[Ableza]

Which I confirmed are clearly inferior to the balanced ones.

In your opinion.

 

[Alexnova]

He's not doing an apples to apples comparison either. Lyr 3 doesn't take balanced inputs.

Besides inferior, how? Clearly better, how? Are you using Unison USB in Bifrost 2? What's your source?

But these questions aren't related to comparing the SE and balanced outputs on the Yggdrasil and Gungnir Multibit.

 

[Clemmaster]

Blah, let me drop this as you’re clearly not receptive.
It doesn’t make your Schiit purchase any worse, don’t worry...

For the record, I have several amps, some SE, some balanced. I also tried with the Freya S in the chain, which is both.

 

[Alexnova]

Blah, let me drop this as you’re clearly not receptive.
It doesn’t make your Schiit purchase any worse, don’t worry...

For the record, I have several amps, some SE, some balanced. I also tried with the Freya S in the chain, which is both.

If you have the same DAC hooked to the Freya S in SE and balanced inputs, same speakers and amps...and you note a clear difference between the two, that is perfectly valid and beyond reproach from anyone. That is exactly the comparison to make to evaluate the SE and balanced outputs of one DAC, and to determine if the SE is truly "gimped" as some have claimed.

We don't exactly know what other changes were done with the Bifrost 2's card besides using the same DAC chips from the Gungnir Multibit. There could be DSP changes, firmware, maybe even a better power supply, which might all improve multibit performance over Schiit's higher priced DACs.

Heck if Bifrost 2 beats out a Yggdrasil, that's awesome. Only makes me even more excited what Schiit has in the pipeline for future revisions to their higher up stuff.

 

[Jason Stoddard]

Yeah, let's always add an implied "IMO" to every opinion.

But, let me (again) dispel the notion that SE is "gimped" in any of our products. As I've said before, SE in Yggdrasil and Gungnir is summed from the balanced outputs, in order to retain the benefits of hardware balancing (that is, using one DAC per phase). SE is summed with a simple 2-JFET summer, and the balanced analog stage itself is also composed of 2-JFET buffers in these hardware balanced DACs.

This is in contrast to Bifrost 2, which does not use hardware balancing, but derives its balanced and SE with op-amps (LME49724, as noted previously.) This is a completely different topology, so it will sound different (it absolutely measures differently!)

If there's any confusion as to the topology/hardware balancing/output stages/etc, the Specs tab on every product tells what's in it.

I personally prefer Bifrost 2 to Yggdrasil, through whatever output. But that's IMO. YMMV. And it's filtered by the fact I like the form factor. But not because the outputs of the bigger DACs are "gimped."

 

[classfolkphile]

What is the USB input on the (Asgard) DAC cards? USB "B"? Micro USB?

 

[Alexnova]

This is a completely different topology, so it will sound different (it absolutely measures differently!)

I'm curious how Nexus would work with any kind of future analog card upgrades to the Gungnir and Yggdrasil. No need for JFET buffers then.

Maybe that's one of the acronyms you used in your last chapter.

But as for me, beer makes any kind of perceived SE or balanced difference disappear.

 

[rkw]

What is the USB input on the (Asgard) DAC cards? USB "B"? Micro USB?

The modular DAC cards have a USB-B connector.

 

[classfolkphile]

Thank you.

 

[438555]

And it's filtered by the fact I like the form factor

Well, Yggdrasil does a much better job holding down the veneer that's curling up on the shelf of my 25-year old particle board entertainment center.

 

[grapefarmer]

I'm curious how Nexus would work with any kind of future analog card upgrades to the Gungnir and Yggdrasil. No need for JFET buffers then.

I have been wondering about the same thing. Since Nexus has been described as the "holy grail" gain stage, and we know from Freya S that Nexus also works as a buffer stage, then taking the analogue signal from out of the 4 D/A chips in Yggdrasil/Gungnir and feeding it into a Nexus buffer stage should produce both balanced and single-ended outputs without any summers. And based on the performance of Nexus is other products, the result should be fantastic. So Jason, any reason why Nexus would not work in this application?

 

[Clemmaster]

Nexus might be a bit too complicated ($$$) as an output stage for a DAC :/

 

[ev666il]

Yggdrasil A3?

 

[Alexnova]

I have been wondering about the same thing. Since Nexus has been described as the "holy grail" gain stage, and we know from Freya S that Nexus also works as a buffer stage, then taking the analogue signal from out of the 4 D/A chips in Yggdrasil/Gungnir and feeding it into a Nexus buffer stage should produce both balanced and single-ended outputs without any summers. And based on the performance of Nexus is other products, the result should be fantastic. So Jason, any reason why Nexus would not work in this application?

Or somehow get around using the 4x AD5791BRUZ and come up with their own digital to analog conversion somehow. The problem is the chips which hinders their design.

 

[sam6550a]

In your opinion.

I have Gungnir MB, Freya [original] , Saga [original]. Ageir, and 3 other tube power amps, I cannot hear an appreciable difference between the SE and Balanced outputs of Gungnir. I use the term 'appreciable' because level differences tend to bias you toward the louder source.