[Miller]

Today was a day I wanted to get a bit back into tube rolling. I recently changed the power distribution for the AIC-10 and the Tambaqui and I am always impressed on the effect it does have. When I introduced the Sablon audio power cables I could not believe the effect, the Furutech e-TP609E NCF is not quite at the extreme but follows the same path, extending the soundstage and the overall presentation while lowering the noise floor. Now back to tubes

I was super curious, since this is not a Siemens produced tube I’d say either Tungsram or RFT ECC82 selected and labeled ECC802s. When I first heard it, is was horrible…. I did send it back and got a replacement but never got close until today. I had close to zero expectations, I was just hoping it would kind of work. Small plates but strong getter construction, at least.

I was pleasantly surprised, it sounds nice… really nice. Fast and well tempered low noise floor and very nice instrument separation. I’ll compare it against an RFT and will report back how it holds up. The RFT’s from Eastern Germany are still very good available and low priced, so may be a bargain.

This little fellow is in the price range of the Tesla ECC802s and without a doubt, it belongs there!

Sound wise this is not a Tesla/TFK ECC802s, it is very different. It does not have the density the other two have it does remind me a bit more on the La Radiotechnique ECC82.

 

[Ragnar-BY]

When I introduced the Sablon audio power cables I could not believe the effect, the Furutech e-TP609E NCF is not quite at the extreme but follows the same path, extending the soundstage and the overall presentation while lowering the noise floor.

Have you tried power regenerators? I'm using PS Audio DirectStream Power Plant 12 and difference with AIC-10 isn't small. Compared to plugging an amplifier directly into the wall, or even through a balanced transformer, P12 regenerator takes Riviera's dynamics to a whole new level.

 

[givemefocalutopia]

I’ve been using this amp for about 3 months now. This amp is very dynamic and musical. After I started using this amp, I started liking listening to live music much more than before. Listening to music in general has become much more enjoyable and many nights I stayed up late just to listen more. I think AIC-10’s dynamics and openness have created a good synergy with my Focal Utopia. With AIC-10, my Utopia sounds more impactful and elastic with a wider soundstage. Some of the rough edges of Utopia (like clapping sounds for example) with solid-state amps disappeared too. I am pretty sure AIC-10 will create good synergy with many other headphones as well. Although it accentuated my old dt770’s V-shaped tonality, it took dt770’s dynamics to a whole new level. AIC-10 allows you to fine-tune your sound with a wide variety of 12au7 tubes. It is relatively cheap and cost effective because you just need one tube. For example, if you want a more accurate/detailed sound, you can use Telefunken tubes. If you want a more warm/relaxed sound, you can throw in Mullard tubes. Even with cheap non-NOS tubes AIC-10 will bring improvement to your headphones. AIC-10 will show the characteristic of the tubes without completely altering the characteristics of your headphones.

EH 12AU7 (1st) - As I've said earlier, AIC-10 will sound great even with non-NOS tubes. My very first tube I've used with AIC-10 (or any other audio equipment) was Electro-harmonix 12AU7. Contrary to what many say, I swear this first tube I've used sounded very open and airy. I could picture a long, wide tunnel in front of me with much reverbs and echoes. It was great for live music, it made me feel like I was there listening with the crowd. It had a great impactful bass too which I enjoyed very much for listening to EDMs. Compared to other NOS tubes I've tried later, EH lacked details and sound seemed misaligned. However, I thought I could live with it. Unfortunately, this tube died rather quickly (developed this boiling water like noise and lost its dynamics) and so my tube rolling began.
Mullard CV4003 - First I tried the Mullard CV4003. This is where I first experienced the lush tube sounds. Although this particular tube had more details and its syrup coated sound was very nice to listen to, it did not have much bass so I looked for more.
Mazda 6189 - Later I got myself a Mazda military stock 6189. Compared to CV4003, it sounded brighter. While maintaining that smooth/airy/tubey sound, mazda had this mid-range punch which I found quite interesting. Although the brighter tonality was to my liking, it also didn't have satisfactory amount of bass so I moved on.
Mullard 12AU7 - Next, I got a short plate Mullard 12AU7 from 1960s. This one was similar to CV4003 in terms of tonality (warm) but it had more bass which I liked a lot. It was good for EDMs and other music in general but felt like I could do better for vocal songs.
TFK G73R - Then came G73R. Wow. First word came to my mind was "accurate." Bass on songs were so precise that you can almost see the tube trying to control the amount of bass. It brought in more details and made things sound more clear and detailed, as if I turned up the "detail knob" on my AIC-10. It is very airy (probably the most airy one from the ones I've tried) and dynamic. This or something similar would be my tube of choice, it sounded the best for all genre except EDMs (just slightly behind EH 12AU7).
EH 12AU7 (2nd) - After trying many NOS tubes, I wanted to go back to EH 12AU7 and see if the new tube I bought would sound similar or different from the old one I had. The punchiness or bass was there but the openness I've experienced with the first EH was gone. Sound become less 3-d like and sounded like an entire frequency range was cut off (for example, when a singer sings there's no more of the mist like effect and sounds unnatural with very little resonance). However, it sounded fairly good for pop songs and sounded best for EDMs to my ears. From this I come to think that it is possible even tubes of the same model/same manufacturer will sound different from each other...

TL;DR - AIC-10 is a great amp which goes well with most if not all headphones. It provides you a great flexibility to try different tubes and fine-tune your sound to your liking. If you have this amp you've gotta try Telefunken and Mullard tubes.

P.S. I was told it is not good to tube roll too much. Mine developed a new noise and my dealer told me that it could be due to many tube rolling and the socket getting loose as a result.

 

[rpaltaufstax]

Hello givemefocalutopia
Actually, I'm not quite fitting in the Riviera tubes thread, as I use A a different headphone amp B thus a different preamp tube and C a different headphone......
Nonetheless, I like to look in here, as my headphone amp comparison almost landed me a Riviera.

That said, I'd like to give a quick nudge to another idea in addition. I notice that you often compare one tube of one brand with a tube of many other tubes and then assign a certain (for this tube) "real" audio character to this brand.
About brands is then compared rather "in the width"

My approach was then an additional and I had the knowledge advantage by other users that the used series preamplifier tube should experience an audio upgrade over a Siemens & Halske NOS CCa or Siemens & Halske NOS E88CC. Both types of tubes are identical in use and the CCa is then "only" an additional selected one.

My idea was now to compare myself "in depth" only with this specification.

After eight new and used NOS specimens I know today that each of the eight tubes can achieve its own audio performance. The tubes came from reliable sources and were supplied with measurement data sheets (range from 102 to 131%). Theoretically a "new" NOS specimen with 131% should be able to present more favorably than a used specimen. In the end, however, a used Siemens & Halske CCa achieved my personal 6 star result.
By the way, all 8 NOS delivered more advantageously than the series Electro Harmonix 6CG7.

If a Riviera user likes the own character of one heard Mullard or Mazda..., maybe it makes sense for the Riviera to get to know several tubes of this brand?

Rainer wishes continued enjoyment of and under your headphones
PS: english is not my native language......

 

[Miller]

If a Riviera user likes the own character of one heard Mullard or Mazda..., maybe it makes sense for the Riviera to get to know several tubes of this brand?

It is interesting that you mention this. I usually get a pair of tubes, if possible a selected ones with individual symmetry. From some types I do have even have quite some more and given the time of production you can sometimes even visually see the differences. Those tubes same brand same specs but different production clearly have a different sound. Even the ones close in time and construction can vary quite a bit. I do have seven different S&H triple Mica which look all pretty much the same, but are ranging from E82CC over 12au7WA over 6189 to 5814A some branded Valvo some S&H some Siemens. And even they come from the same factory, same decade, look pretty much the same, they do have a very distinct signature. If I do swap them against each other I do have a clear preference towards the 6189, if I do swap it against the second one of the pair it stays that way. If I do switch it against a regular S&H 6189, I am still preferring the triple mica 6189.

So in my book yes individual tubes from the same make or year may sound a bit different, probably due to use or age. If you can get a selected/matched pair which does have had the same history they are pretty consistent.

Mid term I have gravitated towards open sounding tubes and so far the G73_R does provide the best overall presentation in my setup. Some other tubes have some specifics that impress in the first moments but are not able to provide the same level of satisfaction.

If my curiosity wouldn’t have taken over I am sure I would have easily been pleased earlier in the journey, but I really wanted to deep dive into tubes with everything that comes along. From my point of view that is a very nice way to explore audiophile avenues while enjoying some fine music.

 

[Miller]

Today I have received my Prion4 spades to 3,5mm cable. I was super curious on how this would come across. So basically I am introducing two changes at once Vykari to Prion4, similar gauge one copper/silver hybrid the other pure silver and 4 pin XLR front to speaker taps in the back.

I always start listening into new gear with tracks I really know, same this time. Miles Davis Kind of Blue the 2006 newly produced master in 192/24, which from my point of view is the best possible option. And I had a short moment of shock, to say at least, I thought something broke somewhere. If you listen into the first seconds, at second 9-10 there is a dissonance in the bass notes I have never heard before. I think it just got hidden somewhere….

When Miles starts it does have the typical pinch you’d expect. I was a bit nervous if the silver would be exaggerating too much, but the contrary is the case. It is all very well controlled no edges just details, heaps of details. I am even under the impression that the bass lines have gained more body, this is probably due to the extra power from the speaker taps.

I am listening with G73_R and the super analog nature has even increased. Will listen to Blue Note session later today and see if the “Studer effect” is as well still present.

While listening I can even hear the imperfections of the original 3 track tape, they slightly fade in and out. It is very detailed without being on the dry analytic side.

It is a bit like a different amp… Still a bit confused…

I was expecting a bit of veil being removed, instead I got much more dynamics, extended frequency range much more grip and details I never knew existed…

Edit 1
I have to confess moving to speaker taps is a big leap forward with the Susvara. The front 4 pin XLR is definitely very nice, and if you do not know what potential is locked one could be happy as is. For me, with the new cable moving to the speaker tap is a massive change. More than what I would have expected, I would go so far to suggest that Riviera should offer that as an option for the 4 pin XLR. This would probably not work universal, but per request on a pair of Susvara it would only make sense and you’d still have the HP-Low as a universal position to chose.

Edit 2
Specifically on orchestral works the separation, layering and space has dramatically improved. The timbre of the individual instruments has as well become much more complex. I am not sure what is the cable and what to attribute to the speaker tap. But either way a very nice improvement well worth the effort.

 

[Miller]

Day two on the speaker taps, this is easily one of the bigger steps forward. The part which I am still struggling with is the transformative nature. It is probably the cable plus the speaker taps which made the jump so significant. There is just so much more information, all the room reverb, the texture on the individual instruments and the unbelievable transparency. I read on this thread that it is more prominent on the Susvaras, yes but the change is so dramatic they should put a sticker on the Amp to prepare you on what’s coming next .

I never really dealt with cross-feed since I am on the camp that just accepts the shortcomings of a headphone based system, I am always looking to get the cleanest most unaltered signal through the chain.

With the latest change the stereo imaging gap between a speaker based system and the headphone image has closed down significantly. I have even turned on cross-feed on the DSP to double check the effect, sacrilege!

 

[Axel]

Thanks!

Local distributer has only their integrated. I can try it out with the headphones and speakers output. It seems it is a bit more beefy in power - 30W class A.
I assume it has a similar voicing, so that may give some sort of indication.

Well, yesterday I've visited the local distributor and gave the Levante (Riviera's integrated) a try.
It's a beautiful amp, and it is very big, weighing at ~30kg.

Started with the speakers tap. Set the amp to 30W class A mode, it also has a 120W class AB mode, which is claimed to be class A up to 6W. I assumed the pure class A mode would work better with the Susvara, as it might "pull" more than 6W.

The Levante drove the Susvara easily, there was plenty of volume and the sound was huge!
So many details and textures. Ambiance was magnificent, you could clearly hear the concert hall, recording studio, everything was there.
Bass was meaty, but very low sub-bass was a bit attenuated.
Highs were clear and sparkling, but never bright.
Decay was beautiful and the mids were magical.

Overall, this is an extremely good match with the Susvara, I loved it.

Later, I've tried the dedicated headphones output.
Unfortunately, the headphones output did not drive the Susvara, I had to dial the volume knob up to ~2 o'clock, and then it started distorting.
I assume it is probably better on the AIC-10.

Now I'm thinking maybe the AIC-10 can sit side-by-side next to the Egoista.
Or maybe I'll get the Levante and have another speakers amp, which could provide an additional flavor on my speakers-based system.

We'll see...

 

[Miller]

Later, I've tried the dedicated headphones output.
Unfortunately, the headphones output did not drive the Susvara, I had to dial the volume knob up to ~2 o'clock, and then it started distorting.
I assume it is probably better on the AIC-10.

Maybe the information is useful for your decision. I am driving my Susvara/AIC-10 balanced out of a Tambaqui with 6V rms. With the 4pin XLR I was usually between 10 and 11 o’clock. On the speaker taps the headroom has increased and I am now at 8:30 to 9 o’clock. I have dialed the input back to 2V rms to get a bit more travel on the dial but like the 6V presentation better, it is less polite and offers a bit more edge.

 

[Axel]

Maybe the information is useful for your decision. I am driving my Susvara/AIC-10 balanced out of a Tambaqui with 6V rms. With the 4pin XLR I was usually between 10 and 11 o’clock. On the speaker taps the headroom has increased and I am now at 8:30 to 9 o’clock. I have dialed the input back to 2V rms to get a bit more travel on the dial but like the 6V presentation better, it is less polite and offers a bit more edge.

Thanks for the input.
From my short experience with the Susvara, it better suits driving from speakers taps.
It just gives it more life and opens it up.

I also highly enjoyed it driven from a Shindo Montille amp with a passive preamp.

 

[Miller]

Tube #34 France open plate ECC82 Belvue made by Radiotechnique

La Radiotechniques was at first (1919 – 1931) a subsidiary of the French Compagnie générale de la télégraphie sans fil (CSF). Later (1947) it became a subsidiary of Philips of the Netherlands, who also owned Amperex and Mullard. The Radiotechnique Suresnes factory in 1951 produced half of France’s reception tubes and 30–40% of the wireless telephony receivers.

The tube has a rather uncommon design; the interior of the plate construction is visible through a hole in the plates. The tube has a halo getter and grey plates. Both tubes are manufactured in the 12th week of 1964 (same manufacturing date).

@Ragnar-BY pointed me towards Mazda and I got curious, after my initial disappointment with my Tube #6 I have taken the time to do some research and found a suitable pair. I was unsure if the nickel plated would be the right one for me since the S&H nickel plated version was not fully what I was looking for. So I decided for this pair.

And yes, I can fully understand why this is considered one of the tubes to get!

I am currently listening to Neil Young and I find this tube to really portray his melodic tragedy’s very nicely. It does have a very intimate way of presenting the core of the music, none HiFi I’d say. Very lovely and full bodied, just like a miner for a heart of gold should sound like.

It does have a nice touch of vintage reminding me on my Lorenz square getter. But a bit more open and resolving, not like a 50’s radio. It does have a very different character compared to all my German tubes, which is very welcome! This is now my third try on a French tube and so far I could not really find a pattern, maybe I have just found very different makes and times. It is very different from the TFK, Siemens or Philips which seem to have a house sound or at least share some basic attributes.

I should replace the sticker #34 with one saying “Love street, Corral canyon, 1971”

 

[John Massaria]

UPDATED 4/4/22 : I wanted to share some tube rolling with everyone here since you guys are so active

I am expanding this as I go back and forth - I hope this helps future rollers ....

TUBE ROLLING
AS AN UPDATE AS OF 4-5-22 I just purchased a few tubes to roll- and to ensure a good supply of spare tubes for the future- some include:

1950s GE / UNITED ELECTRON 5814A -ECC82 12AU7- Black Plates, 3 Mica- An excellent silent tube with full body sound nothing really rounded off if anything its a little polite on higher end- the bass is tight and with a nice spread out sound stage and very nice bloom, right mix of wetness excellent- but but a tiny bit darker than the 5814A 1973 Long Plate- worthy of asking $ but not top tear when comparing it to 1970's 5814A by Siemens Germany - need more time with these​ Value: ★★★★ 3D image/stage: ★★★★ Musical/Warmth: ★★★★ Detail: ★★★★ Bass: ★★★★ Noise: ★★★★★ Overall Performance ★★★★​ [TR] [TD]​ ​ 5814A Siemens Germany "long plates and triple mica" copper grid 1973 (74/75) one of my favorites so far for the Prautes worth every single gash darn penny- I weep at how organic and real this sounds- an addictive 3d image and stage and separation- articulate so far the winner of bunch. Considered one of the best tubes in the world ever made... Value: ★★★★ (expensive for triple mica pre '75) 3D image/stage: ★★★★★ (wide) Musical/Warmth: ★★★★★+(of course) Detail: ★★★★★+ (yes just the right amount) Bass: ★★★★★+ Noise: ★★★★★+ Overall Performance ★★★★★+​ ​ BRIMAR England 1960 CV4003 12AU7WA 6189 ECC82​ A legendary tube possessing all the holographic magic of the Mullards CV4003 with a bit more detail. A full bodied sound. Excellent with lean headphones like HD600 or HD650 with a high ohms (150ohm or more) headphones and speakers.For me and my headphones like the GH50MK2 or my IEM Electrostaic Kinera Nanna this tube adds a bit too much mid bass weight to them- this tube at least for me is a stellar performer with HD600 or HD650 or similar LCD-5 which may need a boost in bass weight and heft (as I mentioned). Expect stellar depth image and a 3d holographic wide stage with air, a whisper quiet experience. I can see how people call this their end game tube. Value: ★★★★★ 3D image/stage: ★★★★ Musical/Warmth: ★★★★★ (yes) Detail: ★★★★+ (could be gr8 match for bright systems) Bass: ★★★★★+ (perfect for lean systems to bring authority) Noise: ★★★★★ Overall Performance ★★★★★+​ ​ RFT (Haltron Labeled) 12AU7/ECC82 E. Germany, labeled for Haltron/England- insanely quiet and non micophonic - ONE of the quietest of any tube I tested in the 12au7 range - black silky backgrounds and instantly fast - vocals are spot on tempo is fast- these certainly need to open up more I think with less than 1 hour on these NOS rated triode matches 2600/2600 and 2650/2700- these are truly NIB NOS and maybe need more time to open up - flattish front to back depth compared to some of the top 3 tubes but close - width sound stage seems incredible and instrument placement is spot on - dang! these are whisper quiet between notes... they may need to break in more since some female singers reach dog hearing frequencies (remind me of the detail monsters like clear RCA?) - "Free Me" by Jess Stone really is lively- on top a bit much with this tube... very fast with panning left right songs like Ping Pong Party by WATEVA - this tube beats 75% of the tubes here for transient speed. "China" by Tori Amos sounds nice and just the right amount of wet but the details on the high end of her voice remind me of the details of the Sparkos S3601x4 descrete OPAs- this tube is a reference revealing the recording truth warts and all- much more break in needed I would think. Could be a very good thing for those looking for that level of detail.. wow impressive. Value: ★★★★★+ 3D image/stage: ★★★★ Musical/Warmth: ★★★★ Detail: ★★★★★++ Bass: ★★★★★ Noise: ★★★★★+ Overall Performance ★★★★★+ Tungsol 12AU7A 1950’s NIB made in U.S.A -Long Plates and "O" Getter: a wonderfully accurate tight bass tube with nice air yet fast... with TRS outs- when using my Kennerton GH50Mk2 and my electrostatic IEMs like my Kinera Nanna 2.0 -I prefer this tube combo on nearly every song more so than the RSA APACHE TRS- giving more body and weight to the depth of vocals through the bass line.. a surprisingly top notch tube... wow this amp really does make music with so many tube combos... this tube is not going from my collection anytime soon I think. In my top 5 list of desirable tubes... no wonder its sold out all over in this NOS condition... did I say this could end anyones search for a perfect blend of music and detail a tube lovers dream for $$$ Value: ★★★★★ 3D image/stage: ★★★★ Musical/Warmth: ★★★★ (yes) Detail: ★★★★★ (just the right amount) Bass: ★★★★★ Noise: ★★★★★ Overall Performance ★★★★★+ ​ RT (La RadioTechnique) 1960 MIL SPEC 12AU7 France, short plates O-getter Tube glow both even upon start up with a beautiful glow from power on and slowly fades as tubes boot up- beautiful! A quiet tube with an even handed bass and mid range presentation, holographic soundstaging and open, airy top end. May be one of the more dynamic 12AU7's - nothing accentuated here except maybe the details one will hear- this is a very textured define sound in mid up region- reported to be better than long plates which tend to be more muffled and less detailed- Upscale has a video I feature here but his tubes are not stamped MIL Sepc with special stamps these are the hardest to get RT tubes to get they have the highest quality and spec ratio higher than the regular non stamped RT tubes! I can also say as upscale has mentioned in 2014 and just now in 2022 selling a single tube for $106 each and those are not MIL sepc. These La RadioTechniquehave more texture and definition up on top than the so called lazier sounding Mullards or Philips of same era with long plates... a winner for price and value hands down a piece of gear no longer available in NIB NOS like these... with just a few hours I can tell these are a very special made that sets records and benchmark for price that just so happens to be made in the romantic country of France. "they sound delicious in comparison with other 12AU7" "ONE GUY WROTE ON NON MILATARY SPEC TUBES : "Initially the Radiotechnique was too intense in the very high highs, causing it to be fatiguing. After three days of continuous pink noise, it's not fatiguing any more. I'm glad, because I love so many of its qualities and didn't want to end up with a fatigue problem. It has great imaging (yes, headphone guys talk about imaging), it's warm and not bright despite being so extended on top, and it has more life than the other brands I tried. OH, the other brands I tried were - RCA Clear tops - the German-made RFT "​ Value: ★★★★+ 3D image/stage: ★★★★ Musical/Warmth: ★★★★ Detail: ★★★★★+(could use some more warmth- but sample is NIB) Bass: ★★★★ Noise: ★★★★★+ Overall Performance ★★★★ ​ ​ Telefunken G73-R SO HIGHLY RATED THE STARS COVER THE PAGE!!! Telefunken G73-R - "Surpassing the quality control requirements of the famous Telefunken ECC802S, these are extremely rare, limited production, black shield coated, avionics/aircraft grade, factory selected Telefunken G73R. Manufactured solely for Agilent Technology and Hewlett-Packard, the proprietary G73R part number and RFI/EMI black coat shielding indicate the highest quality grading on the planet. This illustrates exhaustive aftermarket testing for low noise, uniform output, low microphonics, freedom from physical defects, long heater life and an even, uniform cathode emission. The finest West German manufactured Telefunken tubes, with smooth plates and diamond marked, these have G73R hand written on the outside black shield coating. Records indicate they were only available as spare parts for Agilent or H-P equipment. Critical use in hospital and aerospace equipment demanded tubes with extremely low noise and tightly controlled output. The ultimate tube for Hi-Fi, tube mics and mic preamps, these tubes are very fine, highly rare and in great demand. Authentic, the real deal, the bottom of the glass is diamond marked. Matched pairs and quads are available with tightly controlled transconductance from section to section and from tube to tube. Astonishingly accurate, the sound image blooms out of a dead quiet background. " UNICORN RAINBOWS AND ALL THE OTHER MYTHS MAY JUST BE TRUE ABOUT THIS MYSTERIOUSLY RARE TUBE! "ETHEREAL CONDUIT TO A HIGHER REALM" ..On the other sonic-side lies the realms of musical-ideals, dream worlds, and the sonic-heavens and havens of different tube-religions. The G73-R can be the conduit to outer sonic planes or sonic-astral realm" SIMILAR WORDS SAID BY OTHERS: "While listing to Miles Davis SKETCHES OF SPAIN with Gil Evans I can hear, see, and feel Miles sitting on a stool in a section in my listening room, a trio of trumpet, trombone and flute behind him. As if the members of the band are right in the room with you! The dense textural details and markings for dynamics are performed precisely as recorded and reproduced so that all the interweaving parts emerge clearly. The depth of musical emotion is distinctly audible with every detail of the pure orchestral fabric as I'm not hearing my preamp, amp, or speakers anymore, just pure music, the conduit to a higher musical realm, as if there is no hardware at all! "Miles above" and Simply beautiful and well worth the price for the ECC802S 'klingarm' factory tubes!...worlds better than the newer commercial series by "miles"... "Their performance was off-the-charts in two separate listenings for this report. The bass is paradoxically liquid-tight sumptuously textured with all the low nuances the Double bass can give in a live-performance, yet full-bodied, and powerful. The midrange displays first, secondary, and third octave nuances, the tube has enormous layers of harmonic tonal depth, like a well weaved tapestry of sonic colors with pure gold strands woven into it's complex sonic-fabric, as well as a pouring out of liquid sonic lower, mid-midrange and upper-mid texture. The highs are liquid sweet like milk and honey, and pure as the crystalline morning snow and true to everything life has to through at it. THE VOCAL TIMBRE was compellingly superb, hauntingly realistic, like the singers were in the room with us, breathing every word. Very compelling tube providing absolutely no ear fatigue, or preamp adjustments, providing your speakers are placed correctly in your listening environment, and you have the audiophile-gear to appreciate it's capabilities."… " LIQUID SONIC TEXTURE ELIXIER". You may just loose you job and girl firend/wife/both all because all you may do is stay connected to your amp 24/7 and never want to stop listening to music. The highets praise worth every single bloody dollar- you may think people who own 4 or 5 pairs of these are insane- until you hear your first set- you will be hooked like a musical head tripp you will never forget... the only thing you can do is listen and wonder how it is so musical and precise at the same time. Telefunken G73-R Value: ★★★★★ (if rolling is an expensive habit stop/just buy these) 3D image/stage: ★★★★★+++(transients detail/space like no other tube I can describe w/ Tesla Plaid Speed while still retaining insane front to back layering - precisely as recorded placements - this is reference in my set up for sure) Musical/Warmth: ★★★★★+ Bass: ★★★★★+++ (tight nearly emotionally perfect) Noise: ★★★★★+++ (how low can you go- this LOW!) Overall Performance: ★★★★★++++ Pinnacle 13D5A Industrial Grade ECC82 12AU7 Toshiba Source RED TIP - (red tip usually denotes extreme reliability and low noise intended and sorted for "scientific or medical grade") Another person wrote: "Separation and blackness in between the notes is second to none. Very sweet tone on strings and piano. Like this better than the Brimar 13d5 as it had a wooden tone." For me- I am feeling music from stings and piano very very organic and natural sounding - vocals from Madeleine Peyroux La Vie En Rose- and Don't Wait too Long and J'ai Deux Amours- the sound is glorious - a wonderfully musical addicting sound- hairs on the back of my neck stand up! All the tingles and pleasing feeling one gets when something this good is playing... wonderful ! I wound up getting one pair and well I fell head over heels and bought more... I need to see a tube dr... and the only medicine is more tube goodness like this! as I said these are the cats meow! MEOW! ( and I don't even like cats) so for all those dog lovers like myself WOOF! WOOF! this is the dogs bone of tubes! Value:★★★★★+ 3D image/stage ★★★★ Musical/Warmth: ★★★★ Detail: ★★★★★ Bass: ★★★★ Noise: ★★★★★++ Overall Performance ★★★★+ I SHOULD NOTE- I BOUGHT 5 Pairs of these and the closer they are matched the better they sounded- with higher triode μMhos/cm and close triode matching in each tube being the obvious choice- the cream of the pick-so yes the amp DOES in fact sound better with highest rated matched tubes like so many have claimed one way or the other- Its a fact for me as I proved it trying these all and the conclusion is something buyers of all tubes should face as fact- FOR headphone AMPS the matched tube triodes make best sound BUT for preamps in a speaker system their may be less of notable difference if the tubes are not tight matches- VALVO ECC82 Hamburg 1960, short plates, 45 degree-declined O-getter - quiet tube- The sound is transparent, a bit romantic and it's so rare to have such perfect sparkle up on top at the same time! this is a magic tube! a beautiful mix and blend. The version I have is extremely NIB and needs time to break in- but one person wrote this report after its broken in- Produced in the late 50s (this specific tube is from 1960) to the early 60s. Sound, although is not as musical as long plates (which sell for $500-800 for this kind of pair at the time of this review in 2022) it’s still a pleasure to listen to it. One of the truly great 12au7 tubes. The sound is transparent, romantic with a good mixture of warmth and top register sparkle. Airy and detailed – you may just want to keep listening to it - track after track. What strikes the most about this tube is how it can be smooth and how good treble sounds. Amperex is a great example of what I’m talking about, but this tube has outdone Amperex in the treble department. And the bass is so accurate and ever so slightly boosted - again very tastefully done! Words like tube magic come to mind here! VERY RARE AND HIGHLY RECOMMENDED but this pair is so new i'm sure it only gets better from here... the long plate commands twice the price and adds only a bit more 3d air- these at half the going rate are insane and for me top 3 of all the tubes tested here. These are a perfect blend of tube and accurate reproduction- CRAZY and blessed to have this ultra rare tube here to review... Value: ★★★★★+ 3D image/stage: ★★★★★ Musical/Warmth: ★★★★ Detail: ★★★★★++ (could use some more warmth- but sample is NIB) Bass: ★★★★★ Noise: ★★★★★ Overall Performance: ★★★★★ Tesla ECC802S long plate Czechoslovakia yellow print 32 XD (1966) - a remarkable tube and reported to be one of the finest 12AU7's made for the money - yes it is very quiet and all kinds of musical, wonderful details - good examples like this set could be close to top Siemens, or maybe as close to a pure <> ECC802 fortune 500 life styles of the rich and famous "Telefunken" at a lower price- The right pair like this matched year tube set will impress you but once you start to listen for details -I think this tube could fool you and make you forget all about shopping for anything else- piano and string are done so organically here! stop rolling and find a great matched pair like this and your search could be over... opens up after burn in - reported to have very long life of over 10K+ Hr life a finer tube than the Haltron label for RFT or RCA anything (gray or black etc) I think - The Tesla is known for low microphonics and low noise- and super transient dynamic package while being so musical... a winner for less $$$ Value:★★★★★ 3D image/stage ★★★★ Musical/Warmth: ★★★★ Detail: ★★★★★ (could use some more warmth- but sample is NIB) Bass: ★★★★★ Noise: ★★★★★ Overall Performance ★★★★★+​ NOTE: A possible truth that needs to be verified: RCA cleartops tend to have high trans-conductance compared to most 12au7. This is something that is not stated often. As a result, the cleartop gives you more drive which would suit circuits where 12au7 is used in the output stage. Another 12au7 types with high trans-conductance is the Telefunken ecc802s. (In general transconductance can be either positive or negative depending on the circuit or this case when comparing it in a head- amp) ​ RCA 12AU7A Clear Top original "Hickok Elect. Instr. Co"- "Here are the words you might have heard about this tube : Vivid, vibrant with high resolution, rich-full sound throughout the frequency range - all true" - One of the best in my bunch of tubes- best overall balanced musical experience. If I only had one tube to choose on a budget or not this could be it if I was listening to darker headphones a sure bet as well... a must own tube set... perfect synergy with my Kennerton GH50Mk2- quick and the most out of head experience and superb details with out one ounce of fatigue. Musical and accurate... breathes more life in the music and nearly equal detail to the Ray Samuels Apache XLR vs XLR. No harshness just music- this is in the top 4 of all tubes no matter the price and matches very well with my headphones and amp. My favorite tube if all other tubes stopped being made I would be might be ok with a few prime examples of these if stranded on a desert island (if that island had 120V that is) Value: ★★★★★+ 3D image/stage ★★★★★ Musical/Warmth: ★★★★★ Detail: ★★★★★+ (just the right amount of detail vs warmth) Bass: ★★★★★ (accurate) Noise: ★★★★★+ Overall Performance ★★★★+1950's RCA Blackplate 12AU7 (LABELED CONN) Incredible detail and micro dynamics, musical but a bit analytical nearly clinical- tempo and speed very tight. Bass seems neutral and mids and highs seems more detailed than any other tube I can recall here. An articulate experience - but honestly the Clear Top RCA I received sounds more musical and less fatiguing which should be the opposite here- a testament to each tube set will sound slightly different. Value: ★★★★★+ 3D image/stage ★★★★★ Musical/Warmth: ★★★ Detail: ★★★★★+ (this sample too detailed more than the RCA clear /not as musical as I would like for tube) Bass: ★★★★★ (accurate) Noise: ★★★★★ Overall Performance ★★★★ Tungsram ecc82 red serial# printed on tube gray plate o getter 1960s-1976 Industrial Grade tubes were subject to rigorous test and burn in process. Faster and more Holographic than Tesla ECC802S. Amazing spread out width and 3 d landscape - very beautiful sound- neutral/natural sounding, it has a extended top end and tight bass - vocals on both female and male sound so delightful, no harshness yet still defined details. So lush yet refined. Very good bass. Mid range is dreamy. Highs are spot on. This is a heavy weight tube and deserves the reputation it has as being jaw dropping good. (some weep to their knees I have read)... worthy of all the hype! I consider this top of the litter in many ways. Definitely in top 4 of this group so far. Quiet and reliable with top notch sound quality. This version is very neutral/natural sounding, it has a extended top end and tight bass compared with the dual bar getter below which is unicorn in 2022 in NIB condition but the dual bar getter support is a tiny bit more euphoric and slightly more romantic and more tube sounding while still holding on to the details. Value: ★★★★★+ 3D image/stage ★★★★★ Musical/Warmth: ★★★★★ Detail: ★★★★★+ (just the right amount of detail vs warmth) Bass: ★★★★★ (accurate) Noise: ★★★★★ Overall Performance ★★★★★+ ​ TOP 3 NIB NOS Tube in this shoot out shown above: so far for my set up! The Tungsram ECC82 MIL Red serial DOUBLE BAR GETTER! VERY RARE !​ Tungsram CC82/12AU7 RED SERIAL NIB NOS- DOUBLE BAR GETTER AWESOME GETTER GLOW SPARK AND very even upon start up! But that doesnt make or explain the music you get from this crazy rare tube... Everything enhanced over the single bar getter above!!! performance is similar BUT extremely rare tube came all the way from Italy and took 4 weeks to arrive. Worth the wait- this is a tube that will make you stop searching - it gives you everything you could want- depth, clarity and detail with the perfect amount of warmth of tubes with air and wetnness no solid state can produce so well that I know of... the is a maestro maker... musical and magical. Listening to this tube with the Mk1 JM Edition of the Kennerton Vali Neoteric Dynamic - it is a musical experience that rivals any planar I have ever auditioned with amazing height and clarity. I would be cautious as to recommend this tube to those who like very bright headphones such as Utopia or Ultrasone Edition 10 - however this tube may be perfect for the AudezeLCD5 since this tube is so full and satisfying- you may weep at how good vocals and emotion comes through.... now I know why I bought a second set... remarkable The single bar getter above is very neutral/natural sounding, it has a extended top end and tight bass where the double has more warmth and tube greatness while still being accurate and holds the details of the single bar. Incredible combination here! ! ONE GUY WROTE: "I'm using it in a very expensive VAC sigma preamp I shouldn't say this but one of the best 12AU7s I found was the same tube but with the double support bar getter tube looks the same but the double bar getter one sounded much better. So watch what your buying Best for Classical or jazz I would say"- he missed all music this tube is in the top 2!!!! THIS IS THE TUBE TALK ABOUT JAW DROPPINGLY GOOD PERFORMANCE AND WHY WE DO WHAT WE DO ROLLING TUBES!!!! Value: ★★★★★+VERY RARE AND RARE/ EXPENSIVE! 3D image/stage ★★★★★++ Musical/Warmth: ★★★★★++ Detail: ★★★★★++ (just the right amount of detail vs warmth) Bass: ★★★★★++ (accurate) Noise: ★★★★★++ Overall Performance ★★★★★++ Amperex ECC82/12AU7 Holland, Orange Globe late 1960s and early 1970s, NOS When booting up the Amprex they glow evenly together and its a slow getter glow for a few seconds- very nice! listening to the Amprex ORANGE Globe and notes dance in the air with Jancintha singing Light My Fire - very sweet voicing here- the flute sounds nice - its not as clearly defined as the both RFT's or Pinnacle I mentioned in this review. Similar to a Bugle Boy- this has a nice warmish mid-range with balanced highs and lows and ample while not over doing it. It's a lusher sound - more relaxed and not as fast. The Amprex is a bit more romantic and warm- mid bass ever so slightly more prominent. The Amprex can have a more 3d stage than the RFT but - Killer by Eminem sounded faster on RFT and left to right pans seem faster on RFT. This is a romantic tube. Lots of air and beauty. There is no harshness here at all- this is a lush (not lazy though) sound that is very very pleasant- I can imagine this is not really recommended for amps that are warm already or headphones that are warm or dark- unless you want to really pour on the lushness. For me and my headphones like the GH50JM Mk2 this tube is a bit too much of a good thing. I can imagine this being great with any FOCAL or Ultrasone or would be IDEAL for LCD 5. You could listen to this tube all day and NEVER get fatigued. It could put you to sleep with some songs... THIS WAS WRITTEN ON THE ORANGE GLOBE- and I 100% agree: Later versions of this tube were produced under the 'Orange Globe' logo. Many times you can find Herleen, Holland Amperex with a 'Hammond' logo. These are very nice low noise tubes that were highly screened for use in organs. They are the same as any Bugle Boy or Amperex ECC83, except screened for higher quality. Hammond Amperexes are one of my favorite tubes... I buy them whenever I can. I have found certain Hammond Amperexes to be exceptionally sweet, as good or better than any 'Bugle Boy' labeled tube. Value: ★★★★★+ 3D image/stage ★★★★★ Musical/Warmth: ★★★★★+ Detail: ★★★★ (more warmth than detail) Bass: ★★★★★ (accurate) Noise: ★★★★★ (quiet!) Overall Performance ★★★★★+ RFT ECC82 E.Germany 1966, O-getter with dual thick support rods, labeled and boxed for RSD/Germany Beautiful even dual tube glow when you first turn on amp! Glorious! Incredible sound! Silent black textured backdrop! silky smooth and musically engaging. FAST! great for all genre of music since it's so even handed... These are a cold war gem from E Germany. Vocals on both male and female are heavenly strings and brass instruments are spot on. Separation is spot on. 3D Stage and width could be less than the top tubes costing three times more but for this price these beat so many others for double! Plus these are NIB so I expect them to open up a bit more- Man this is a great set! Macthed triodes with tight tolerances! Value: ★★★★★+ 3D image/stage ★★★★★ Musical/Warmth: ★★★★★ Detail: ★★★★★+ (just the right amount of detail vs warmth) Bass: ★★★★★ (accurate) Noise: ★★★★★+ Overall Performance ★★★★★+ _______________________________________________________________________________ TUNG-SOL 12AU7 Clear Glass Long Gray Plates O-Getter early 1960 Worth the $200 for the pair! You could spend more but not get more... this is a end the search tube money or not these could do it all. Very musical and fast. Tempo and rhythm excellent. What else you want? Value: ★★★★★+ 3D image/stage ★★★★★ Musical/Warmth: ★★★★★ Detail: ★★★★★+ (just the right amount of detail vs warmth) Bass: ★★★★★ (accurate) Noise: ★★★★★+ Overall Performance ★★★★★+ _________________________________________________________________________________________________ TUNG-SOL 12AU7 Clear Glass Long Gray Plates D-Getter early 1950's Hickok Co.Inc Quiet and accurate. A keeper that any amp owner will love- nothing too overly done. Perfect balance between details and warmth. A winner set here! warm sounding tubes with precise resolution - similar to the RCA D getter believe it or not... didn't spend too much time with this as I think they resemble the RCA D getter - this pair is extremely NIB with excellent - μMhos/cm ratings so I didn't want to use it too much just yet as I just checked for noise and microphonics and it has none - also played a few songs and went right over to RCA D getter and its similar (so I moved on) Value: ★★★★★+ 3D image/stage ★★★★ Musical/Warmth: ★★★★ (since new there is hug potential to score high in all categories) Detail: ★★★★★ Bass: ★★★★ Noise: ★★★★★++ Overall Performance ★★★★+ RCA 12AU7 Mid-Late 1950s, Long Gray Plates with D-getter - very lush yet detailed tubes- a treasure with a rating of μMhos/cm 2600/2400 and 2475/2700 these are like the day they were minted ! holographic and musical- not my favorite for my set up I like the Tung Sol D Getter a bit more but these are still young baby's and need time to open up is my guess. These are a treasure of a tube and will not be broken in by me- they are whisper quiet and beautiful in every way but for me the match up for my headphones and amp are not ideal. This is for a slightly laid back (the warmer of all the RCA's I have- which for some people is WHY these are so desirable and expensive! I have seen these as high as $99 each in 2022 NIB from reputable dealers BUT they dont score as high in life μMhos/cm as my pair - I never seen a tube this old score so high!) BUT for me I don't like my RCAs so warm sounding - I like it a bit more forward. These are more AUDIOphile sound tubes and should please those looking to get lost in the music more than evaluate as my analytical mind is. hats why I know they will open up more as someone owns them. Value: ★★★★★+ 3D image/stage ★★★★ Musical/Warmth: ★★★★ (since new there is hug potential to score high in all categories) Detail: ★★★★★ Bass: ★★★★ Noise: ★★★★★++ Overall Performance ★★★★+ RCA 12AU7A Early 1960s, Long Gray Plates O-Getter 1960s near perfect/ideal stock match- Tektronix checked and precision matched pair with the same Tektronix code labels- these come in NIB 2600/2575 μMhos/cm and 2575/2450μMhos/cm - insane numbers for such an old tube! All the great qualities for the RCA long plates from the 1960's one could expect. Value: ★★★★★+ 3D image/stage ★★★★ Musical/Warmth: ★★★★ (since new there is hug potential to score high in all categories) Detail: ★★★★★ Bass: ★★★★ Noise: ★★★★★++ Overall Performance ★★★★+​ AND GE ECC82/ 12AU7 GRAY SHORT PLATE O GETTER - bad sample from BANGYBANG TUBES EBAY - IN DISPUTE FOR RETURN-MANY COMPLAINTS ON LINE HERE IN HEAD-FI! BUYER BE WARE!A gross stained box that smelt like mold when it arrived- all their inventory is questionable- I will post images of the tube Ma ratings and boxes so you don't think I am exaggerating- they weren't even a matched pair and Ma looked poor for a NOS- these are at best NEARLY new rating butt ugly box and tube etchings! (returning to banybang tubes - INDIA SHADY AS HECK! I WOULD NOT EVER BUY FROM THESE PEOPLE AGAIN SORRY: AKA: nosaudiotubes dot com AKA: bangybang dot com/collections/all AKA: activepowertechnology @ gmail.com​

 

[Miller]

I wanted to share some tube rolling with everyone here since you guys are so active
I am expanding this as I go back and forth - I hope this helps future rollers ....

Thanks for sharing with us, it looks like you spent quite some time collecting and listening. I like your star rating system, very technical and does give a good indication.

Interestingly the RFT’s seem to have impressed you as well, I have recently listend to a Siemens labeled one and could not really believe it. Since their availability is still really good the do offer a very nice value for money package. And yes, I agree very silent, probably due to the small dimensions and very rigid construction.

You made me curious on the clear top RCA, I have skipped them in the past and my revisit them.

 

[decur]

Picked up a nos tesla ecc802s(the highs/treble is not smooth)
this tube does not come close to my rca clear top from tubedepot.
rca cleartop for me is end game,im done tube rolling.

 

[simorag]

Another round is rolling out over the weekend ... I am revisiting the G73-R after some system upgrades I did recently, next in line is the Amperex 7316 of which I am very curious and have high expectations for.

For now I can confirm what I have already gathered from my previous attempt, i.e. that the Valkyria really love the G73-R ... truly a 'match made in heaven' as the saying goes.