[Skarecrow]

HD650 is the best audio purchase I ever made. I bought them to replace my HD590s, and I can't imagine ever buying anything to replace the 650s. Perhaps something to compliment them (CD3k, SR225, or DT880), but not replace.

I wouldn't use them as a portable though, nor unamped. They are not nearly as bad unamped as a lot of people will tell you, but using them unamped is just such a tremendous waste of potential. I'd look at a lot of other phones (even Sennheiser's own much-maligned HD590s) for unamped use before I'd try the 580/600/650 series. KOSS pretty much has my portable needs covered.

 

[LASTGUY2GETPS2]

okay! You've all been a great help. I think I'm going to buy the A900's for stationary listening and a koss pair of headphones when moving.

Thanks again.

 

[bangraman]

Quote:

Originally Posted by LASTGUY2GETPS2 I doubt there will be a lot of outside noise. Do they make a more "non-fragile" A900 version?

Not as such. The Ultrasone HFI-650 is probably the closest to this, although by 'close' that's an arguable point.

 

[LASTGUY2GETPS2]

One more thing! How reliable are the A900's? If they break am i screwed since the company is Japan based?

 

[SteveM324]

Quote:

Originally Posted by cadobhuk One guy here wrote that HD650 are as good or better than R10,Omega2 and Qualia.Everyone here selling his CD3ks for HD650.I'm getting curious about how can a $350 headphone be that good.It would have to be immensly better than HD600,wich i used to have and thought were inferior to CD3ks,especially in soundstage and treble detail.

I hear you, I'm curious too. I had the HD600 with the Cardas cable and it was not up to the level of my CD3Ks in terms of soundstage size, precise imaging, transient speed and dynamics. To my ears, I liked the CD3Ks better than the HD600s and the RS1. I've since sold the Senns and the Grados and kept the Sonys. Perhaps there is a synergy between my amp, the Grace 901, and the CD3Ks. In my setup, I don't hear the brightness that some complain about with the CD3Ks. So now I'm wondering how much better is the 650 than the 600. Since I liked the CD3K so much more than the 600, I highly doubt whether I would like the 650 better than the 3Ks. Should I try the 650's? Anyone in the Detroit area with 650's that would like to get together for a jam session?

 

[AuroraProject]

Quote:

Originally Posted by boodi wait , only some 200hr more on the go to fully reveal seems your pair doesn't give you the scare mine gave me in the burning-in time.. didn't you still notice strange changes in the sound ?

Slight and subtle changes, nothing major. (Yet)

 

[bangraman]

Quote:

Originally Posted by cadobhuk One guy here wrote that HD650 are as good or better than R10,Omega2 and Qualia.Everyone here selling his CD3ks for HD650.I'm getting curious about how can a $350 headphone be that good.It would have to be immensly better than HD600,wich i used to have and thought were inferior to CD3ks,especially in soundstage and treble detail.

It's a funny thing, but I would have actually said that the HD600 was more 'hifi' when compared to the HD650 from my memories. The HD650 is however a much more interesting phone from a tonal response point of view. As I remarked before, if you removed an imaginary blanket from the Sony MDR-V700DJ phone, then the HD650 is what you'd end up with. It's quite a poppy, entertaining tonal character which could still be considered somewhat 'dark'. Resolution is not increased much IMO, and whatever people say, to me it's still 'just' a very good $450 phone. I've only heard the R10 for a very short period of time and haven't got the Qualia yet, but the HD650 certainly doesn't outperform the Omega II... although 'diminishing returns' is a very clear factor on low-end and midrange systems. I can clearly understand why many people would give up at the HD650 level.


What I can't understand are the people who use the HD650 in 'megabuck' systems. I've tried the HD650, Omega II, ATH-W2002 and borrowed RS-1 on a small range of high-end systems this year, and at best the HD650 could be set to more or less match the O2 in poorly matched/performing megabuck systems. On systems which were clearly superior in absolute terms, the O2 and the W2002 (in technical terms... getting the W2002 to sound 'nice' is another matter entirely) pulled away quite convincingly.


Having said all that, they are probably the best $450 phones you can buy, and you'll be able to tell this on even a modest system. Don't treat it as a $2,000 phone when choosing a source... it's a waste of source IMO. Treat it as a $450 phone... pair it with a $1,000~$3,000 source and a <>$1,000 amp and you will maximise it's capabilities.

 

[bifcake]

Quote:

Originally Posted by bangraman It's a funny thing, but I would have actually said that the HD600 was more 'hifi' when compared to the HD650 from my memories. The HD650 is however a much more interesting phone from a tonal response point of view. As I remarked before, if you removed an imaginary blanket from the Sony MDR-V700DJ phone, then the HD650 is what you'd end up with. It's quite a poppy, entertaining tonal character which could still be considered somewhat 'dark'. Resolution is not increased much IMO, and whatever people say, to me it's still 'just' a very good $450 phone. I've only heard the R10 for a very short period of time and haven't got the Qualia yet, but the HD650 certainly doesn't outperform the Omega II... although 'diminishing returns' is a very clear factor. I can clearly understand why many people would give up at the HD650 level. What I can't understand are the people who use the HD650 in 'megabuck' systems. I've tried the HD650, Omega II, ATH-W2002 and borrowed RS-1 on a small range of high-end systems this year, and at best the HD650 could be set to more or less match the O2 in poorly matched/performing megabuck systems. On systems which were clearly superior in absolute terms, the O2 and the W2002 (in technical terms... getting the W2002 to sound 'nice' is another matter entirely) pulled away quite convincingly.

Hi Bangraman,

You seem to contradict yourself in these two paragraphs. On one hand, you're saying that the Omega II is slightly better than HD650, but on the other hand, you're saying that you don't consider the HD650s to be good enough to use in high end (please qualify "mega-buck") systems.

Please elaborate.

Thanks

 

[bangraman]

What I'm saying is that if you're prepared to spend very serious amounts of money on your system (let's say approaching $10K) , then you would be looking to extract the maximum performance from the system, and that you wouldn't b buying the HD650 simply for the 'nice sonic flavour'. By that premise, any improvement would be a deciding factor in your purchase. The O2's for example (and I can't comment on the R10, Qualia, L3000, etc) offer clearly discernible levels of improvement. And to be honest, you don't really need a 'megabuck' system to start hearing the limits of the HD650's capabilities.


As a more direct comparison, even the relatively humble (compared to the R10 and L3000, according to other posters) W2002 is capable of outstripping the HD650 pretty convincingly in technical terms (although certainly not in tonal response in the vast majority of cases) on a higher end system, and if you are going megabuck, it is not unfeasible that you would be looking at voicing your amp specifically for a headphone as well. Bearing in mind that many posters and owners of W2002's have expressed that there are clearly superior dynamic phones, I would have to conclude by inference that they would better the HD650 by a convincing margin as well... although of course I don't have first-hand experience of the R10 and the like.

 

[JaZZ]

Quote:

Originally Posted by bangraman ...if you removed an imaginary blanket from the Sony MDR-V700DJ phone, then the HD650 is what you'd end up with. It's quite a poppy, entertaining tonal character which could still be considered somewhat 'dark'. Resolution is not increased much IMO...[/i]

Yes, to my ears the higher resolution is even the main difference to the HD 600, and it's not subtle. Maybe you should use your HD 650 more

, it seems to me that it's not fully burned in yet. Mine doesn't have any bass emphasis anymore -- which it certainly had in the beginning -- and has an absolutely flat tonal balance. (BTW, my HD 600 has more bass than my HD 650.)


Quote:

...and whatever people say, to me it's still 'just' a very good $450 phone. I've only heard the R10 for a very short period of time and haven't got the Qualia yet, but the HD650 certainly doesn't outperform the Omega II...

I also don't think that it outperforms the Omega II, but the fact that it's often compared with it and even seen on a similar level speaks for it, considering the price difference. The Omega II is without a doubt the more spectacular sounding headphone, but the HD 650's unobtrusiveness hides some qualities the Omega II doesn't have to the same degree, namely naturalness, accuracy and «body». That's why I think I would prefer it to the O2, although I couldn't compare them directly under equal conditions.


Quote:

What I can't understand are the people who use the HD650 in 'megabuck' systems.

I'm sure this has to do with different hearing (not better or worse!) and different sonic preferences.


Quote:

Having said all that, they are probably the best $450 phones you can buy, and you'll be able to tell this on even a modest system. Don't treat it as a $2,000 phone when choosing a source... it's a waste of source IMO.

Maybe a good advice for people with the same sonic ideal as yours. But I don't think this is universally valid.

 

[Mastergill]

Quote:

Originally Posted by bangraman What I can't understand are the people who use the HD650 in 'megabuck' systems. [...] Having said all that, they are probably the best $450 phones you can buy, and you'll be able to tell this on even a modest system. Don't treat it as a $2,000 phone when choosing a source... it's a waste of source IMO. Treat it as a $450 phone... pair it with a $1,000~$3,000 source and a <>$1,000 amp and you will maximise it's capabilities.

Sorry Bangra, this is not true. If we use HD650 (and 600) in megabuck systems it's just because they can handle these systems with ease. I'm not alone saying that, look around, you will see much more $10K setup around HD6XX than any other phone of the same price.

 

[Dave Clements]

Just got a pair of HD650's and also Graham Slee Solo MkIII.
Well pleased with initial results although both units have yet to burn in - several contributors to this site recommend 200 hours minimum for the Senn's.
Reluctant to decide on a set of interconnects between main amp (AVI Integrated) and Solo until burn-in is complete.
Then there is the issue of opting for an aftermarket cable to replace the stock cable supplied with the Senn's.
The whole process is a bit of a catch 22, and requires loads of patience.
Provided that your source is good, you should be looking forward to many enjoyable hours of quality listening.

 

[3lusiv3]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mastergill Sorry Bangra, this is not true. If we use HD650 (and 600) in megabuck systems it's just because they can handle these systems with ease. I'm not alone saying that, look around, you will see much more $10K setup around HD6XX than any other phone of the same price.

Yes, but is this because they are more easily available?

 

[bangraman]

Jazz. The HD650's in question have over 200 hours on them, not always with me at the end of it. However I have spent a great deal of time with the HD650's over the last few months, especially during the last couple of months when they were the only headphones I used on the vast majority of occasions. I'm not absolutely sure about the low bass Jazz, but I'm fairly certain there's a touch more mid-bass on the HD650.

 

[newguy]

I'd like to chime in my 2 cents. I think the PX 100s sound great from an iPod unamped. That's what I use at the gym and when I am walking around. IMHO the PX 100s are a great value. I would suggest you buy them first and see how you like them before you spend more money. The PX 100s sound much better than the Bose TriPorts and cost about $110 less ($150 vs $40)

At home I listen to my iPod, with an SR-71 and the HD 650s. It sounds great. I've thought about buying a good CD player but I like to move my set up around. I may not get the maximum sound from my HD 650s but they sound great to me and I can listen anywhere I want at home with this combination.