Sennheiser Momentum 2.0 and Wireless!

[Simon1705]

I wrote Sennheiser Nordic an email yesterday. Let's see what they say. Unfortunately, I agree that the stuttering is an engineering flaw of some kind as so many of M2 Wireless owners report having it. I'll keep you posted, if they reply at all.

Yes and yes, see my impressions further back.

Out of curiosity, do any of you plan on returning/exchanging your M2 Wireless? Because I'm currently weighing the inconvenience of an exchange, but I'm skeptical of whether a new unit would improve this issue.

 

[remsan]

I ordered mine today. Over the ear. Can't wait!
 
I currently have the Sennheiser HD 25-1 II for home use, and for commuting/travel I use Sennheiser CX 275 (earbuds). I was a bit hesitant at first, however I see this purchase as an investment. I really like the sound in the HD-25's - so I hope the Momentum's Wireless will sound just as good, if not better. 

 

[cehowardNote3]

  So I've used the M2 Wireless for about a weeks and a half now. 
 
1) Whenever the headphones are on, there is a slight hiss in the background. I assume it's from the ANC circuitry. The hiss is noticeable even with music playing (Tested on LG G3 and MBA 2103 with 10.10.2). .Anyone else noticed this?
 
2) When the headphones are fully charged, the BT cut-outs with APTX enabled go away after some time, 2-5 minutes or so. But when you pause and play again, the stuttering returns. 
 
3) Turning off the APTX eliminates the stuttering. 
 
4) any strong (close positioning of router) Wi-fi or LTE interference the BT stuttering more frequent.
 
Would like to hear other comments. Has anyone used these HP with Xperia Z3? Any BT stuttering on that phone? Thanks! 

 

On the aptx error, have you tried different sources that support aptx, or did the stuttering come from only ONE source, such as only one smartphone?  Because if that is the case, it could be  possible that the stuttering may or may not be there if another aptx supporting device is used.. Such a Samsung aptx supporting tablet or another aptx supporting smartphone..

 

[Simon1705]

I've tried my MBA mid 2013 with OSX 10.10.2 (as I understand, it does support APTX) and there is no stuttering.
 
However, with a mobile phone with Android, there is... LG G3 with various ROMS, Xperia Z3 with 4.4.4; about to try it with Xperia Z1C. 
 
I also use Backbeat FIT, but they do not seems to support AptX, just some custom SBC codec (and M2 have no issues without AptX as well).
 
I also wonder if Jawbone UP24 is the cause of interference, though it only syncs couple times an hour and not every 10 seconds when the stuttering occurs. 
 
Will update as I get new info by trial and error
 
EDIT: Can confirm no stuttering with Galaxy S4 with APTX.

 

[samandhi]

  I've tried my MBA mid 2013 with OSX 10.10.2 (as I understand, it does support APTX) and there is no stuttering.
 
However, with a mobile phone with Android, there is... LG G3 with various ROMS, Xperia Z3 with 4.4.4; about to try it with Xperia Z1C. 
 
I also use Backbeat FIT, but they do not seems to support AptX, just some custom SBC codec (and M2 have no issues without AptX as well).
 
I also wonder if Jawbone UP24 is the cause of interference, though it only syncs couple times an hour and not every 10 seconds when the stuttering occurs. 
 
Will update as I get new info by trial and error
 
EDIT: Can confirm no stuttering with Galaxy S4 with APTX.

  I have now tried BT connection with the devices as follows:
 

1. Galaxy Note 3
2. Galaxy Note 2
3. Galaxy Gear 2 (BT from watch to HP)
4. Galaxy Note 10.1 (2014)
5. Asus G750JM (gaming rig)
6. Asus G73JH (gaming rig)
7. and Asus G50 (old gaming rig)
8. iPod Touch (newest)
9. iPod Nano (newest)
10. iPhone 5s

 
  Of those devices only the Samsung devices (except the watch) support Apt-X, but I wanted to see what was what with connections.... I found that of the Apt-X devices none of them stuttered for me at all, except when using Mediamonkey media player. I noticed stutter WITH a cord with this player, though, so this one I ruled out altogether. There was no issues usiing the stock players, or Google Play Music (streaming, and from card). 
 
  There was no stutter of any kind using the laptops, but to fair, i was indoors the whole time with them. I WAS able to move around the house freely without connection errors. I moved maybe a total of 40ish ft away at any given time. 
 
  No problem with the iDevices at all (other than they sound like crap heh). 
 
  I wonder if maybe some of the people that are having stutter issues when using their phones might have their music stored on a slower card, and this could be a result of a reading problem?????? Just a thought. I only use class 10 cards in mine. But since I can't really reproduce any issues, I can't find a common problem here...

 

[yangyongjun]

To be fair, I haven't had any major stuttering problems with my PC. But in addition to my Z3, I've tested my M2 Wireless with my Lumia 925 and Lumia 800, both of which do not support aptX and I still have stuttering issues. In terms of storage, my Z3's music is on an SD card but my Lumias only have onboard storage so I don't see that as a factor.

 

[Ahzari]

So I've had some drop outs with my M2 wireless as well, to be fair I had a similar experience with my B&O H8; so it seams like this is not a uncommon problem with these high end ANC wireless headphones.
Ive actually decided to send back the Sennheisers though.. while the sound quality is better, they were just too big to walk around with I felt like the H8s are more portable and I prefer the modern look to the Momentums retro look.

 

[samandhi]

  To be fair, I haven't had any major stuttering problems with my PC. But in addition to my Z3, I've tested my M2 Wireless with my Lumia 925 and Lumia 800, both of which do not support aptX and I still have stuttering issues. In terms of storage, my Z3's music is on an SD card but my Lumias only have onboard storage so I don't see that as a factor.

  I know some have said that they use the same source with other Apt-X headphones, so I can't really think of anything else that might be common amongst all the users having issues with the BT... Maybe there are some batch runs of production that just didn't get the quality "once over" that others might have?????? I hate to think of Sennheiser that way, but some are just not having any issues at all... I got mine from Sennheiser directly (before actual release I think). Are there people that got theirs at the beginning of last month (or even before) that are having these issues?

 

[Sennheiser]

Hi guys,
 
I've shared some of the recent concerns regarding Momentum Wireless with the product manager and below's his response:
 
1. ANC hiss - Unless a user has super sensitive hearing, the hiss should not be 'noticeable'. If you were to compare against other competitive ANC products, we've managed to keep the hiss on Momentum Wireless to a very low level. If it's really too loud, we recommend that you send your unit to any of our service centers to be checked for any electronic faults. 
 
2. BT signal drop-outs / stuttering / interference - Yes, there is a difference in performance between indoor and outdoor use. In an indoor environment, the Momentum wireless should perform excellently even with cross body usage. The performance may drop in an outdoor environment - external radio frequency spectrum (mobile waves, microwaves, wifi broadcast, any RF, etc...) may interfere with the headphones' reception. Do bear in mind that this is not unique to the Momentum Wireless. 
 
3. For aptX performance issue, this could be due to Android OS and other handset manufacturing specifications. The next software update should rectify this bug but do note that with each new version of Android OS released, there may still be some kind of glitches. 

 

[kayza]

Hi guys,

3. For aptX performance issue, this could be due to Android OS and other handset manufacturing specifications. The next software update should rectify this bug but do note that with each new version of Android OS released, there may still be some kind of glitches. 

Thank you for your response.
Regarding #3, you mentioned 'the next software update.' Are you referring to an update for momentum wireless via usb, or are you referring to the next Android, 5.0 Lollipop? I am thinking the latter given the rest of your sentence, but manufacturers very often disclaim things such as compatibility issues with varying android versions, etc.

Thanks!

 

[Yappadappadu]

Quote:

  2. BT signal drop-outs / stuttering / interference - Yes, there is a difference in performance between indoor and outdoor use. In an indoor environment, the Momentum wireless should perform excellently even with cross body usage. The performance may drop in an outdoor environment - external radio frequency spectrum (mobile waves, microwaves, wifi broadcast, any RF, etc...) may interfere with the headphones' reception. Do bear in mind that this is not unique to the Momentum Wireless. 

Thanks for forwarding the issues, but considering the last sentence, I am not too sure what to think about that statement.
Sounds like he doesn't want to admit that this is a problem that specifically affects the Momentum Wireless, considering the fact that there are other BT headphones that don't have them, or at least not to the same extent, starting with Sennheiser's own MM450 On-Ears or the Plantronics Backbeat Pro. Both headphones that I have here. This is not an general issue. Go to other BT headphones threads and see if you see anyone complaing about BT connection issues.
 
Still not sure whether I'll try a replacement or directly ask for a refund. Such a shame, since I love the premium look and the folding function of the Momentum Wireless. They could be my perfect travel partner if not for those BT connection issues.

 

[aertoria]

does wireless thing make sacrifice to sound quality?

 

[jagwap]

  does wireless thing make sacrifice to sound quality?

Of course and here's why:  Bluetooth is a format designed for phone hands-free earpieces not music.  It is a compressed format like mp3 and AAC.  ABTX compression is designed to specifically fit the limited bandwidth of bluetooth and is optimised for music.  It is pretty good, but is only available to products with a bluetooth chipset from the manufacturer who own the licence: CSR.  That is why the iPhone, amongst others, doesn't have APTX.
 
Bluetooth is also band limited to 48kHz sampling rate, but will be 44.1kHz from a phone.  This ensures that the highest frequency bluetooth can pass is 22kHz.  So all the lossless 96kHz/192kHz files will be sample rate converted, and data compressed 5:1 or more when sent over bluetooth.
 
If you want fidelity, lossless hi res files then hardwire the headphones.  Bluetooth is convenient.  I am considering it purely because my one year old likes grabing the cables.

 

[obeliever]

Could someone please tell me should i upgrade to Momentum 2.0 (wired)(over-ear) from Phlilps Fidelo L1?
Does the M2 a lot better than the original Momentum??

 

[Wertzius]

  Of course and here's why:  Bluetooth is a format designed for phone hands-free earpieces not music.  It is a compressed format like mp3 and AAC.  ABTX compression is designed to specifically fit the limited bandwidth of bluetooth and is optimised for music.  It is pretty good, but is only available to products with a bluetooth chipset from the manufacturer who own the licence: CSR.  That is why the iPhone, amongst others, doesn't have APTX.
 
Bluetooth is also band limited to 48kHz sampling rate, but will be 44.1kHz from a phone.  This ensures that the highest frequency bluetooth can pass is 22kHz.  So all the lossless 96kHz/192kHz files will be sample rate converted, and data compressed 5:1 or more when sent over bluetooth.
 
If you want fidelity, lossless hi res files then hardwire the headphones.  Bluetooth is convenient.  I am considering it purely because my one year old likes grabing the cables.

That is only partly true. There are also other chipsets with aptX support, for example from Broadcom. In this case only the codec is licensed from CSR.
 
IOs devices doesn't support aptX because the power consumption is higher than AAC. And Apple knows what is the best for their customers...