[kman1211]

Keep in mind the other equipment used adds to the recipe.

Yes, AKG's (at least the ones I have like the 601's) boost the upper mids while the 650's don't making them a little too laid back on SOME setups.
Before I bought the 650's I bought an ART EQ to tame that upper "bump" the 601's are known for...especially if I wanted to listen at higher volumes)
Now that I have the 650's I mostly bypass the ART and can crank them up at much higher volumes that distort the 601's.

As I mentioned in an earlier post I was doing some experimenting last week with some Players laying around and found a BIG difference in the sound with each using only the 650's.
One Player was SO smooth and pleasant sounding that I now understand why some people hear the 650's as being too laid back.
The Rock I was listening to didn't engross me yet it was extremely pleasing...it was the recessed upper mids where electric guitars lay that was lacking excitement

So... I've discovered if you use the right equipment with the 650's it's the closest HP to a perfect all-rounder at an affordable price.
And If you find it too laid back...change something in your chain.

True, I like particular tubes more with the HD 650s and some more with the K712. The HD 650 are easier to work with for sure, nor are they as power hungry as the K712. I had the K612 for a while, I found it has some grain in the upper mid-range and some lack of refinement which ultimately made me let it go, other than that it's great and freakishly neutral and balanced, moreso than the HD 600 and DT 880. The K712 is definitely more refined and smoother than the K612 but it's treble is a bit too forward and energetic on many systems. Thus why I did a simple dampening mod to them to make them easier to work with and makes them a true all-rounder.

I do find the HD 650 better in some aspects and I find the K712 better in other aspects. The HD 650 is the best all-rounder open-back I've found in its price range, moreso than the HD 600 to my ears as the HD 600 has a 3-4khz bump that irritates me a bit. The only other true all-rounder in stock form I found in the HD 650 price range is the DT 150, but it's closed and has some comfort issues. True about the system making the HD 650 laid-back or not. I find it surprising how many headphones have quite noticaeble or glaring faults to their sound.

 

[mikescr]

Hi my name is Michael I am interested in buying some good headphones, I have looked at many different brands but I'll use listen to my iPhone so I had to discard several options as sennheiser HD 650 and several of this range for what i want've seen many forums aimed at the sennheiser momentum ivory 2 wireless but really the style I do not like it I have 20 years and I listen to music whit bass or moved ( salsa,reggae,rap,electronic) and only sometimes a little ballad or songs with more acute, I wonder if I can advise some not matter much the price I liked quite the B&O H8 and also pleasing me sennheiser Urbanite XL wireless and ATH - m50x or I can use the sennheiser HD Dj8 have tod me they are very good but I don't know so much potential can them on a iPhone or Mac whit advise me or if any better have good bass and clear sound for music I listen ? Thank you very much

 

[AN94Master]

OTL amps are tube amps like Bottlehead Crack or Woo Audio WA3, hybrid would be like Schiit Lyr2 or Woo Audio WA7.

IMO the bass response from the Momentums without an amp is fairly good, these headphones were designed for portable devices, the HD-650 is not designed for portable devices so having the 300ohm impedance it doesn't sound all that great without an amp and using my Galaxy S5 it S****.
Example for what I have:

Momentum will play great from my Galaxy S5 or Fiio X1 or X3, the HD-650 sounds flat, like no life in the music.

HD-650 on my Project Ember or Lyr2 is really outstanding, good sound stage, tight deep bass, smooth highs, the Momentum sound doesn't change much (its slightly better, but not like a "wow" moment) connected to either the Project Ember or Lyr2.

Hope this helps, happy listening

Thanks! So would you recommend the HD650 with the x5+e12? Many here say the e12 is good with the HD. Or would it be much better to buy the lyr2?

 

[DavidA]

Thanks! So would you recommend the HD650 with the x5+e12? Many here say the e12 is good with the HD. Or would it be much better to buy the lyr2?

I don't have any portable amps so I can't say how the HD650 would sound with them.  As for the Lyr2, the HD650 sounds quite good with it but I like my Project Ember with the HD650 better, I think its because you can change the output impedance of the Ember to better match the headphone IMO.  With that in mind I really don't think the HD650 is a headphone that you want to take out and about, its open and is not very portable.  If looking for something portable I would try a Sony MDR-1A, Momentum Gen2 over-ear or check out the thread on the 24 best portable headphones.  If looking for a home headphone the HD650 is great and I would go with the Lyr2 or Project Ember, you could try the e12 if you need a portable amp seeing that many say it works good with the HD650, good luck!

 

[DavidA]

  I think it's cool you and your gf are both info music @DavidA
 
I always seem to be pestering mine, asking her to try listening with this tube or that tube... her standard answer is, "The highs are high and the lows are low..."
 
Occasionally she does gush a bit over the sound differences, but not nearly as much as me
 
I think if I could live my entire life in a sound proof environment with my HD-650's on, I just might...

My GF is a keeper (see pics), I'm semi-retired (got a early retirement bonus) so she's the one going to work and I'm a little like "mr mom" at home.  Golf got us together so we spend a
lot of time playing (2-3 times a week) and 1 day at the driving range.  Most of our free time is spent listening to music and having friends over for wine and dinner.

 

[Solrighal]

Can we get back to headphones please?

 

[cdsa35000]

Was she your adopted daughter first?
Where can I buy one?

 

[Koukol]

  Can we get back to headphones please?

Wait a minute!
David's semi-retired...and THAT'S his girlfriend!?

 

[Oregonian]

 
Wait a minute!
David's semi-retired...and THAT'S his girlfriend!?

That's called "living the dream". 

 

[DDDamian]

Thanks! So would you recommend the HD650 with the x5+e12? Many here say the e12 is good with the HD. Or would it be much better to buy the lyr2?

Here's my take on the HD-650 with X5/e12: the X5 has a great DAC, and the e12 has enough power and voltage swing to drive them nicely. I am in a love/hate relationship with the e12's gain switch though. Low gain is not enough to do justice to the HD-650's, and once you switch to High gain it's a 16db bump in power output. That'll really juice them and the so-called 'veil' disappears, but you'll likely find yourself listening in the very low end of the scale on the pot. You'll just have a limited range between 'loud enough' and 'too loud'. I kinda wish the bump was around 8-10db just to give the High gain a bit more usable range with these cans.
 
That said, great sound and versatile combo for sure. If you already have the X5 then the e12 is a modest outlay to really help the Senns.
 
For straight home usage I can vouch for the Bottlehead Crack and S.E.X. both being amazing with these cans. All the juice you could ask for, tube-rolling and other easy mods for the Crack to keep you entertained, and beautiful to behold.
 
I think it's a testament to the cans themselves that people here have had great success pairing with, for example, the Project Ember, Lyr, Vali, Modi/Magni, etc. Behind all is the need for decent voltage swing and power to get the best out of these babies.

 

[DavidA]

  Here's my take on the HD-650 with X5/e12: the X5 has a great DAC, and the e12 has enough power and voltage swing to drive them nicely. I am in a love/hate relationship with the e12's gain switch though. Low gain is not enough to do justice to the HD-650's, and once you switch to High gain it's a 16db bump in power output. That'll really juice them and the so-called 'veil' disappears, but you'll likely find yourself listening in the very low end of the scale on the pot. You'll just have a limited range between 'loud enough' and 'too loud'. I kinda wish the bump was around 8-10db just to give the High gain a bit more usable range with these cans.
 
That said, great sound and versatile combo for sure. If you already have the X5 then the e12 is a modest outlay to really help the Senns.
 
For straight home usage I can vouch for the Bottlehead Crack and S.E.X. both being amazing with these cans. All the juice you could ask for, tube-rolling and other easy mods for the Crack to keep you entertained, and beautiful to behold.
 
I think it's a testament to the cans themselves that people here have had great success pairing with, for example, the Project Ember, Lyr, Vali, Modi/Magni, etc. Behind all is the need for decent voltage swing and power to get the best out of these babies.

Little of topic, DDDamian, did you build the Crack and S.E.X.? and if so, how long did it take?  I was looking at the building the crack for my HD-650

 

[DDDamian]

 
Little of topic, DDDamian, did you build the Crack and S.E.X.? and if so, how long did it take?  I was looking at the building the crack for my HD-650

I'll admit I took the lazy route and bought both from Head-fi / CanuckAudioMart. The most input I'll have in building is a custom curly-maple base for the Crack, and I'll be adding a C4S mod to the S.E.X.
 
I've read the entire mega-thread on the Crack, and by all accounts don't fear the build and go for it. The instructions are very clear - I could send you a link if you'd like to look it over. Build times ranged from a four-hour session (don't try it) to a week of a few hours here and there.
 
Almost all report how glad they are they did it, and that it wasn't that bad to build. You'll have that extra bit of satisfaction that I'll miss out on.
 
The sound is stellar - warm but not too warm, dripping power, extremely close and intimate sound although a narrower soundstage than the S.E.X. It really is one of those mystical pairings.
 
Edit: If you have young kids then please keep in mind these have exposed tubes and high voltages with no enclosure underneath. Just a heads-up. I'm past that stage in life but thought I'd mention it.

 

[castleofargh]

is tired the semi part in semi retired? because I'm tired.

 

[pietcux]

Here's my take on the HD-650 with X5/e12: the X5 has a great DAC, and the e12 has enough power and voltage swing to drive them nicely. I am in a love/hate relationship with the e12's gain switch though. Low gain is not enough to do justice to the HD-650's, and once you switch to High gain it's a 16db bump in power output. That'll really juice them and the so-called 'veil' disappears, but you'll likely find yourself listening in the very low end of the scale on the pot. You'll just have a limited range between 'loud enough' and 'too loud'. I kinda wish the bump was around 8-10db just to give the High gain a bit more usable range with these cans.

That said, great sound and versatile combo for sure. If you already have the X5 then the e12 is a modest outlay to really help the Senns

I can only recommend the E12A again here. It has lower overall gain and also sounds nicer. Also the bass boost is tamed down so it is really useful at times. And yes, I own the standard E12 too.

 

[DavidA]

  I'll admit I took the lazy route and bought both from Head-fi / CanuckAudioMart. The most input I'll have in building is a custom curly-maple base for the Crack, and I'll be adding a C4S mod to the S.E.X.
 
I've read the entire mega-thread on the Crack, and by all accounts don't fear the build and go for it. The instructions are very clear - I could send you a link if you'd like to look it over. Build times ranged from a four-hour session (don't try it) to a week of a few hours here and there.
 
Almost all report how glad they are they did it, and that it wasn't that bad to build. You'll have that extra bit of satisfaction that I'll miss out on.
 
The sound is stellar - warm but not too warm, dripping power, extremely close and intimate sound although a narrower soundstage than the S.E.X. It really is one of those mystical pairings.
 
Edit: If you have young kids then please keep in mind these have exposed tubes and high voltages with no enclosure underneath. Just a heads-up. I'm past that stage in life but thought I'd mention it.

Thanks, my son is in college (he begged for my first HE-560, got a second one 2 weeks ago) so no small ones around, however there is my girlfriends dog but he doesn't jump up on anything so its ok.  I was looking at the Bottlehead thread and after reading most of it I think I will try my hand with the S.E.X. since it seems to be the best of both worlds.   I currently have a lot of free time so a few nights spent building the S.E.X. would be a good way to relax.  My father used to be a carpenter/wood craftsman and I used to help a in the shop and have built my desk, dresser, breakfast table, coffee table and many book shelves so I was thinking of using some extra Koa wood that my dad saved for me to build the box, that way it will match my desk and coffee table in the living room.