[dmt1]

I'm still trying to figure out what Lindrone is getting at with "Additional extended treble"--it's almost as if this is a negative, the way it was written. If not, my mistake, if so, I can't see how...

And Gorman, how are you finding the hard acrylic option? Love to hear your impressions!

 

[lindrone]

Quote:

Originally Posted by dmt1 I'm still trying to figure out what Lindrone is getting at with "Additional extended treble"--it's almost as if this is a negative, the way it was written. If not, my mistake, if so, I can't see how...

There's good and bad about it...

The good:
- Treble sounds good regardless of the source.

The bad:
- Sharp sibilance at times
- Hard to shape the treble sound with amp or source, if you want something that's a little less sibilant and more rounded
- Not necessarily faithful to the original recording, certainly not faithful to what your amp & source is providing.


Like I've said before, UE-10 Pro's consistency in its sound signature is both a good and bad thing at the same time.

 

[gorman]

Quote:

Originally Posted by dmt1 And Gorman, how are you finding the hard acrylic option? Love to hear your impressions!

I'm finding them great! Once they are seated in I completely forget about them. During insertion they do feel harder and colder but I manage a quicker insertion with perfect seal with them than with the ones with full-soft option. And once they are in, no cold, no hardness. Just pure musical bliss!

Now I need to update my avatar...

 

[gorman]

Quote:

Originally Posted by lindrone - Not necessarily faithful to the original recording, certainly not faithful to what your amp & source is providing.

How can you say this? What's the reference you use for comparison? What sounds faithful, for you to say that UE-10 are not necessarily faithful?

 

[wolfen68]

Thanks D for another data point in this discussion. I've always felt that both units would eventually end up as collective winners in the Head-fi world. I look forward to more future impressions.

I have a question for you (or anyone else). How would you describe the isolation you are achieving with a good fit/seal? I've had to do a lot of tweaking with UE on this....and though they sound great and I get a "sense" of seal (can hear in-head microphonics, etc.), they only block out about half of vacuum cleaner noise in the same room. I can still talk freely to other people if the music is off. When I snap my fingers, that also seems to come through pretty clear. When yours are in place...what can you hear or not hear with the music off?

 

[iamdone]

Quote:

Originally Posted by wolfen68 Thanks D for another data point in this discussion. I've always felt that both units would eventually end up as collective winners in the Head-fi world. I look forward to more future impressions. I have a question for you (or anyone else). How would you describe the isolation you are achieving with a good fit/seal? I've had to do a lot of tweaking with UE on this....and though they sound great and I get a "sense" of seal (can hear in-head microphonics, etc.), they only block out about half of vacuum cleaner noise in the same room. I can still talk freely to other people if the music is off. When I snap my fingers, that also seems to come through pretty clear. When yours are in place...what can you hear or not hear with the music off?

The best way to test the seal is put your ear (w/the canalphones in with no music playing thru them) next to a speaker with music playing at a low level and then tug on the top of your ear. This should break the seal and you should be able to hear a difference (especially the high frencencies of the speaker will become a lot clearer). If the sound doesn't change, you don't have a true seal. You can also try opening and closing your mouth and see if it effects the sound. If the seal is perfect, you should notice no change.

Even with a good seal you should still be able to hear ok the sound close to you.

Hope this makes sense and should apply for the ue's as well.

 

[gorman]

Quote:

Originally Posted by wolfen68 Thanks D for another data point in this discussion. I've always felt that both units would eventually end up as collective winners in the Head-fi world. I look forward to more future impressions. I have a question for you (or anyone else). How would you describe the isolation you are achieving with a good fit/seal? I've had to do a lot of tweaking with UE on this....and though they sound great and I get a "sense" of seal (can hear in-head microphonics, etc.), they only block out about half of vacuum cleaner noise in the same room. I can still talk freely to other people if the music is off. When I snap my fingers, that also seems to come through pretty clear. When yours are in place...what can you hear or not hear with the music off?

Apart from iamdone's suggestion, you could take an MP3, make a copy of it, use MP3Gain to reduce its volume of 26dB and then use it in comparison of the original one to listen for the difference in volume those 26dB represent. It's not scientifical, but it should help.

 

[Tyson]

Or, while you have the earpieces inserted, just use your hands and press on the earpieces. If isolation increases when you do this, and decreases when you let go, then you have a poor fit and need to get some better molds made.

 

[lindrone]

Quote:

Originally Posted by gorman How can you say this? What's the reference you use for comparison? What sounds faithful, for you to say that UE-10 are not necessarily faithful?

Well, if UE-10 Pro's treble sounds almost exactly the same when I plugged them into the HR-2, SR-71, SuperMono; meanwhile using either modded CE775, 3rd generation iPod and 4th generation iPod.... then you're pretty sure that it isn't a rendering of what the source & amp is feeding it. It is enhancing the treble extension on its own. Which is also identified through UE's own literature, correct?

So it's not necessarily faithful to the recording, but the keyword is "not necessarily", because this specific part is very subjective to what you think the recording should've sounded like. One thing is to be noted is that on various recording I notice different "qualities" within the recording itself in terms of treble's clarity and texture. For example, listening to different albums, you know they're playing a cymbal, but it might sound different because of how it was recorded. With the UE-10 Pro, the cymbal tend to sound the same across almost all albums.

It is most definitely not faithful to the source & amp, because regardless of source & amp that I've tried with it, it all sounds the same. On the good side, it's consistent regardless if you're using a crappy source or a good source.

 

[wolfen68]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tyson Or, while you have the earpieces inserted, just use your hands and press on the earpieces. If isolation increases when you do this, and decreases when you let go, then you have a poor fit and need to get some better molds made.

Pushing on my set has never improved isolation. I'm told my problem is my narrow ear canals. UE suggested I get some dental wax...smear it on and see if I note an improvement. If so, they would continue to tweak. I'm so close it's frustrating. Comfort and sound is A++, isolation gets a C so far. I never had trouble with Shure foamies, but they're pretty forgiving.

I didn't mean to interject in this thread, but i was curious what Big D had to say (as well as you all) since he had both to compare.

 

[gorman]

Quote:

Originally Posted by lindrone It is enhancing the treble extension on its own. Which is also identified through UE's own literature, correct?

I know what you are referring to, but in all honesty I do not want to start threadcrapping. As this is called "Sensaphonics initial impressions" I'll let it fall. If you wish to open another thread for this, I'd gladly participate.

 

[lindrone]

Quote:

Originally Posted by gorman I know what you are referring to, but in all honesty I do not want to start threadcrapping. As this is called "Sensaphonics initial impressions" I'll let it fall. If you wish to open another thread for this, I'd gladly participate.

Not really, all this has been discussed before.

 

[toaster]

so where's some new impressions???

 

[wolfen68]

All this talk of treble extension and true rendering is interesting. I've always found that live music tends to seem bright with boosted treble. Not my preference...but just the way it sounds. The pleasing qualities of warmth are something that's sought after...but not always there.

If the UE10 represents the treble in that way, it's possible that it's rendering in a far more accurate fashion.

The sensas may provide a more pleasing warmth and musicality...but technically speaking, that rendition may be less accurate on many recordings (and there's nothing wrong with that if that's what you want).

 

[lindrone]

Quote:

Originally Posted by wolfen68 All this talk of treble extension and true rendering is interesting. I've always found that live music tends to seem bright with boosted treble. Not my preference...but just the way it sounds. The pleasing qualities of warmth are something that's sought after...but not always there. If the UE10 represents the treble in that way, it's possible that it's rendering in a far more accurate fashion. The sensas may provide a more pleasing warmth and musicality...but technically speaking, that rendition may be less accurate on many recordings (and there's nothing wrong with that if that's what you want).

The point is actually that 2X-S provides "different" trebles depending on what your source, amp, recording are. So of course, studio recording and live recording will have different trebles on the 2X-S, same with changing amp and sources.

As oppposed to UE-10 Pro which provides the "same" regardless of the source, amp and recording.

A studio recording shouldn't sound anything like live recording, so if your studio recording starts to take on characteristic of a live recording, then it isn't faithful to the original record. If you want to make it sound that way, sure, that's a personal preference, but there's no way you can say that it's faithful, right?

I've also found most live recordings do have sharper trebles, because recording condition isn't all that optimal, and most live recordings also lack the ability to capture the same amount of bass that is present on studio recordings. Of course, I'm not a recording engineer or anything, I don't understand the philosophy/methodology to why they do what they do.