[Ryokan]

Please stop saying SD card can have any effect on sound quality. This is not how the Linux kernel works. IO is always done with RAM between. Unless your SD card is broken the files are read equally with different cards. This can be proofen with checksuming. There are so many buffers in the whole IO stack from SD card to decoder that it can not have any effect. Saying otherwise is just wrong. Even if you say to hear a difference. It can not happen.

This is what I always thought and have read numerous times.

@Sonywalkmanuser has come under some stick, so just to add:
When I bought a new card (Extreme Pro) and gave it a quick format in the player it sounded meh. I swopped back to my old card (Sandisk Extreme) and straight away noticed a difference. When I carried out a full format and formatted again in the player I couldn't distinguish any difference between the two, as you'd expect.
It seems to me the full format did something positive to the card, it was a big enough difference that I felt confident mentioning it.


Back on topic, it's unfortunate the ZX507 can't get the same enhancements as the WM1A/1Z but being Android I know this can't happen, still it is a good sounding player and I don't feel the need to rush out and buy one of the older models, though I'm tempted

 

[ttt123]

Please stop saying SD card can have any effect on sound quality. This is not how the Linux kernel works. IO is always done with RAM between. Unless your SD card is broken the files are read equally with different cards. This can be proofen with checksuming. There are so many buffers in the whole IO stack from SD card to decoder that it can not have any effect. Saying otherwise is just wrong. Even if you say to hear a difference. It can not happen.

Whatever happened to the scientific method? If the results are not what you expect, then it is time to revisit the theory and find out why. But the first step is to have an open mind, and to evaluate without a predetermined bias. And to keep in mind, that in something as complex as how a different system (and everybody's system is different) performs, and how each person's ears react to sound waves, and how the brain interprets the signal the ear transmits to the brain, are not exactly the same between any two people. Given all the variables, I am quite ready to accept that it will be hard to get a concensus, and that we do not have the methods to simplify this down to a simple single decision that everybody is in agreement with.

You believe in science, and I believe in science. Our conclusions are different. Why are you right, and I am wrong? And why would I be right, and you are wrong?
You have an absolute belief that your understanding is correct. I have exactly the same conviction that I am right. We may both change our belief in the future, or not.

But that is fine, and normal, as there are always disagreements, even among supposedly intelligent and reasonable people.

You are free to believe what you understand to be true, and others are also free to do the same.

Others should not force their beliefs on you. And you should not force your beliefs on others.

 

[Sonywalkmanuser]

@Ryokan

have you went through my tweak guide and done the battery optimisation removal? I think that would have made the ZX507 sound much pristine in its imaging/transients and you are already using the sandisk extreme pro with the correct formatting done. Which means you are already setup for optimal sound quality out of your ZX507.

Sony’s latest firmware really did turn my IER-M9 balanced into a live concert like sound experience. That is without modding, just with reversible software tweaking and use of good microsd card along with Hi-Res Streaming Mode, DSEE HX and DC Phase Linearizer Type A Std.

I would be in the opinion that what we are hearing out of our ZX507 is already something really amazing, Audiophile grade 3D sound.

As for the microsd affecting sound quality. I stand by my sound impressions. Others may think it is placebo, mind trickery or just minute differences. I think otherwise.

I am not profiting from recommending any microsd cards. And for me to recommend “snake oil”, it is a waste of time on my part. I have documented what I observed with the various microsd cards. If they choose to dismiss me without actually testing out for themselves, it’s their choice.

Once again thanks for really trying out the microsd card differences for yourself and sharing your actual experiences.

 

[Chainring]

You know, after being into music for years and getting lightly into the tech behind compressed audio, there's one thing I've come to learn. If you can't ABX the difference, it doesn't matter. Conversely, if you can't measure whether there's a difference between playing from internal memory or various SD cards, there's no difference.

The microSD thing. No way. Not a chance. It's ones and zeroes. I put forth a challenge. Output from your player into your computer and record the signal. Do this with a song playing from internal memory. Do it from a microSD. Do it from a different microSD. All using the same song and same volume. No tweaks whatsoever. Overlay the results on top of each other. Until then, please stop. It's like a bad joke or a serious trolling effort.

 

[psikey]

You know, after being into music for years and getting lightly into the tech behind compressed audio, there's one thing I've come to learn. If you can't ABX the difference, it doesn't matter. Conversely, if you can't measure whether there's a difference between playing from internal memory or various SD cards, there's no difference.

The microSD thing. No way. Not a chance. It's ones and zeroes. I put forth a challenge. Output from your player into your computer and record the signal. Do this with a song playing from internal memory. Do it from a microSD. Do it from a different microSD. All using the same song and same volume. No tweaks whatsoever. Overlay the results on top of each other. Until then, please stop. It's like a bad joke or a serious trolling effort.

Measurements don't capture pixie dust.

 

[bland125]

You know, after being into music for years and getting lightly into the tech behind compressed audio, there's one thing I've come to learn. If you can't ABX the difference, it doesn't matter. Conversely, if you can't measure whether there's a difference between playing from internal memory or various SD cards, there's no difference.

The microSD thing. No way. Not a chance. It's ones and zeroes. I put forth a challenge. Output from your player into your computer and record the signal. Do this with a song playing from internal memory. Do it from a microSD. Do it from a different microSD. All using the same song and same volume. No tweaks whatsoever. Overlay the results on top of each other. Until then, please stop. It's like a bad joke or a serious trolling effort.

Unless you are sharing your opinions, questions or experience with the ZX500 series, you are in the wrong post. I'm not interested in converting to your church/sect.

 

[Chainring]

Unless you are sharing your opinions, questions or experience with the ZX500 series, you are in the wrong post. I'm not interested in converting to your church/sect.

I have a ZX507 and I'm here. If you don't like that I challenge the assertion that a change in microSD card will also change the music, I'd suggest you're the one worshiping a mythological being.

 

[matevana]

Yes, I find that you have to do walkman format as last step for better sound quality.

So much experimentation done today but I guess that's what will allow for even better sound quality out of our walkman.

I'm curious as to the science behind this. Wouldn't the second formatting on the player wipe any derived benefit from the initial format by the SD card formatting tool?

That being said, I'm still enjoying comparing the same test tracks on both internal memory and my Samsung EVO select SD card. The sound quality improvement is not insignificant.

 

[Ryokan]

have you went through my tweak guide and done the battery optimisation removal? I think that would have made the ZX507 sound much pristine in its imaging/transients and you are already using the sandisk extreme pro with the correct formatting done. Which means you are already setup for optimal sound quality out of your ZX507.

Sony’s latest firmware really did turn my IER-M9 balanced into a live concert like sound experience. That is without modding, just with reversible software tweaking and use of good microsd card along with Hi-Res Streaming Mode, DSEE HX and DC Phase Linearizer Type A Std.

I would be in the opinion that what we are hearing out of our ZX507 is already something really amazing, Audiophile grade 3D sound.

As for the microsd affecting sound quality. I stand by my sound impressions. Others may think it is placebo, mind trickery or just minute differences. I think otherwise.

I've just gone through most of the tweaks, couldn't do the battery optimization one as couldn't find one of the sub menus, I'll try again later but the player sounds so good I'm not too bothered, and it says it's mainly for battery longevity when using apps.

I will format my Lexar card as well and try that, though my issue is mainly how a full format made my new card sound as good as my old card and in a test with two players I couldn't tell them apart when initially the new one sounded flat in comparison - not as dynamic. Can't explain it especially as I don't know much about the mechanics of electrical components.

 

[bland125]

@Chainring Enough of this objective vs subjective argument. We aren't going anywhere.

What do you think of your ZX507 (pros, cons, comparison vs other DAP if any) and what is your setup (you don't have to list your SD card, I will not judge)? Haha!

 

[Chainring]

DAP(s): Sony ZX-507, HiBy R6 Pro, iBasso DX 160.

Headphones: Sony MDR-1AM2, HiFiMan Sundara, HiFiMan HE4XX, Jabra Elite 85h.

IEM(s): Etymotic ER4-P (I think), Shure something or other. Truth be told, I really don't listen to IEMs much, if at all, these days.

DAC/AMP: JDS Labs Element II

Went on a bit of a spree, starting with a HiBy R5. It arrived with the back coming unglued. Sent that back and exchanged for the R6 Pro. R6 Pro is definitely a winner, though it's a chunky person AND I have the aluminum version. Stainless R6 Pro must rip holes in pockets from sheer weight. Muscle to drive the Sundara and HE4XX. Build quality is really good. I like the super clicky buttons. Screen is good. Performance is good for a DAP (read: not smartphone).

The DX160 looks nice and has a great screen. The buttons suck and the volume wheel leaves lots to be desired; practically no feedback and feels extremely cheap. DX160 has oomph to drive the planars. Glacially slow scanning ~40,000 m4a/mp3 files.

ZX507. Wow, this is one well built unit. I'd almost call it boring because there's nothing to call out and say, "I don't like this one teeny thing." It's supremely pocketable. The screen, while pretty small, is evenly lit and with consistent colors. Out of the box, performance is okay. Disable all the non-DAP related stuff and it's now really snappy. Nova Launcher gets rid of that godforsaken Google search bar. I expected the Walkman music app to be slow at scanning ~40,000 files, mostly m4a. It's fast. I don't recall if I've saddled the 507 with the planars...too many DAPs and not enough time.

Sound-wise, I haven't sat down with all three units for comparisons. It's more comparison between headphones, which ends up being more about great source material and not so great source material. Planars are unforgiving. Crappy source in = crappy source magnified. I knew this, having owned Magnepan MG1.6QR in the past. Still love planar and their unabashed ability to reveal everything. The 1AM2s are one hell of a fun jam session, cutting out the world around. Bass. Quite a bit of bass. It's not the super snappy bass like the planars, but it hits and that's sometimes lots of fun.

If I were to give up one DAP, and I probably will, it'll be the DX160. There's a cheapness in the build quality I just don't like. I hate mushy buttons.

For anyone wondering about Bluetooth range between the three DAPs I've listed, the 507 is better. I tested all three with the Jabra Elite 85h around the house. Leaving the DAPs in the same place, I walked around and noted where each would cut out. Both the R6 Pro and DX160 did better than I was expecting. Longest distance was around 25 feet with one wall in between. The 507 did that, plus added on 6 or so feet AND through an additional wall. Damn.

 

[sander93]

Please stop saying SD card can have any effect on sound quality. This is not how the Linux kernel works. IO is always done with RAM between. Unless your SD card is broken the files are read equally with different cards. This can be proofen with checksuming. There are so many buffers in the whole IO stack from SD card to decoder that it can not have any effect. Saying otherwise is just wrong. Even if you say to hear a difference. It can not happen.

That’s from a software only perspective. At the hardware side of things, there’s more invisible interactions that goes on that we cant see with our naked eyes.

How much power consumption drawn from the microsd card can have impact on the overall power available to the Walkman other electrical components like its amplifier. Walkman only has a small 5V battery after all.

There’s also the issue of electromagnetic and radio interferences that is coming from the data transmission pin out of the microsd card going to the Walkman’s digital section. How much these electrical noise affect the Walkman’s digital section(especially its sensitive clock oscillator)and how much Sony is able reduce its detrimental effects is something we don’t know.

I heard the guy in one review of player or receiver or whatever claimed that he heard difference between same file being played from his external hhd/ssd and from file being recorded on internal memory. I found the review.
Aurender A100
I will quote him.
He compared tidal, internal (2TB hhd [as I undertood]), and his own external disk.
Tidal (despite being the best music streaming service) — the most rude/crude/harsh sound
Internal storage — the most pleasant sound.
He also told us about 120GB SSD buffer, thus all music is played after being re-written in the buffer.
And concluded that difference in sound is caused by the quality of re-rewriting.


time about storage 5:57
He also tested aurender digital $5 000 vs analog vinyl player $11 000. in blind test he failed to identify vinyl. 2 times he misjudged that vinyl is playing, and in fact that was aurender, despite fact that in 99% occasions vinyl is easily distinctive from digital source.

 

[bland125]

DAP(s): Sony ZX-507, HiBy R6 Pro, iBasso DX 160.

Headphones: Sony MDR-1AM2, HiFiMan Sundara, HiFiMan HE4XX, Jabra Elite 85h.

IEM(s): Etymotic ER4-P (I think), Shure something or other. Truth be told, I really don't listen to IEMs much, if at all, these days.

DAC/AMP: JDS Labs Element II

Went on a bit of a spree, starting with a HiBy R5. It arrived with the back coming unglued. Sent that back and exchanged for the R6 Pro. R6 Pro is definitely a winner, though it's a chunky person AND I have the aluminum version. Stainless R6 Pro must rip holes in pockets from sheer weight. Muscle to drive the Sundara and HE4XX. Build quality is really good. I like the super clicky buttons. Screen is good. Performance is good for a DAP (read: not smartphone).

The DX160 looks nice and has a great screen. The buttons suck and the volume wheel leaves lots to be desired; practically no feedback and feels extremely cheap. DX160 has oomph to drive the planars. Glacially slow scanning ~40,000 m4a/mp3 files.

ZX507. Wow, this is one well built unit. I'd almost call it boring because there's nothing to call out and say, "I don't like this one teeny thing." It's supremely pocketable. The screen, while pretty small, is evenly lit and with consistent colors. Out of the box, performance is okay. Disable all the non-DAP related stuff and it's now really snappy. Nova Launcher gets rid of that godforsaken Google search bar. I expected the Walkman music app to be slow at scanning ~40,000 files, mostly m4a. It's fast. I don't recall if I've saddled the 507 with the planars...too many DAPs and not enough time.

Sound-wise, I haven't sat down with all three units for comparisons. It's more comparison between headphones, which ends up being more about great source material and not so great source material. Planars are unforgiving. Crappy source in = crappy source magnified. I knew this, having owned Magnepan MG1.6QR in the past. Still love planar and their unabashed ability to reveal everything. The 1AM2s are one hell of a fun jam session, cutting out the world around. Bass. Quite a bit of bass. It's not the super snappy bass like the planars, but it hits and that's sometimes lots of fun.

If I were to give up one DAP, and I probably will, it'll be the DX160. There's a cheapness in the build quality I just don't like. I hate mushy buttons.

For anyone wondering about Bluetooth range between the three DAPs I've listed, the 507 is better. I tested all three with the Jabra Elite 85h around the house. Leaving the DAPs in the same place, I walked around and noted where each would cut out. Both the R6 Pro and DX160 did better than I was expecting. Longest distance was around 25 feet with one wall in between. The 507 did that, plus added on 6 or so feet AND through an additional wall. Damn.

Great info, I have the DX160 too and had a similar issue from the one you had with your R5. Always wanted a DAP, wanted the ZX507 but I thought it was a little expensive and hard to get in Canada. After waiting for weeks for a chinese reputable seller, finally had the DX160 but the back was detached and the unit wouldn't turn on obviously. Tried to charge it, there was smoke and burnt smell. Took over 100 days after payment before I had working unit in hands... They had me pay for shipping back to them for the broken unit. Never again.

While I was waiting, I noted the ZX507 was available from a local seller, couldn't resist an bought one. Fell in love with it and its sweet sound. The DX160, when not all broken is ok but doesn't sound or feel premium like the ZX507. Awesome screen but it doesn't make up for that volume wheel, what a shame.

The ZX506 drives my planars at 80-90/120 volume on 4.4mm high gain.

 

[DJ Core]

I have a ZX507 and I'm here. If you don't like that I challenge the assertion that a change in microSD card will also change the music, I'd suggest you're the one worshiping a mythological being.

Dude, I was laughing at you but I decided to try this with the SD-cards I have right now.

1st one is a Samsung PRO Endurance (U1 Speed) which is the only card I had until recently when I added a cheap $25.99 on Amazon but well-reviewed 256GB Silicon Power (A1-U3 Speed).

Loaded Beyonce "Dangerously In Love" DSD on both, Played Track 2 - "Naughty Girl" and lo and behold, the cheap but Faster U3 card has better dynamics and wider soundstage. The Samsung card makes the ZX sound like some cheap DAP.

I think it's possible the faster card loads and re-loads the DAP's memory buffer faster and this is what's affecting the sound the most. Both Cards were formatted on the ZX500 Walkman.

So since the extreme pro is an A2 app performance spec card. I think that's the key to even better sound since the DAP will be interrupted the least with faster performance in all sectors.

I'm thinking we should focus on cars that are U3 speed spec + A2 application performance spec.

Someone else needs to do a test. it's def true from my test but I think it's speed. Got a 32GB U1 from Huawei. Will try that next and report back

 

[DJ Core]

Dude, I was laughing at you but I decided to try this with the SD-cards I have right now.

1st one is a Samsung PRO Endurance (U1 Speed) which is the only card I had until recently when I added a cheap $25.99 on Amazon but well reviewed 256GB Silicon Power (U3 Speed).

Loaded Beyonce "Dangerously In Love" DSD on both, Played Track 2 - "Naughty Girl" and lo and behold, the cheap but Faster U3 card has better dynamics and wider soundstage. The Samsung card makes the ZX sound like some cheap DAP.

I think it's possible the faster card loads and re-loads the DAP's memory buffer faster and this is what's affecting the sound among other factors. Both Cards were formatted on the ZX500 Walkman.

Someone else needs to do a test. it's def true from my test but I think it's speed. Got a 32GB U1 one from Huawei. Will try that next and report back

So did some further testing. Formatted both the Samsung and Huawei card with SD Card Formatter, loaded Hi-Res 24/96 Kaleidoscope EP by Cold Play on both and they sound the same to me very dynamic and the same characteristics but slightly below the 256Gb Card.

SD Card Formatter maybe the key here. Maybe it structures the data format of the cards properly?

But the faster card still sounds much better to my ears anyway back to enjoying the music.

Will buy a U3 speed + A2 spec card like 512GB SanDisk Extreme and test again but Extreme should just about be perfect.