[roadrat]

Actually it is worth it to keep an eye on amazon as the 300 has had some pretty decent drops in the past. Not frequent but they do happen. According to the three camel tracker system the lowest it went in november (assuming black friday of course) it went down as low as £380.00.

Interesting. Three Camel shows only a $2.00 price difference in US. Meh.

 

[imparanoic]

you wonder, considering both NW-A100 and NW-ZX507 is based on android, why didn't they just add phone function with last year flagship cpu (probably good reason cos it's cheaper) with snap dragon 845 and 6gb of ram, if this phone /dap hybrid is based on NW-507 then price it around GBP1000/US$1200/EUR1100 and you have a proper walkman 40th anniversary edition, call it Xperia Walkman in the process.

 

[imparanoic]

at least if you have 40th anniversary walkman/phone, with that spec, people like us would be satisified as oppose to considering the sucessor model of NW-a50 which won't please that much people here.

 

[cwjohnsto]

Do you have a confirmed source about SRC? Sony releasing a high resolution focused android player and not circumventing SRC would be a HUGE gaffe.

Probably the main thing I find wrong with Sony DAPs going forward is that IEMs are now coming out with extremely low input impedance (Andro gold at 7ohm, Fearless Roland at 4ohm etc) that their typical ~1.6ohm output impedance can colour the sound.

Hey there!
This might be a silly question, but would you be able to point me in the direction of how a low OI can color sound if the IEM II is very low? I actually thought a low OI was better to reduce color effects?
Thank you!

 

[BurritoJustice]

Hey there!
This might be a silly question, but would you be able to point me in the direction of how a low OI can color sound if the IEM II is very low? I actually thought a low OI was better to reduce color effects?
Thank you!

You have me confused, I was a bit obtuse with my terminology. Input impedance in this instance is referring to the impedance of the headphone/IEM. Output impedance is source impedance and we agree on that part.

1.6ohm would in the past be enough for basically every IEM on the market (though ~1 was more ideal if you were looking at the 10-13ohm IEMs). An 8x ratio of input/output impedance is important because at less than 8x the potential change in output voltage/volume is around 1db.

Two main ideas are driving down the impedance of IEMs, crossover free parallel designs like the Andro gold (7ohm typical, definitely lower at certain frequencies) or new EST designs that get even lower like Fearless Roland at around 4ohm. This is almost a 2x ratio and will significantly colour the sound according to the impedance vs frequency response of the IEM.

Other DAP makers are working on this, such as the Cayin N6ii at at 0.6ohm and iBasso commits to 0.3ohm with all their mid to high end players

 

[cwjohnsto]

You have me confused, I was a bit obtuse with my terminology. Input impedance in this instance is referring to the impedance of the headphone/IEM. Output impedance is source impedance and we agree on that part.

1.6ohm would in the past be enough for basically every IEM on the market (though ~1 was more ideal if you were looking at the 10-13ohm IEMs). An 8x ratio of input/output impedance is important because at less than 8x the potential change in output voltage/volume is around 1db.

Two main ideas are driving down the impedance of IEMs, crossover free parallel designs like the Andro gold (7ohm typical, definitely lower at certain frequencies) or new EST designs that get even lower like Fearless Roland at around 4ohm. This is almost a 2x ratio and will significantly colour the sound according to the impedance vs frequency response of the IEM.

Other DAP makers are working on this, such as the Cayin N6ii at at 0.6ohm and iBasso commits to 0.3ohm with all their mid to high end players

Thank you for the reply, it is very helpful!
I did not realize that there was a 'golden' ratio for input impedance to output impedance to create a more transparent sound (or less colored? unsure what the right term would be here).
Is it possible to use an OI match device in a situation like this to reduce color from the source? Or would that add additional issues?

 

[Leetransform25]

you wonder, considering both NW-A100 and NW-ZX507 is based on android, why didn't they just add phone function with last year flagship cpu (probably good reason cos it's cheaper) with snap dragon 845 and 6gb of ram, if this phone /dap hybrid is based on NW-507 then price it around GBP1000/US$1200/EUR1100 and you have a proper walkman 40th anniversary edition, call it Xperia Walkman in the process.

Personally I'd disagree, mainly because not only are Xperia phones not the most popular, but also because adding audio components of a good DAP and the features of a flagship phone would make it well over $1500 if not $2000 for what delivers $700-$800 worth of audio performance. Besides, I like having my phone and DAP as two separate devices, but to each their own I suppose

 

[nanaholic]

you wonder, considering both NW-A100 and NW-ZX507 is based on android, why didn't they just add phone function with last year flagship cpu (probably good reason cos it's cheaper) with snap dragon 845 and 6gb of ram, if this phone /dap hybrid is based on NW-507 then price it around GBP1000/US$1200/EUR1100 and you have a proper walkman 40th anniversary edition, call it Xperia Walkman in the process.

Because the radio of a mobile phone emits enormous amounts of electro-magnetic interference which is detrimental to a pure audio experience from an engineering point of view. The higher quality and more sensitive the components the more prone they are to EMI interference, and that means more material must be used to shield the audio components from EMI which would make the device bulkier, heavier and more expensive. Also phone components and software goes out of date much quicker than audio components and software, so by tying the audio component to a phone you are actually making it obsolete much quicker.

Onkyo tried it with their Granbeat smartphone/DAP combo, it got old really quick and simply didn't age well. After a year the device is heavily discounted but people simply stopped buying it.

 

[joshnor713]

I would totally be onboard with a DAP/phone, if they could figure out how to maintain solid SQ. Was hoping that the Granbeat would've been the one that started it, but the idea just went stale.

LG continues to be the best option, though I don't suspect their mobile division has the funds to progress it (they've used the same SABRE DAC in their flagship phones for years). Regarding interference, they've done an awesome job with isolation. Get a dead silent noise floor with even my sensitive SE846.

 

[Malevolint]

Because the radio of a mobile phone emits enormous amounts of electro-magnetic interference which is detrimental to a pure audio experience from an engineering point of view. The higher quality and more sensitive the components the more prone they are to EMI interference, and that means more material must be used to shield the audio components from EMI which would make the device bulkier, heavier and more expensive. Also phone components and software goes out of date much quicker than audio components and software, so by tying the audio component to a phone you are actually making it obsolete much quicker.

Onkyo tried it with their Granbeat smartphone/DAP combo, it got old really quick and simply didn't age well. After a year the device is heavily discounted but people simply stopped buying it.

The LG g7 legit measures as well as a lot of desktop dacs, so I feel like your interference arguments is kinda invalid, and also sounds a bit made up lol. Do you have anything I can read to back it up?

I do after with everything else though. Having a dap phone wouldn't work for too long. We'll see not long some of these Android Daps last before bogging down. Just got a hiby r5 so fingers crossed.

 

[abitdeef]

The LG g7 legit measures as well as a lot of desktop dacs, so I feel like your interference arguments is kinda invalid, and also sounds a bit made up lol. Do you have anything I can read to back it up?

Ha ha my friend, you're asking a person with a bastion of knowledge in nanaholic. They don't make anything up.

There ARE a lot of posers on here, they are not one of them. I've learned a lot from them in the past.

 

[Malevolint]

Ha ha my friend, you're asking a person with a bastion of knowledge in nanaholic. They don't make anything up.

There ARE a lot of posers on here, they are not one of them. I've learned a lot from them in the past.

Fair enough, but I doubt anyone could hear the difference between a dap or a g7, besides that the g7 might sound better lol. It's too bulky as a dap and I'm not a fan of it as a phone, but man it does sound incredible.

 

[abitdeef]

Fair enough, but I doubt anyone could hear the difference between a dap or a g7, besides that the g7 might sound better lol. It's too bulky as a dap and I'm not a fan of it as a phone, but man it does sound incredible.

A lot of that would depend on the headphones also. I agree with non demanding headphones probably not much difference, but high ohm headphones would be driven better on a dap, especially say like dx220, M11, or r6pro, or r5. Just beefier amps in most daps.

 

[headfi19]

One of the problems with this DAP will be exactly the same as the ZX2 - music apps from the play store will down sample to 44k 16bit. There’s no reason for me to upgrade from the ZX300, as having Android and being able to use other source apps provides no benefit over the stock app.

but there are some android music players like Neutron and USB Aduio player Pro and they do not down sample to 44k

 

[headfi19]

I watched the hype vid for this DAP and I didn’t see Sony marketing anything like DTA like Hiby has, not that I’m a big fan of Hiby either, as they have their ongoing issues. Sony may work with Tidal and the streaming app companies, but will they do anything with app developers from Neutron etc.. That remains to be seen.



Like I said above we’ll see what Sony does, but I didn’t see them mention one thing specifically regarding what tech they will use to bypass android down sampling to 44k 16bit, or plans to work with app devs to arrange hi res file support. You can just assume that will happen, but I don’t plan to.

Sony is planning next year 2020 to have their own streaming service it is called Mora