Please allow me to introduce myself...
I realize this is my first post in this forum, but I discovered you fine people through the magic of Google, and a desire to buy the finest wireless headphone system that I reasonably could. I live in a condo and have a Pioneer VSX-1124-K connected to a set of Boston Acoustics Micro 110x speakers. Which, is playing with fire in close quarters. So, I took to Google, found you guys and big thanks to Mr. Rosmadi Mahmood, with his technical information from the lab, because I happen to work in a very large test lab certifying consumer electronics. I perform tear downs, and evaluations of many products you have in your homes, and we also do some audio evaluations, as well. But, I'm also a guy who doesn't like to be ripped off, or have a bum surprise in the box. Mr. Rosmadi, I believe posted on another thread in this forum referencing how the base transmitters can be cross matched to the individual headsets. This helped extensively in my decision.
So, after owning these guys (yes...I bought two pair!) for two weeks now...and running the Hell out of them....ranging from NWA to Taylor Swift, Clapton, Queen, Billy Joel...Jurassic Park, All of the Terminators, Pitch Perfect, tons of generic talking boring movies with no real effects, just dialog, and TV....while flipping between the 175 headset....and the 185 headset!! I would like to share my opinions with you fine people for your consumption.
Okay, first things first, I bought the RS 175 refurbished from Amazon for $170, and a pair of new in box HDR 185 to accompany them. My logic being was that the base is mostly solid state, with few dials, and movable parts to break. So, if that was the refurbished component, they likely just swapped a board, and off and along it's way. Well, the refurbs showed up with more factory tape on them than my new HDR 185s, and showed absolutely no signs of wear. None. They were virgin pristine and that's a fact. I also bought the Turtle Beach DSS (first generation - not the second which is more limited in features, and expensive) for $13. More on that later. Additionally, I bought a 4x2 Optical Matrix. More on that later. All in all, I spent about $370ish for both headsets with the 175 base, $13 on the DSS, $30 on the matrix, and some cable $$ too. I think I did pretty well, and I thought I'd pass it along. I'm not posting links out of respect to the mod having to read my first post here (which I signed up JUST for you guys!) So, if you want this stuff, please don't PM me or anything. I legit told you the major details. Go Go Gadget Google!!!
So, let's get through some of the typical questions that I've seen on here.
The RS 175 base creates the bass boost, and surround sound features using it's DSP, and these features most certainly work with the HDR 185. I triple promise. I just double checked before posting, just to ensure that I'm giving everyone super accurate info. When you toggle the bass, or surround sound button, the audio cuts out for a moment, and fades back in with the change in effect. The bass boost is more of a bass extension, and seems to almost "add" bass to the bottom end, and increases maybe about 80Hz down. It creates more of a subwoofer style sound, with a kick to bass notes. The effect feels different in each the 175, and 185. It is more prominent in the 175, than the 185, however the 175 and 185 are tuned differently. The 175 has more low end thud. More on that later.
The surround sound effect is less usable in my opinion, and adds a sense of space to some media. However, it creates an odd chorus pedal effect with dialog in shows, and movies. For my non-guitar head-fi friends, a chorus pedal adds a fast resonating reverberation effect. So, dialogue sounds as if it is harmonizing with itself, and I find that to be distracting. The Turtle Beach DSS v1 is a much better alternative to achieving believable, and somewhat accurate surround sound in a headphone. Later, I will explain how to get killer surround on the cheap with these guys!
The other big question is which should I buy, and how do they sound? The 175 is tuned in such a way that emphasizes bass, and dialogue. The 185 is tuned much more flat, and there is more presence in the sound stage. The 175 is a closed back design, whereas the 185 is open back, and this makes a big difference in the sound stage, or how the music "appears" to you, when you hear it. Where the sounds are presented from, and how the overall "image" is projected. Okay doke. So, the 185 feels wider, and much more open. The 175 has a narrower, and more intimate sound stage. The best comparison I could make is that if you were watching a movie where the scene were outdoors, and you heard birds, and wind, in the 185 it would feel more realistic because the sound stage is wider, and the "source" is less discernible. The 175 has the sort of imaging that you would find in a traditional theater. The sound feels closer, and is more directional, with more emphasis on bass, and vocal frequencies. The 175 packs a punch, and the 185 is clearer.
So, what this means in how I use them is that the 185 is used for 80% of my listening pleasure. They're a very robust set of guys, and don't let the idea that they have less bass scare you. They still have a nice warmth, and growl to the sound. That can be increased with the DSS and the bass boost of the 175 transmitter! Stick with me kid, and you'll be bumpin' in no time! The 175 is what I go to for blockbuster action blow em up, shoot em down, crash that car, and rob that bank movies. Still two weeks later, I sit watching movies replaying scenes and comparing. Last night, I was watching Jurassic Park 3, and the scene where the T-Rex is rolling the aircraft and crushing the plane, blowing out the windows has LOTS of expected bass on the 175. Everything is there as you want it. But, with the 185, you hear more details in breathing/anxiety driven panting, movements, foot steps...the little stuff...but, when those windows blew out, the 175 produced a nice WHOOSH that made it feel like something exciting just happened, where the 185 purred accurately. The bass on the 185 is more accurate than the 175. The 175 acts is if it has a sub. If a bullet flies by, it ricochets a little closer to your ear with the 175, the sound stage is smaller, and it pronounces those crowd pleasing frequencies a little louder than the 185.
But, the 185 has TONS of sound, and is much more suited for music. The tone is much more balanced and music sounds clearer, and more natural than the 175. But, if all you do is listen to Dre, and Calvin Harris, then the 175 is going to be super freaking great for you. No doubt. They freaking sound like they've got subs! Wicked bad! But, if all you listen to is James Taylor, Carole King, Bonnie Raitt, Pink Floyd, basically stuff that isn't dependent on a BIG bass line, then the 185 is your pick. These are much more what an audiophile would expect. The 185 delivers clear sound, that allows you to hear nuances like string sustain, resonance of the vocals, etc. They're very nice headphones. They are also less clear than wired. I'll say this, I'm a really picky guy. I test things all day. I see a lot of goods, and I am annoyed at other people's AV setups typically. Almost always. I hate watching movies at other people's places because I'm super picky, and crappy sound isn't worth listening to. The 185's and 175's are both VERY nice, and will not disappoint. The 185's are clearer, however.
Last, the earpad debate! Yes, you can use the 185 earpads with the 175, but it's entirely not necessary and does limit the bass response. The 175 pads are a little firmer, and deeper than the 185 pads. By firmer, I don't mean hard. I mean dense. They use a denser foam, which is part of how the acoustics are tuned to best compliment the driver in the 175. I originally sought out to immediately replace the 175 pads for the 185, and after swapping them for a bit, the comfort difference is not that great, but it changes the reason why I bought the 175, which was for some killer bass! Which, reading Rosmadi's comments a few days ago confirmed my inclination about the change in tone. So, to each their own, that's my opinion.
Okay, so let's jump into the Turtle Beach Earforce DSS (version 1 - not 2!), and how this guy is going to make your headphones sound more spacious with proper (yep, proper) decoding of Dolby 5.1. The product claims to be 7.1, however it is really a 5.1 input, that is extrapolated by the Dolby decoder inside to 7.1 by duplicating the front L and R channels, and adding some Dolby magic. So, this device works via either optical or 3.5mm analog connector. It only outputs through analog, as well. The DSS does introduce a small amount of pink noise when there is no audio playing, but I've never found it distracting, or noticed it any other time than when there is dead silence for several minutes, and I've had time to sit and listen to the DSS. The optical input of the RS 175 produces crisper sound for music, but the analog jack is where it is at if you want Dolby. It's your only option for Dolby sound. So, to use this, hook up an optical source, such as your cable box, PS3, or receiver's optical out into the optical in of the DSS, the DSS will process the 5.1 audio track, and output the illusion of what is usually very discernible, and believable 5.1 audio. I tested the DSS by playing the THX test in Terminator 2, which allowed me to switch through all 7.1 virtual channels, and the sound felt like it was coming from behind on the rear channels. They use early reflections, and a bunch of psycho acoustics, and it works reasonably well.
You'll want to rig the 4X2 matrix to accept all of your optical inputs (up to four). It has 2 outputs, one of which you can connect directly to the 175 base, and the other to the Turtle Beach DSS. It also comes with a remote that allows any input to any output. I got the ViewHD VHD-SM4X2.
Now, if you have a PS3, what you can do is enable optical out, then in the audio output, where you can select supported codecs, select dolby, and deselect DTS (IMPORTANT), and the PCM codecs that it will allow you to. The 2 channel ones will be grayed out, and will always remain checked. What will now happen is that if you play a Blu-Ray disc that is encoded in DolbyTrueHD, or DTS Master HD the PS3 will convert that yummy uncompressed goodness through your flimsy optical cable into regular Dolby Digital 5.1, and the DSS will create a Dolby Headphones track. Of course, you will not be getting the true fidelity of the uncompressed audio, however it most certainly sounds better than using the Dolby Digital EX 5.1 track that is available because the uncompressed audio has a higher bitrate to start, the DSS has more to work with, and produces better quality sound.
One caution, the analog input gets overdriven very easily, and will result in a distorted sound. So, watch your levels. If trying to connect an analog source to the RS 175 base (such as the DSS), turn your source volume down, and the headphone volume to maximum. Slowly increase the volume on your source (the DSS, ipod, walkman, other analog stuff) until it is suitably loud, without distortion. It may take your a few adjustments, and I found with the DSS, I did not need much master volume. I am at about 11 o'clock on the volume knob, which is about 45%. Like I said, I found the 175 overdrives easily, as it has it's own amp, and DSP. So, just keep that in mind while setting things up. Less is more with these, and same goes for the bass boost on the DSS. I use about one full turn of the dial. (The DSS bass boost can do up to 3 spins of the dial.)
Okay doke. So, I hope this helps out some people. I sure know I spent a ton of time sorting out what works best with what, and I hope this saves everyone a lot of stress. Anyhow, hope this helps!
