 2.5" HD? No idea of the unit but if it plays lossless or indeed OGG I could probably fit entire collection on it, 256kps OGG should be enough for decent phones, with lossless on the computer.

http://crave.cnet.co.uk/digitalmusic...9299574,00.htm

 

[midoo1990]

Why don't you just go with the zune80/120?it has an excellent sound,simple and straight forward UI,awesome desktop software that in my opinion surpasses itunes in everything.if you are afraid of the SQ don't be because it is excellent and on par with the ipod or even surpase it(I compared it to the latest ipod nano which was good except for the plasticky bass)and it pairs well with high end IEMs.the only downside is the lack of line out for an amp.I think I read somewhere here that the 120 is selling on amazon for $190 which is a darn good deal!

 

[Shane D]

Quote:

Originally Posted by iriverdude /img/forum/go_quote.gif Snigger. The ipods aren't versatile. You mean locked in? The only benefit from latest ipod's over my DAP, is storage, and a bright colour screen. Cowon has 250GB, I guess 2.5" HD? No idea of the unit but if it plays lossless or indeed OGG I could probably fit entire collection on it, 256kps OGG should be enough for decent phones, with lossless on the computer. Archos 5 vs Cowon A3: PMP prizefight - Crave at CNET UK

Another new brand to learn. I see that Cowon goes to 80Gb, which would be great for me. It also seems to handle all the formats that people here are so high on like FLAC, OGG, Monkey audio, etc.
It mentions that it handles WMA but makes no mention of lossless whereas it mentions Apple lossless (ALAC?). Do you know if it handles WMA lossless?

Does Cowon have better SQ than Ipod/Zune? Would they have their own lines of accessories, like docks and chargers?

Thanks for the input!

Shane D

 

[iriverdude]

I wouldn't be too bothered if it can plays all lossless formats, if it can just play one (and one lossy format) that'll be sufficient. As long as you can then convert that lossless format to another easily (not alac-wav-flac) say if you replace that DAP, or you need another copy for another DAP or music server. itunes for example is pretty locked in on purpose. Yet for flac I can use foobar, mediamonkey, or flac drop to batch convert. I'd put flac and ogg higher up on my wish list than WMA lossless (being Microsoft, like Apple is own system not supported in Squeezebox) and ALAC. Also forced to use WMP in Windows which is non bitperfect, with flac or ogg you can use winamp, foorbar, mediamonkey and get asio/bit perfect no problems.

Although I'm wondering why you want lossless for portable, I use 165kps VBR OGG with my Triple Fi 10 and it sounds great, mp3 on the same bitrate won't be. I can fit 4.9 times OGG files than lossless, also with lossless battery life is reduced due to constant hard drive spin up.

I'd say Rockbox support on a DAP is a must, I wouldn't buy another DAP unless it has it. I've used DAP's where you had to sync, hate it and incredibly slow. Far slower than just copying files to UMS device, you can see it synching files on the progress bar in WMP and far slower than copying the same file in explorer. Also what if microsoft drop OS/WMP support for Zune? You'll need computer spare with old system. I wonder if my brothers DAP driver/software works with Windows 7. Doubt it.

 

[Shane D]

Quote:

Originally Posted by midoo1990 /img/forum/go_quote.gif Why don't you just go with the zune80/120?it has an excellent sound,simple and straight forward UI,awesome desktop software that in my opinion surpasses itunes in everything. if you are afraid of the SQ don't be because it is excellent and on par with the ipod or even surpase it(I compared it to the latest ipod nano which was good except for the plasticky bass)and it pairs well with high end IEMs.the only downside is the lack of line out for an amp.I think I read somewhere here that the 120 is selling on amazon for $190 which is a darn good deal!

I am leaning this way, hard. However there are only like three docks available, that I could find. There is no line out and the product is discontinued. So after my one year warranty if I have a problem, they don't exist anymore (in that format).
This all makes me a little nervous. But MAN I love the ease of the software (did I just say easy and Microsoft in the same sentence?). It SO much easier to use than itunes.

Shane D

 

[Shane D]

Quote:

Originally Posted by iriverdude /img/forum/go_quote.gif I wouldn't be too bothered if it can plays all lossless formats, if it can just play one (and one lossy format) that'll be sufficient. As long as you can then convert that lossless format to another easily (not alac-wav-flac) say if you replace that DAP, or you need another copy for another DAP or music server. itunes for example is pretty locked in on purpose. Yet for flac I can use foobar, mediamonkey, or flac drop to batch convert. I'd put flac and ogg higher up on my wish list than WMA lossless (being Microsoft, like Apple is own system not supported in Squeezebox) and ALAC. Also forced to use WMP in Windows which is non bitperfect, with flac or ogg you can use winamp, foorbar, mediamonkey and get asio/bit perfect no problems. I just chose WMA lossless because Windows Media Player is already on computer, so no learning curve. I ripped my first CD the other night and it was fast AND painless. I tried the same thing in itunes and it took about three times longer would not give me album art unless I opened an account with itunes and gave them a VISA number. I then deleted the file and tried to import from the file (WMA lossless) file from my hard drive which already had the album art. It was slow and would NOT transfer over the jpeg in the folder. Although I'm wondering why you want lossless for portable I want a high quality juke box, basically. I want to rip my whole collection just once. Then I have it at work, in the car, even use with stereo rather than playing CD's. I'd say Rockbox support on a DAP is a must, I wouldn't buy another DAP unless it has it. I've used DAP's where you had to sync, hate it and incredibly slow. Far slower than just copying files to UMS device, you can see it synching files on the progress bar in WMP and far slower than copying the same file in explorer. Also what if microsoft drop OS/WMP support for Zune? You'll need computer spare with old system. I wonder if my brothers DAP driver/software works with Windows 7. Doubt it.

Zune does worry me due to the (probably) upcoming lack of support for discontinued models. However, WMP to Zune is quick, painless and idiot proof. I have not gone to the last step of actually synching a unit since I do not yet own a DAP. But the first two parts are CRAZY easy.

Shane D

 

[iriverdude]

EAC takes a while to rip, if you want quality rips I'd rather it takes longer than zip along reading in with errors. I use EAC + flac.exe to rip/encode, foobar to do replaygain, and album art aggreator to get jpegs. Takes quite a while but worth it, and only needs to be done once per CD anyway.

Checkout EAC with accurate rip function/secure mode.

Also what if you change from PC to Mac or Linux? Will the Zune work with either?

Quote:

I want a high quality juke box, basically.

Then I'd buy a DAP with digital audio out, that way can plug into a DAC. I can use my H140 into my Lexicon for great sound. And DTS

oh does the Zune HD support gapless? That's damn important for tracks to blend into the next, live or classical albums. Rate that high up on wishlist.

 

[Shane D]

Quote:

Originally Posted by iriverdude /img/forum/go_quote.gif EAC takes a while to rip, if you want quality rips I'd rather it takes longer than zip along reading in with errors. I use EAC + flac.exe to rip/encode, foobar to do replaygain, and album art aggreator to get jpegs. Takes quite a while but worth it, and only needs to be done once per CD anyway. Wow, you invest a lot of time into ripping cd's I think I am way too lazy to do all that. Checkout EAC with accurate rip function/secure mode. So you don't think WMP, Zune, itunes, etc. rip properly? Do they regularly have problems? Like every 10th or 20th song is damaged? Also what if you change from PC to Mac or Linux? Will the Zune work with either? After 20 years I never see me changing. Then I'd buy a DAP with digital audio out, that way can plug into a DAC. I can use my H140 into my Lexicon for great sound. And DTS Oh, I have so much to learn! oh does the Zune HD support gapless? That's damn important for tracks to blend into the next, live or classical albums. Rate that high up on wishlist.

No idea on gapless.

I am getting to think that will not be a quick decision....

Shane D

 

[iriverdude]

Foobar replaygain and A.A.A. are batch processes you don't have to sit by the computer, it'll do whole lot in one go. EAC may take upto 10 minutes to rip/encode a album that has errors (it'll re-read sectors until it's read in accurately ) Accurate rip also connects to accurate rip database so you confirm your album has been ripped 100% correctly, as each album has a MD5 checksum.

Playback a live CD, between tracks you have no audio gap. On some DAP's you'll have a slight gap maybe quarter second blip between each track, and the audio is muted. It's quite annoying and ruins the flow of the music. My iriver stock firmware had gaps but with Rockbox it then you seamless blend in between tracks. Note this is not crossfade 9or sometimes called jukebox/party mode) which mixes in the track start/end with the next one.

 

[Kevin Wang]

120GB is too much. SQ is my only concern.

 

[iriverdude]

Not really, I worked out his collection could be 100GB (say 500MB per album) so want reserve space as his collection grows. I wouldn't mind a 120GB/160GB DAP either. 250GB would be fantastic I could use high bitrate ogg 320kps VBR and still have space left.

 

[midoo1990]

Why don't you just get any of these players from amazon and then return them if you don't like it?that will help you in your decision.
On another note,microsoft won't dump the zune software,they just discontinued zune players to give space for the new beast(zune HD)to compete with the ipod touch,and a new zune with more capacity(64 I think)will be released down the road as flash based player to replace the HDD players.another thing,how the hell can they close it while they are earning millions from the marketplace and they are preparing to launch movies and apps for the zune to compete with itunes!beside all that,all generations of the zune where ONLY released in the US and CANADA,while the zune HD and the forthcoming generations will be released internationally and take more marketshare from apple and the ipoZ.I think microsoft is thinking right if it is planing to continue in this route.
Cherrs.

 

[Shane D]

Quote:

Originally Posted by midoo1990 /img/forum/go_quote.gif Why don't you just get any of these players from amazon and then return them if you don't like it?that will help you in your decision. On another note,microsoft won't dump the zune software,they just discontinued zune players to give space for the new beast(zune HD)to compete with the ipod touch,and a new zune with more capacity(64 I think)will be released down the road as flash based player to replace the HDD players.another thing,how the hell can they close it while they are earning millions from the marketplace and they are preparing to launch movies and apps for the zune to compete with itunes!beside all that,all generations of the zune where ONLY released in the US and CANADA,while the zune HD and the forthcoming generations will be released internationally and take more marketshare from apple and the ipoZ.I think microsoft is thinking right if it is planing to continue in this route. Cherrs.

The more I think about it, the more I am thinking that the Zune brand will go on, just not in HDD spec. So buying a Zune 120GB is not buying a "dead" product, just outdated hardware.

Wonder if Apple is going to announce a 64GB flash unit next week?

I guess this long weekend will be spent doing lots more reading.

Shane D

 

[midoo1990]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shane D /img/forum/go_quote.gif The more I think about it, the more I am thinking that the Zune brand will go on, just not in HDD spec. So buying a Zune 120GB is not buying a "dead" product, just outdated hardware. Wonder if Apple is going to announce a 64GB flash unit next week? I guess this long weekend will be spent doing lots more reading. Shane D

ya this makes sense,the only reason i advice you not to pull the trigger on the zune if you are planing to stuff it with movies and apps and games because the graphic ship in the zune80/120 cant compete with that of the HD,but if storage and music all you care about,no point of waiting.