Schiit Happened: The Story of the World's Most Improbable Start-Up
Apr 17, 2021 at 10:02 PM Post #75,301 of 151,052

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Apr 17, 2021 at 10:14 PM Post #75,302 of 151,052
Putting a sub in a corner is louder, but it does not blend very well.
The corner will reinforce the output and you may need to turn down the subwoofer level to match. The corner is where the longest wavelength can be generated (in a rectangular room) for lowest bass. However the best subwoofer position also depends on a lot of other factors that affect room interaction.
 
Apr 17, 2021 at 10:20 PM Post #75,303 of 151,052
Take heart, I have personal proof at least some gear is shipping:
20210417_161405[1].jpg
Of course, I cheated and ordered B-stock.

Minimalist for the moment: DAP -> Sys -> Aegir -> Stax energizer. Even now, the Aegir has only had a few hours to warm up, but already sound is promising. I think it will benefit from the Bifrost from my bedroom system. I'll have to try that soon. I made a pig tail for my Stax energizer so it connects to various amps in the house with a 4-pin XLR cable. That means I can disconnect the energizer and use the Aegir to drive my HiFiMAN HE-500 as well. The Aegir is dawdling, of course: zero output is approximately 7:00 on the dial and as loud as I want it between 9:00-10:00. A bit more "cranking" is desired for my SR-Lambda. As @Ableza says, they need a bit of a kick to get going.

The Aegir, like the Bifrost, is a satisfying chunk. It is heavier than I expected it to be. Not that its density has anything to do with its sound, but it's satisfying nonetheless.

While I was typing this Triumph ("Allied Forces") was playing and made the Aegir sound thin on top and mid-forward. Of course, I remembered the Aegir was allowing the recording to sound like that. There is a better-recorded Joe Satriani track playing now. Soon enough I'll put on some well-recorded acoustic music and hear what's what. "Chitlins Con Carne" (Stevie Ray Vaughn) just started. It has become one of my most reliable audition song, and it has a great groove which is fun to listen to. Bass is recessed compared to a couple of other gear combinations I have. I think the Bifrost will be added soon. Treble and mids though... Lots of sparkle and snap with the cymbals (almost the only high frequency information in this song) and Stevie's guitar is rich and full and soulful (almost the only mid information). The electric bass was there, but I want it more "up" in the mix, more an equal partner with the guitar and drum kit.

Here's hoping everyone in back order purgatory sees the Gates open soon and their little bits of Schiit Heaven delivered.

Oh, and one of our cats is on my wife's lap right now. I had some Glenlivet avant and some Remy Martin VSOP apres. Since chocolate cake wasn't offered for desert, no coffee this evening's outing.
 
Apr 17, 2021 at 10:23 PM Post #75,304 of 151,052
No way the 2012 Mac Mini Server will handle editing/rendering 4K: https://support.apple.com/kb/SP660?viewlocale=en_US&locale=en_US .
However It CAN serve it. 1Gb ethernet will do 118Mb/s with an ideal 94% overhead. What 4K video are you serving?
I'm just trying to serve ripped UHD discs.
Oddly enough, earlier today, I noticed that if I scp to my server one file, I got 4MB/s throughput. If I did 2, I got 60MB/s throughput total for both seesawing back and forth from one going at 3-4MB/s and then up to 50MB/s while the other did the opposite.. Hijinx afoot for sure.
 
Apr 17, 2021 at 10:34 PM Post #75,305 of 151,052
The corner will reinforce the output and you may need to turn down the subwoofer level to match. The corner is where the longest wavelength can be generated (in a rectangular room) for lowest bass. However the best subwoofer position also depends on a lot of other factors that affect room interaction.
I appreciate your thoughts and insight.

In contrast, most speaker designers I talked to or worked for hated corner placement.

https://www.cnet.com/news/subwoofer-setup-dos-donts/
 
Apr 17, 2021 at 10:36 PM Post #75,306 of 151,052
Take heart, I have personal proof at least some gear is shipping:
20210417_161405[1].jpg
Of course, I cheated and ordered B-stock.

Minimalist for the moment: DAP -> Sys -> Aegir -> Stax energizer. Even now, the Aegir has only had a few hours to warm up, but already sound is promising. I think it will benefit from the Bifrost from my bedroom system. I'll have to try that soon. I made a pig tail for my Stax energizer so it connects to various amps in the house with a 4-pin XLR cable. That means I can disconnect the energizer and use the Aegir to drive my HiFiMAN HE-500 as well. The Aegir is dawdling, of course: zero output is approximately 7:00 on the dial and as loud as I want it between 9:00-10:00. A bit more "cranking" is desired for my SR-Lambda. As @Ableza says, they need a bit of a kick to get going.

The Aegir, like the Bifrost, is a satisfying chunk. It is heavier than I expected it to be. Not that its density has anything to do with its sound, but it's satisfying nonetheless.

While I was typing this Triumph ("Allied Forces") was playing and made the Aegir sound thin on top and mid-forward. Of course, I remembered the Aegir was allowing the recording to sound like that. There is a better-recorded Joe Satriani track playing now. Soon enough I'll put on some well-recorded acoustic music and hear what's what. "Chitlins Con Carne" (Stevie Ray Vaughn) just started. It has become one of my most reliable audition song, and it has a great groove which is fun to listen to. Bass is recessed compared to a couple of other gear combinations I have. I think the Bifrost will be added soon. Treble and mids though... Lots of sparkle and snap with the cymbals (almost the only high frequency information in this song) and Stevie's guitar is rich and full and soulful (almost the only mid information). The electric bass was there, but I want it more "up" in the mix, more an equal partner with the guitar and drum kit.

Here's hoping everyone in back order purgatory sees the Gates open soon and their little bits of Schiit Heaven delivered.

Oh, and one of our cats is on my wife's lap right now. I had some Glenlivet avant and some Remy Martin VSOP apres. Since chocolate cake wasn't offered for desert, no coffee this evening's outing.

just add a Loki mini / mini+ for those less-than-perfect (bass light) recordings?
 
Apr 17, 2021 at 10:39 PM Post #75,307 of 151,052
Putting a sub in a corner is louder, but it does not blend very well.
There are lots of different "strategies" for placing/integrating subs.
Floyd Toole has his approach.
Earl Geddes has his (which I've done and sounds great but is a serious pain) (first to advocate for multiple subs).
There's another guy whose name I don't remember that gets quoted a lot who also advocates multiple subs. Difference is, this other guy recommends symmetrical distribution and Geddes says random placement is best.

Personally, for me, the most important aspect of the integration is to get the timing and/or phase of the subs matched as perfectly as possible at the crossover point with the mains. Doing that makes percussive sounds really have an impact. Then multiple subs to kill room modes (I currently own 8 subs in several rooms :-O) and provide lots of headroom (for home theater).
 
Apr 17, 2021 at 10:42 PM Post #75,308 of 151,052
just add a Loki mini / mini+ for those less-than-perfect (bass light) recordings?
I have one of those... It is currently slated to go to my "other hobby den" to do duty in the country.

My Bifrost did absolute wonders for my bedroom system when I put it between my DAPs and my Mjolnir I. I will try it out here in the living room, too. I think the new living room system will get more use than the bedroom system, especially since I'll have a choice between electrostatics and planars (or, frankly, any headphone wired balanced). Besides, when I'm in the back, I'm away from everything going on in the house; good sometimes, but lonely lots of other times.
 
Apr 17, 2021 at 10:56 PM Post #75,309 of 151,052
I appreciate your thoughts and insight.

In contrast, most speaker designers I talked to or worked for hated corner placement.

https://www.cnet.com/news/subwoofer-setup-dos-donts/
I had subs for a long time, but don't now (and not for a long time). First a mono sub (Velodyne ULD-15 II which I built one summer when I worked for them). Then later a pair of subs I used with my Apogee Stages. I found some DIY boxes which were constructed to emulate the Mini Grand subs Apogee offered. I bought them, added a pair of 8" drivers for each side, and powered them with a Threshold S/500 through a Threshold active cross-over (I wish I hadn't sold that, I wouldn't be using it, but I've never seen another for sale).

Back to topic: I tried the ULD-15 in the corner and thought it boomy and one-notey. I'm in the camp with folks who believe a sub is properly integrated when you don't really notice it's playing until it's not. Otherwise, to me, it's not really reinforcing it's doing something else. I really liked having those stereo subs. Once I got the cross-over frequency dialed in and the phase set correctly they integrated well even with the ribbons. The 8" drivers were quick enough to keep up. Since they were forward-firing and in the same positions as the main speakers (in a Mini Grand set-up, the Stages were set on top of the subs) their time-domain response was in sync with the ribbons and away from the walls they didn't get boomy. Of course, the S/500 was a pretty good sonic match for the SA-1 I used with the Stages (told you I've had those amps a long time :jecklinsmile:).

Anyway, as has been said, it takes a lot of experimentation to find the right place for a sub in any given room. The latest offerings from Velodyne and JL Audio have built in DSP to try to make it possible to place their subs anywhere and still sound good. I'm interested, but haven't tried either.
 
Apr 17, 2021 at 11:37 PM Post #75,310 of 151,052
Anyway, as has been said, it takes a lot of experimentation to find the right place for a sub in any given room.
Not that long ago, it took me 4-6h to integrate my stereo pair of TBI Magellans, an Outlaw M8 and a Leon A10 using Geddes' method.
Not for the faint of heart! I took so many measurements with REW that it refused to load another one.

I try to live more healthily now.
 
Apr 17, 2021 at 11:53 PM Post #75,311 of 151,052
Don't worry. I am a born and bred Italian and I love pineapple on my pizza.
I think we have to check your roots; something went wrong somewhere down the road..... :wink:
 
Apr 18, 2021 at 12:35 AM Post #75,312 of 151,052
most speaker designers I talked to or worked for hated corner placement.
I have a REL T/7i, and REL specifically recommends corner placement: https://rel.net/room-setup/

Whatever you do, bass nulls and peaks will occur at different frequencies and different locations in the room. I use a DSPeaker Anti-Mode to smooth out the bass response at the listening position, and it made a noticeable improvement. You can also make the bass response more even by using more than one subwoofer.
 
Apr 18, 2021 at 12:55 AM Post #75,313 of 151,052
I have a REL T/7i, and REL specifically recommends corner placement: https://rel.net/room-setup/

Whatever you do, bass nulls and peaks will occur at different frequencies and different locations in the room. I use a DSPeaker Anti-Mode to smooth out the bass response at the listening position, and it made a noticeable improvement. You can also make the bass response more even by using more than one subwoofer.
I had a pair of those subs in an earlier system and room. I didn't use DSP, but instead I figured out wavelength at the crossover frequency by comparing frequency response curves (I know, I know, wavelength depends on air temperature and humidity, but Northern California is relatively easy to manage that way and this was just approximate anyway) and placed them relative to the main speakers (KEF Ref 1s) so that they'd be in phase at that frequency. It worked surprisingly well. In fact, memory of that old system is still my benchmark, although the rooms I have speaker systems in these days are a lot trickier and I depend on DSP room correction to get comparable or better results.
 

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