[alterndog]

I'm glad to hear it. I'd be pairing it with an HD650 and hD600, primarily.

I thought about getting the Asgard 3 with the 4490 card built in, but decided to just go with a b-stock Modi 3. I figured it would allow me to upgrade my dac if I wanted something different in the future (and I’d move the Modi to my work set up), whereas I would be stuck with a built-in dac in the Asgard and don’t currently have the money for a multi-but card.

 

[Sqmeyer]

I'm not a measurement guy, though I find ARS reviews interesting. No more. Also, I'm aware that there's good evidence his measurements don't mean a lot. For example, he LOVES the Heresy but dumps on the Magni 3+, based entirely on measurements. But on aggregate most reviewers call it a coin toss or fall back on slight preferences. Currowong, for example, said he couldn't tell the difference and that one should pick according to which color one prefers; Zeos said it literally varied from headphone to headphone, etc. Josh Valour said he couldn't tell the difference. However, Armin is one of the very few who's bothered to review the Asgard with the 4490 card; most either review the A3 alone or the A3 with the MB.

I'm interested in the 4490 because it's cheaper, and because nothing I've read about the purported advantages of the MB convince me it's worth the extra money. I mean, yeah, maybe it's better, but only a little, and mainly it's about preference rather than performance. With all that said, Armin's argument is not that the sigma delta chip is bad, but rather that Schiit did a bad job of implementing it such that it hobbles the amp. Unfortunately, there are so few reviews about the A3 with 4490 that it's hard for me to tell if he's on to something or if this is just another example of his measurements leading astray. He has not reviewed an A3 with MB; I cannot tell if he would find that Schiit did a better job of implementing the MB or the same. However, there are lots of reviews of the A3 with MB, and they are overwhelmingly positive. That suggests that either Armin is right about the 4490 and that Schiit did a better job with the MB implementation, OR he's talking nonsense, and I can freely ignore him.

Are you following?

Of course, sound-wise the safer thing to do would be a modius or even a Modi, SD or MB, the Modius being the optimal choice. There's no disputing that. But then we're back to the issues that make the A3 w/ dac card appeal to me: budget + space + lack of wall warts. The space issue has me thinking maybe I should forgo the A3 in favor of a Modi/Magni stack; the issue then is the wall warts (the tangle of cables beside my desk is crazy, and the competition for space on my power strips intense). And of course, I'd always wonder what I'd be missing if I opted for a Magni rather than the A3...the difference is supposed to be fairly small, but meaningful.

At the moment I'm mainly pondering desk space. I cut a piece of paper to the dimensions of the Asgard and am pondering if it fits or if I should get a Modi/Magi stack. The Asgard with DAC offers some real practical advantages: no wall warts, less clutter. I've got a tangle of cables I really want to reduce, if possible, and certainly not make larger. A Modi/Magni stack is at least one wall wart.

Not going separates + trying to save space + money = making compromises. It's all a question of minimizing them. Armin's review suggests that maybe the A3/4490 represents a compromise that is larger than the one normally associated with choosing SD over MB. Maybe.

Ah, got it. I also couldn't find much on the Asgard with a DAC installed (I was looking for meaningful comparisons between standalone and internal multibit). Since neither of your cans are particularly hard to drive, I would think that the smaller stack would work well. That being said, I have Focal Elears and really noticed a fairly substantial difference in the solidity of the sound in moving to the A3 from the Vali2. I would also add, on a completely logitical non-sonic note, that if you have a heavier gauge headphone cable and like to move around, the smaller components will move very easily as their power supplies are on the outside while the A3 is more anchored. It sounds like you have a pretty solid idea on what makes you happy. The challenge is finding a way to audition these things without ordering them all.

 

[DCofficehack]

I thought about getting the Asgard 3 with the 4490 card built in, but decided to just go with a b-stock Modi 3. I figured it would allow me to upgrade my dac if I wanted something different in the future (and I’d move the Modi to my work set up), whereas I would be stuck with a built-in dac in the Asgard and don’t currently have the money for a multi-but card.

Isn't the card upgradeable? Also, I believe that if there is a card installed, one can bypass it by connecting to another Dac. That means one can eventually buy a much better dac later on. Or do I misunderstand?

 

[Sqmeyer]

Isn't the card upgradeable? Also, I believe that if there is a card installed, one can bypass it by connecting to another Dac. That means one can eventually buy a much better dac later on. Or do I misunderstand?

That is correct. there is a switch on the front which designates card or analog inputs as your source.

 

[DCofficehack]

Ah, got it. I also couldn't find much on the Asgard with a DAC installed (I was looking for meaningful comparisons between standalone and internal multibit). Since neither of your cans are particularly hard to drive, I would think that the smaller stack would work well. That being said, I have Focal Elears and really noticed a fairly substantial difference in the solidity of the sound in moving to the A3 from the Vali2. I would also add, on a completely logitical non-sonic note, that if you have a heavier gauge headphone cable and like to move around, the smaller components will move very easily as their power supplies are on the outside while the A3 is more anchored. It sounds like you have a pretty solid idea on what makes you happy. The challenge is finding a way to audition these things without ordering them all.

One argument in the A3's favor is that I would future proof for future headphone purchases. Maybe I'll want cans that are harder to push than the hd650? Or, maybe I'll rediscover my DT880/600?

Would a Magni suffice for an LCD-2? That's what I think might be my next big purchase.

 

[DCofficehack]

That is correct. there is a switch on the front which designates card or analog inputs as your source.

That's a major plus in my eyes.

 

[alterndog]

Isn't the card upgradeable? Also, I believe that if there is a card installed, one can bypass it by connecting to another Dac. That means one can eventually buy a much better dac later on. Or do I misunderstand?

That is correct. there is a switch on the front which designates card or analog inputs as your source.

That's a major plus in my eyes.

That’s true, but there is a cost to have the card upgraded (don’t know enough to do it myself) and if I get a different dac, the one in the amp is wasted. By getting a Modi 3, as I said I can move to another set up or sell it and recoup some cost. I can see just wanting a all in one setup to, but just thought I’d put my 2 cents for getting an external one too.

 

[Sqmeyer]

That’s true, but there is a cost to have the card upgraded (don’t know enough to do it myself) and if I get a different dac, the one in the amp is wasted. By getting a Modi 3, as I said I can move to another set up or sell it and recoup some cost. I can see just wanting a all in one setup to, but just thought I’d put my 2 cents for getting an external one too.

Honestly I wish they would just offer a card that had a second set of line inputs. I would like to use my turntable with the setup but already have a phono pre that I like.

 

[ozz]

Another benefit to having an onboard card its easier to do an a /b comparison when you use another external DAC and should your external DAC fail or need to be sent in for an upgrade with the simple flip of the switch you can use the internal DAC.

 

[tincanear]

One argument in the A3's favor is that I would future proof for future headphone purchases. Maybe I'll want cans that are harder to push than the hd650? Or, maybe I'll rediscover my DT880/600?

Would a Magni suffice for an LCD-2? That's what I think might be my next big purchase.

The Asgard 3 runs a higher standing (bias) current than the Magni series, so if you are looking to future-proof (LCD-2 is around 50 ohms IIRC, but many other planars, like Dan Clark Audio's are more in the range of 16 ohms, so they need more current vs voltage), then the Asgard 3 is the way to go.

Also at some point, the 4490 internal card got revised to gen 2 (silkscreened "4490 G2"), not sure which one was reviewed by Amirm over at ASR. for myself, i trust my ears, and not just specifications. Maybe (but there's of course no guarantee) a 4493 card is in the works.

4490 internal DAC card is USB input only. modi 3, modius, bifrost, etc have multiple inputs (usb, coaxial s/pdif, toslink)

monoprice and others sell these 1 foot long "outlet saver" extension cords (and cheaper in multi-packs), so that you can space wall warts away from interfering with adjacent outlets on the power strip.

...and two more things, the Asgard 3 and Magnius (the mid-size chassis) have the nicer Alps RK27 "blue beauty" volume pot (better channel tracking at lower volumes). If you have the budget, consider Modius an Magnius as a stack ($398 stack price)

 

[tincanear]

Honestly I wish they would just offer a card that had a second set of line inputs. I would like to use my turntable with the setup but already have a phono pre that I like.

@Jason Stoddard from what i recall, there was, momentarily, an RCA input card for the modular amps (discontinued because of fitment issues, dual jacks usually on 14mm centers, etc.) have you considered making one with stereo 3.5mm jack instead (would force users to get an adapter to 2x female RCA...) but would possibly resolve any fitment issue?

 

[jnak00]

@Jason Stoddard from what i recall, there was, momentarily, an RCA input card for the modular amps (discontinued because of fitment issues, dual jacks usually on 14mm centers, etc.) have you considered making one with stereo 3.5mm jack instead (would force users to get an adapter to 2x female RCA...) but would possibly resolve any fitment issue?

Good idea. I have a rare Asgard with the RCA card installed. There really isn't anything complicated with the card. I speculate that the Asgard board sits a little higher in the chassis because of the heat pad on the bottom, and the extra height caused the fit issues.

I think they could redesign the card to make it fit but that's probably near the bottom of their priority list.

 

[Chastity]

That's a major plus in my eyes.

I went with separates than a installed card because:

1) I wanted a better DAC than a 4490, and the SMSL M300 MKII is a huge price/performance monster. (AK4497 @ $239)
2) I wanted the ability to add a tube preamp. Can't do that with an all-in-one
3) I have a G6 that I use for my older games to do 7.1 VSS, and that connects to my DAC via toslink. No toslink with the add-on card.

 

[Spy Car]

I'm glad to hear it. I'd be pairing it with an HD650 and hD600, primarily.

I went to the Schiiter in Valencia specifically to compare the Asgard 3 with the Modi/Magni, and the Asgard 3 with MB vs the 4490.

I was successful in the first part. The Asgard 3 and the Modi/Magni have a very similar neutral sound profile but with the HD6xx/650s the power on the Magni wasn't sufficient to my ears at high volumes. Got a little grainy. But I know a friend who has a Magni and low impedance Focals and he purchased an Asgard last week and could not hear a difference with efficient cans. The extra power does help with the 650s IMO.

I was frustrated that at Schitt's listening room that they had no way to directly compare Asgard 3s with both DAC cards directly. I really wanted to do that. The "dude" working there claimed no one had ever asked to do that before. Mmm, OK.

Eventually, they were able to set up the particular Asgard 3 I was considering buying to a laptop that had very limited music options. Not really a fair test, but I didn't feel compelled to spend another $100 after listening to both versions.

I know we all wish to avoid mistakes when we purchase gear, and one can find a million opinions online, but I sincerely doubt you'd be disappointed with an Asgard 3 / 4490. It is a very nice sounding headphone amp. Well built, plenty of power, no noise, and a neutral sound profile (which is what I wanted).

Since owning this amp I've used it intensively. I have not regretted the decisions for a moment. I'd do the same thing over again.

Bill

 

[Spy Car]

I thought about getting the Asgard 3 with the 4490 card built in, but decided to just go with a b-stock Modi 3. I figured it would allow me to upgrade my dac if I wanted something different in the future (and I’d move the Modi to my work set up), whereas I would be stuck with a built-in dac in the Asgard and don’t currently have the money for a multi-but card.

The DAC cards for the Asgard 3 are modular and can be swapped out if there is a compelling reason to do so in the future.

Bill