[Mike F]

 

  Has any one who owns, or who has heard at any length, the HD800 running balanced from a HDVA600 or HDVD800 listened to the HD800S balanced on either of those amps?
   
  The Senn amps are well known to complement the HD800, already smoothing the treble and giving more body and bass to the sound, so I'd be interested in whether the changes that the HD800S brings are more or less noticeable on those amps.

 


I haven't heard the HD800S with the amp but I have spent a bit of time with the classic and HDVA 600. It isn't really that the treble is smoothed, it is that the bass response is tighter and mids are more prominent than some other amps. Senn amps are not the only ones to do this either. Because they match the tricky impedance of the headphones quite well, you get a better overall frequency response, which might make it sound like smoother treble, but I would say it is a slightly warmer or fuller presentation then say a Lehmann BCL. Since the impedance issues are identical on the S, I would be surprised if the amp didn't sound equally good with the S. Actually maybe even better since the S seems to be better in general with SS than the classic.

Hopefully soon someone will post a more definitive answer.

 
Thanks! Let's hope that someone will chime in. There must be someone who has the HD800 HDVD800 who will try the HD800S at some point, if it hasn't already happened.

 

[monkuboy]

  Well finally after what seems like an eternity I got the chance to sit down and do a side by side comparison between the new HD800S and my very own HD800s (no mods just in case you were wondering) . I got to spend some time listening to a couple of my all time favourite albums several times through on each and well...............
 
There is a difference but not a big one and probably less than I was expecting having seen a number of reviews by others (much more experienced than me) on this august web site. The difference at the top end felt as if treble shimmer was gone but not any decrease in treble output or energy. Let me be up front here and say that I have never found the HD800 too bright or thin or peaky or whatever other ills the infamous 6kHz spike is supposed to create.  So maybe I am biased, but on that aspect I had no to conclude no preference for either headphone.
 
I would also say there was no discernible difference in stage width, depth or imaging that I could hear, and so once again I had no preference for one over the other.
 
Midranges to me seemed equally neutral although perhaps a tiny closer to absolute accuracy with the 800S but I'm not sure I would have picked it blind every time out of 10.
 
Bass was marginally in favour of the 800S with a slightly better extension but really marginal.
 
Overall the differences were so minimal that it would not cause me to trade in my HD800s for the HD800S. If I was choosing one without already having an HD800 then it would be a tricky choice and I might well go for the 800S as it offers the balanced cable at a saving.
 
So I am a bit surprised in one sense and yet happy in another. It does now make me think that buying a second pair of HD800s for my second system at a bargain reduced price would be a plan and to replace my current HD700s.........

 
Thank you for the review.  I just got my HD800 a few days ago and during my initial listening, I don't get any impression of them being too bright or thin or peaky either in the upper range. They are brighter than my HD650's but then those are warm-sounding headphones. I was debating on whether or not to get the 800S but went for the original 800.  Your review makes me feel good about my choice, especially since I don't feel they are too bright. 

 

[monkuboy]

Question about balanced cables: Is it worthwhile to replace the stock cable with a balanced 4-pin one?  I have the original 800 but figured the answer would apply to this as well as an 800S.  The amp is an Oppo HA-1. What, if any, would be beneficial to move to a balanced connection? 

 

[Dadracer]

  Question about balanced cables: Is it worthwhile to replace the stock cable with a balanced 4-pin one?  I have the original 800 but figured the answer would apply to this as well as an 800S.  The amp is an Oppo HA-1. What, if any, would be beneficial to move to a balanced connection? 

I bought a set of the Sennheiser ones (CH800S) after trying them out with my amp. I preferred the sound which had even better focus and overall felt like all the best qualities of the HD800 were added to. Maybe see if you dealer would lend you some on a sale or return basis?

 

[shabta]

  Well finally after what seems like an eternity I got the chance to sit down and do a side by side comparison between the new HD800S and my very own HD800s (no mods just in case you were wondering) . I got to spend some time listening to a couple of my all time favourite albums several times through on each and well...............
 
There is a difference but not a big one and probably less than I was expecting having seen a number of reviews by others (much more experienced than me) on this august web site. The difference at the top end felt as if treble shimmer was gone but not any decrease in treble output or energy. Let me be up front here and say that I have never found the HD800 too bright or thin or peaky or whatever other ills the infamous 6kHz spike is supposed to create.  So maybe I am biased, but on that aspect I had no to conclude no preference for either headphone.
 
I would also say there was no discernible difference in stage width, depth or imaging that I could hear, and so once again I had no preference for one over the other.
 
Midranges to me seemed equally neutral although perhaps a tiny closer to absolute accuracy with the 800S but I'm not sure I would have picked it blind every time out of 10.
 
Bass was marginally in favour of the 800S with a slightly better extension but really marginal.
 
Overall the differences were so minimal that it would not cause me to trade in my HD800s for the HD800S. If I was choosing one without already having an HD800 then it would be a tricky choice and I might well go for the 800S as it offers the balanced cable at a saving.
 
So I am a bit surprised in one sense and yet happy in another. It does now make me think that buying a second pair of HD800s for my second system at a bargain reduced price would be a plan and to replace my current HD700s.........

It's really hard to write about the differences w/o exaggerating them. I think maybe you have gone in the other direction 

. For me, I definitely like the S better. I am starting to think my HD800s are bass-lite so the S is better in that regard. I find the tonality of the S more accurate and imaging while almost the same, on certain complex tracks the instrument separation isn't quite as good on the S. But only now and then. I think for many people who have the HD800 the S isn't necessary. If you are like me, who seems to be very sensitive to tonality (and imaging) than maybe you will want the S anyway....

 

[monkuboy]

  I bought a set of the Sennheiser ones (CH800S) after trying them out with my amp. I preferred the sound which had even better focus and overall felt like all the best qualities of the HD800 were added to. Maybe see if you dealer would lend you some on a sale or return basis?

 
Thanks. I was looking at some aftermarket cables, such as from Impact Audio rather than the Senn due to the cost factor.  I know the HA-1 puts out more power through the 4-pin balanced output than the regular jack but if the regular jack output drives my 800's to a satisfactory volume without any strain (which it does), then I was wondering if balanced cables would offer any benefit. 

 

[Mike F]

   
Thanks. I was looking at some aftermarket cables, such as from Impact Audio rather than the Senn due to the cost factor.  I know the HA-1 puts out more power through the 4-pin balanced output than the regular jack but if the regular jack output drives my 800's to a satisfactory volume without any strain (which it does), then I was wondering if balanced cables would offer any benefit. 

 
Yes, because balanced operation drives the headphones in a different way. A search about the potential benefits of balanced vs single ended will give you some answers very quickly.

 

[andromeda1954]

   
Thanks. I was looking at some aftermarket cables, such as from Impact Audio rather than the Senn due to the cost factor.  I know the HA-1 puts out more power through the 4-pin balanced output than the regular jack but if the regular jack output drives my 800's to a satisfactory volume without any strain (which it does), then I was wondering if balanced cables would offer any benefit. 

Depends on your HP amp .There are a lot low budget amps that have balanced outputs they still sound worse than a quality amp that hasn't got balanced outputs. So just a balanced setup does not say much about SQ .

 

[zappazappazappa]

  Question about balanced cables: Is it worthwhile to replace the stock cable with a balanced 4-pin one?  I have the original 800 but figured the answer would apply to this as well as an 800S.  The amp is an Oppo HA-1. What, if any, would be beneficial to move to a balanced connection?

More power, more presence . . . more real. I use the original HD800 with HDVD800  used as amp only fed by Chord Hugo TT as DAC. You might think that the TT would outperform the HDVD800  as a headphone amp bearing in mind it costs nearly twice the price but the single ended input of the TT is not as good as the balanced headphone input of the HDVD800. This combo has given me the best performance I've had from the HD800. Once you've tried balanced headphone operation, from a quality balanced headphone amp, I would  be surprised if you'ld want to go back to single ended operation - I definitely wouldn't.

 

[Dadracer]

 
Well finally after what seems like an eternity I got the chance to sit down and do a side by side comparison between the new HD800S and my very own HD800s (no mods just in case you were wondering) . I got to spend some time listening to a couple of my all time favourite albums several times through on each and well...............

There is a difference but not a big one and probably less than I was expecting having seen a number of reviews by others (much more experienced than me) on this august web site. The difference at the top end felt as if treble shimmer was gone but not any decrease in treble output or energy. Let me be up front here and say that I have never found the HD800 too bright or thin or peaky or whatever other ills the infamous 6kHz spike is supposed to create.  So maybe I am biased, but on that aspect I had no to conclude no preference for either headphone.

I would also say there was no discernible difference in stage width, depth or imaging that I could hear, and so once again I had no preference for one over the other.

Midranges to me seemed equally neutral although perhaps a tiny closer to absolute accuracy with the 800S but I'm not sure I would have picked it blind every time out of 10.

Bass was marginally in favour of the 800S with a slightly better extension but really marginal.

Overall the differences were so minimal that it would not cause me to trade in my HD800s for the HD800S. If I was choosing one without already having an HD800 then it would be a tricky choice and I might well go for the 800S as it offers the balanced cable at a saving.

So I am a bit surprised in one sense and yet happy in another. It does now make me think that buying a second pair of HD800s for my second system at a bargain reduced price would be a plan and to replace my current HD700s.........

It's really hard to write about the differences w/o exaggerating them. I think maybe you have gone in the other direction  . For me, I definitely like the S better. I am starting to think my HD800s are bass-lite so the S is better in that regard. I find the tonality of the S more accurate and imaging while almost the same, on certain complex tracks the instrument separation isn't quite as good on the S. But only now and then. I think for many people who have the HD800 the S isn't necessary. If you are like me, who seems to be very sensitive to tonality (and imaging) than maybe you will want the S anyway....

I don't think I'm understating it. It is how I heard it, in fact changing to balanced cables had a bigger effect on the sound than between the 2 headphones. But that's just my humble opinion and you should always decide by listening for yourself

 

[monkuboy]

I wrote to Oppo asking if there was any practical benefit to replacing my stock HD800 cable with a balanced one for use with their HA-1. I mentioned that their spec sheet shows better specs for the balanced output versus the regular one, but asked if practically speaking it made an audible difference. Their response was that if I wasn't getting sufficient volume then go balanced since that was 4x more powerful, but otherwise there was no need to do so. 

 

[Whazzzup]

 

   
Thanks. I was looking at some aftermarket cables, such as from Impact Audio rather than the Senn due to the cost factor.  I know the HA-1 puts out more power through the 4-pin balanced output than the regular jack but if the regular jack output drives my 800's to a satisfactory volume without any strain (which it does), then I was wondering if balanced cables would offer any benefit. 

Depends on your HP amp .There are a lot low budget amps that have balanced outputs they still sound worse than a quality amp that hasn't got balanced outputs. So just a balanced setup does not say much about SQ .

Or high quality dac amps that dont offer balanced

 

  Question about balanced cables: Is it worthwhile to replace the stock cable with a balanced 4-pin one?  I have the original 800 but figured the answer would apply to this as well as an 800S.  The amp is an Oppo HA-1. What, if any, would be beneficial to move to a balanced connection?

More power, more presence . . . more real. I use the original HD800 with HDVD800  used as amp only fed by Chord Hugo TT as DAC. You might think that the TT would outperform the HDVD800  as a headphone amp bearing in mind it costs nearly twice the price but the single ended input of the TT is not as good as the balanced headphone input of the HDVD800. This combo has given me the best performance I've had from the HD800. Once you've tried balanced headphone operation, from a quality balanced headphone amp, I would  be surprised if you'ld want to go back to single ended operation - I definitely wouldn't.

well you are amping a dac that doesnt offer balanced, and you could amp it via say GSM MK2 and use se output from that. But this just gets that silly debate of balanced versus se, there are lovers of both and engineers that like both. 

 

[Whazzzup]

  I wrote to Oppo asking if there was any practical benefit to replacing my stock HD800 cable with a balanced one for use with their HA-1. I mentioned that their spec sheet shows better specs for the balanced output versus the regular one, but asked if practically speaking it made an audible difference. Their response was that if I wasn't getting sufficient volume then go balanced since that was 4x more powerful, but otherwise there was no need to do so. 

Thats correct balanced is louder which for power hungry cans like hd800S may improve from the limitations of the dac amp in output. granted im not amping TT at present, it seems to scale it nice.

 

[shabta]

I don't think I'm understating it. It is how I heard it, in fact changing to balanced cables had a bigger effect on the sound than between the 2 headphones. But that's just my humble opinion and you should always decide by listening for yourself

Sorry I was teasing you a small bit. Humor in forums often doesn't work. I didn't see anything that you wrote that I disagreed with, except I am more than a little surprised that you found cables to make that much of a change.... Are you sure you adjusted volume levels? Switching to balanced from single ended on the same amp often results in a volume change.

 

[draytonklammer]

Had a chance to put my HD 800 up against the HD 800S at Headroom in Bozeman the other day.
Used my HDVD 800 for this.
 
I almost walked out with the last pair, but in the end decided it would not get use from me as I am addicted to my LCD-X which I preferred over the LCD-3.
 
They are a very clear improvement over the HD 800 IMO. It isn't a new flagship, but it is a bit more than I personally expected.