[joelongwood]

Quote:

Originally Posted by elnero So it sounds like there isn't all that much more bass with the 5Pro's than there is with E4C's but the E5's and the UM2's do have quite a bit more, would that be a correct assumption?

I see both Etys Rule and Jmmmmm have confirmed this statement. I find this interesting and astonishing at the same time, because after a week's worth of listening to the Super.Fi Pros, I simply cannot imagine another canal phone providing more visceral bass than these. I'm sure it's possible, but they are not something I would seek out........my brains would be too rattled.
I've ordered the E4, and I have the Shure E3, and the general consensus seems to be that the E4 has more bass, but the difference is not large. Well, to my ears, the difference between the E3 and the Super.Fi is VERY large. On a bass scale of 1-10, I'd give the E3 a 3 and the Super.Fi an 11.
Maybe it's my ears...................................or my age.

 

[adamlau]

Just pre-ordered the E4 from American Techpushers ...Yes!

 

[sosslaw]

Most of the postings I've looked at seem to concentrate on suitability (read "bass") of in-ear headphones for "contemporary" music. However, I mostly listen to classical and jazz (orchestral, chamber, small group, solo, etc.) and wonder how the E4's, which I'm considering pre-ordering, stack up for listening to these, mostly through iPod, as against other available earphones. I'm not a particularly knowledgeable audiophile but I do love my music; and I'd appreciate any comment from those of you who listen to classical/jazz and have tried the E4 line. Thanks!

 

[james3shin]

could anyone post a pic of the E4's in their ear? Also has anyone listened to the E4's through the line out of a ipod via pocketdock and so on?

 

[Oliver :)]

Quote:

Originally Posted by sosslaw Most of the postings I've looked at seem to concentrate on suitability (read "bass") of in-ear headphones for "contemporary" music. However, I mostly listen to classical and jazz (orchestral, chamber, small group, solo, etc.) and wonder how the E4's, which I'm considering pre-ordering, stack up for listening to these

wisdom/ bass is everywhere /wisdom

I've had some of my most frightening bass experiences with jazz and classical, because

wisdom/ all is in the recording /wisdom

Good phones will sound good, no matter what you throw at them. They will not turn water into wine though. Or

wisdom/ crap in, crap out /wisdom

 

[jjcha]

Hmm. My ears are adjusting to the lesser bass of the Shure E4c out of the iPod. I like it when it's there, but there are times when I just can barely make out the bass lines on certain songs.

I really miss it, because it's like with my usual rig (Sensaphonics / SR-71 / Overture / iRiver iHP140) that bass guitarist stands on stage, right with the lead singer and is an equal contributor to the musical sound. With the Shure E4c / iPod, sometimes it sounds like the guy on bass is just not even on stage, he's so distant and barely audible.

I know people have said the iPod is bass deficient - and perhaps it is, but I've never really heard that deficiency with my other phones. When I swap in my vintage audiotechnica woodys, which have pretty nice bass though isn't a basshead phone, suddenly the bass guitarist is back on stage again and grooving along. I never had this problem with the Sensaphonics or Shure E5c straight out of the iPod. Now those are bass-favorable phones, but yikes, with the iPod, the Shure E4c sounds like someone set the equalizer at -40% on some bass tones.

I really like the Shure E4c. It's got great clarity and texture - a wonderful richness to the sound - exactly what I was hoping for in this form factor and this price point. Other than the Ety ER4, it outclasses every other canalphone I've heard for less than $200. While I wouldn't say it's "better", in some ways it is better than the Etys and (I suspect - I need to get them back from a friend to confirm) the Shure E5c.

But man, I am really bothered by that missing bass. I haven't figured it out yet - but it's not always missing, and often the bass sounds just fine. But again, on some songs, it sounds like certain bass is practically erased from the musical picture. And we're not talking a roll-off at the absolute lows, but just a pure lack of volume on certain bass parts. Overall, I can't help but shake the impression these are bass-deficient phones - sometimes its not so bad, but sometimes it really is deficient, which makes them, with their great treble performance, sound treble-emphasized.

Sure it might just a bad dynamic straight out of the iPod, but... um, wasn't that what these were designed for? Or at least that's what they're marketing... and was the casual "minimalist-rig" solution I was hoping for. I was looking for a high-end headphone I could recommend to friends who are casual, iPod carrying, musical listeners. But as I mentioned elsewhere, it's not the slam dunk recommendation I was hoping for, and I'm torn and might recommend lesser phones with better bass.

Best regards,

-Jason

 

[AuroraProject]

Quote:

Originally Posted by jjcha I know people have said the iPod is bass deficient - and perhaps it is, but I've never really heard that deficiency with my other phones. When I swap in my vintage audiotechnica woodys, which have pretty nice bass though isn't a basshead phone, suddenly the bass guitarist is back on stage again and grooving along. I never had this problem with the Sensaphonics or Shure E5c straight out of the iPod. Now those are bass-favorable phones, but yikes, with the iPod, the Shure E4c sounds like someone set the equalizer at -40% on some bass tones.

Hmm, thats what I want them for as well, Team Minimalist.

<Scratches E4C off "to buy" list>

 

[KenB]

I just received my new set of Shure E4C's. At first, I was also worried about the lack of bass response; then, I read in the brochure that, if the bass sounds a little weak, make sure that the earpieces are seated properly. I switched to a smaller soft plastic bud, twisted them in a bit more into the ear canal and, voila, the bass was quite acceptable. It's not as deep or impactful as my previous Sony EX71's, but pretty darn good nonetheless.

My current concern with the E4C's is a disturbing distortion (or poor resolution) in the treble region, esp. noticeable with cymbals. I A/B'd a big band recording where the drummer is playing some intracate figures on his ride cymbal. On my Senn HD650's, the cymbal sound is crisp, clear, outlined, detailed, and exactly as I hear it live (being a drummer). On the Shure E4C's, the cymbal sounds muddy, washed out, and almost like it has a crack in it. Yikes! I don't hear that problem with my former EX71's although the overall sonic performance of the Shure's is definitely superior to the Sony's.

The Shure E4C's sound pretty good to me (and only cost $200); but, has anyone else noticed this resolution issue in the treble region?

KenB

 

[trose49]

If you want bass try a pair of the new UE's super.fi.pros. You will lose a little on the high end but not much and it's well worth the extra $49.00 for all that bass. Excellent fit and comfortable too!!!

 

[AuroraProject]

Quote:

Originally Posted by KenB I just received my new set of Shure E4C's. At first, I was also worried about the lack of bass response; then, I read in the brochure that, if the bass sounds a little weak, make sure that the earpieces are seated properly. I switched to a smaller soft plastic bud, twisted them in a bit more into the ear canal and, voila, the bass was quite acceptable. It's not as deep or impactful as my previous Sony EX71's, but pretty darn good nonetheless. My current concern with the E4C's is a disturbing distortion (or poor resolution) in the treble region, esp. noticeable with cymbals. I A/B'd a big band recording where the drummer is playing some intracate figures on his ride cymbal. On my Senn HD650's, the cymbal sound is crisp, clear, outlined, detailed, and exactly as I hear it live (being a drummer). On the Shure E4C's, the cymbal sounds muddy, washed out, and almost like it has a crack in it. Yikes! I don't hear that problem with my former EX71's although the overall sonic performance of the Shure's is definitely superior to the Sony's. The Shure E4C's sound pretty good to me (and only cost $200); but, has anyone else noticed this resolution issue in the treble region? KenB

What's your source?

 

[ZackT]

.

 

[KenB]

Quote:

Originally Posted by AuroraProject What's your source?

My source is a Yamaha RX-E200 (Receiver) and CDC-E250 (CDP), but I don't understand what that has to do with the reported problem. I hear cymbal treble distortion with the E4C's bit not with my HD650's using the SAME source. I believe that the only variable is the headphone (and possibly volume, but I tried to make the levels similar). I heard the exact same phenomenon on my IPOD (where I first noticed it) but, at that point, I though the issue might be attributable to the fact that I was playing MP3's (treble loss?); whereas, I am now using the original CD for this test.

I am curious to see if anyone else has picked up this messiness with cymbals. It is an unmistakable muddiness (E4C) vs. crispness (HD65) in the ping of the ride cymbal. Do you notice it on any other treble instrument(s)?

KenB

 

[rbilsbor]

Quote:

Originally Posted by jjcha Sure it might just a bad dynamic straight out of the iPod, but... um, wasn't that what these were designed for? Or at least that's what they're marketing... and was the casual "minimalist-rig" solution I was hoping for. I was looking for a high-end headphone I could recommend to friends who are casual, iPod carrying, musical listeners. But as I mentioned elsewhere, it's not the slam dunk recommendation I was hoping for, and I'm torn and might recommend lesser phones with better bass. Best regards, -Jason

Well think of it this way--the current iPod has a weak headphone amp which is bass-deficient with this type of headphone. This is the iPod's fault--a design flaw. Given that the Shuffle does not suffer from this, I think it's reasonable to expect future iPods to also alleviate this problem. That, when combined with the fact that many people listen to Rios/iRivers/Cowons/Creatives, means that it would be a pretty bad move to design your $300 canalphones to "compensate" for a temporary problem with a particular product... right? Suddenly the next iPod, which is coming out in only a few months, fixes the problem, and your headphone is mismatched? I think you have to design the 'phone for a quality source of the MP3 player type, and expect the player to catch up. If the bass on the E4c seems deficient straight out of the iPod, then that makes sense--anyone have the Shure yet with something else, say, a Rio Karma?

I too am in the UE vs. Shure boat now, since they're both coming in at the same price point (under $200... if you don't buy them direct).

 

[bobeau]

The iPod comments had me curious... tried my friend's 3G with them. Yuck. I can totally see the comments about no bass, but the sound is just fairly lifeless regardless. Lineout w/amp is much better - but if you're buying these phones to use with an unamped iPod I would look elsewhere.

With my work rig, EMU 0404->Portaphile V2, it's a totally different world.

 

[Imyourzero]

Quote:

Originally Posted by rbilsbor Well think of it this way--the current iPod has a weak headphone amp which is bass-deficient with this type of headphone. This is the iPod's fault--a design flaw. Given that the Shuffle does not suffer from this, I think it's reasonable to expect future iPods to also alleviate this problem. That, when combined with the fact that many people listen to Rios/iRivers/Cowons/Creatives, means that it would be a pretty bad move to design your $300 canalphones to "compensate" for a temporary problem with a particular product... right? Suddenly the next iPod, which is coming out in only a few months, fixes the problem, and your headphone is mismatched? I think you have to design the 'phone for a quality source of the MP3 player type, and expect the player to catch up. If the bass on the E4c seems deficient straight out of the iPod, then that makes sense--anyone have the Shure yet with something else, say, a Rio Karma?

Exactly. jjcha, before you dismiss the E4c as being bass deficient, can you try listening to them through other sources? I don't think it's quite fair to decisively label the E4c as being bass-shy when you've only heard them out of a source that has a reputation for its lack of bass.

Hopefully your impressions will change, but let me ask you this: even out of the iPod, do the E4cs have more bass than Etys? If so, how much more? I'm still torn between the E4c, E5c, and Super.Fi Pros--I need my detailed highs so think I'd be happy with the E4c as long as they have more bass than the ER-4P/4S...however the "lively" and "powerful" sound of the Super.Fis sure does sound intriguing (I'm just afraid I'll find them muddy and lacking detail).

Also, I'm particularly interested in finding out how the highs of the UEs compare to the highs of the UM2 and E5c. I've read that the UEs have slightly more high-end, and I've also read that the UEs' highs are noticeably rolled off in comparison to the others. If the highs of the UEs are rolled off in comparison to the E5c and UM2, I just don't think they'd be for me since I wanted even more high end in the UM2.

Quote:

I too am in the UE vs. Shure boat now, since they're both coming in at the same price point (under $200... if you don't buy them direct).

Were you able to find the Super.Fi Pros for under $200, or are you talking about the "EB" model that has an MSRP of $199? Just curious because I haven't seen the Pros available for under $200 yet.