[kawhia]

It is difficult job do describe differences between these two fantastic amps. So -some common features of them both first. They both play in highest league still avaliable for reasonable price. Craftsmanship quality of these manufacture ,boutique, all handmade products is amazing. Made in small numbers will bring proud of ownership, I am positive they will stay in any collection for very long time. Overall impression after long time is that for me there are no weak points sonically, just different presentation, but on highest level - creation of 3D space, perfect sense of being there with concert recordings, finest resolution of detail, full frequency spectrum extension with deep very resolving bass reproduction, sparkling high frequency when present on recording, pure , neither accented nor smoothed midrange, explosive dynamics with
proper material, dead quiet background.
The most intriguing and also common feature for both amps is wide possibility of tubes rolling, thus creating whatever you wish and can imagine. This makes impossible to describe REAL character of both amps. I was completely satisfied when received them and started listening. All above mentioned positive remarks are atributed easily to factory units, with standard tubes. As I wrote in my previous posts I thoroughly enjoyed Riviera for couple of months and started tube rolling later on. This was amazing experience but I have to say clearly that IMHO this is personal decision of owners whether they leave The amp character as its creators intended or will search their own. With ENVY I was satisfied with Full Music upgraded tubes from The very beginning, but being aware of possible improvement ( or just a change) in sound character I started experiments with other tubes.
These experiments were not cheap, tubes are expensive but it is worth every cent to try, so much satisfaction it brings and expands my knowledge. I collected a lot of tubes that will remain in my collection, each of them bringing the new and sometimes unexpected qualities to my system. I must recall a lot of post of Head fiers that inspired me a lot- thanks!!!!
I will not mention different 12AU7 applied with Riviera-this was evaluated in detail elewhere in our thread. Instead I will underline The need to mess around with 300B tubes for ENVY. You will not regret trying WE (current production) or ELROG - by now standard version. Both will stay with me. In future I will try Molibdenium too. I did not experiment with 6sn7 leaving it for future. There is also a lot of possibilities
. The next aspect to consider is headphones choice. I had most satisfying results with RIVIERA and Abyss 1266TC, other headphones did not come close. Focal Utopia is not good choice imho, although ONLY in direct comparison. But with ENVY it also shines, forget its narrow(???) scene or other minor issues also described elsewhere. This is for me perfect pairing. ZMF Verite open or closed are great headphones, Meze Empyrean too, but I found Abyss and Utopia superior in most respects and in overall presentation.
So pointing out some different features of both amps-
1. Despite of high power delivered by both amps Riviera drives Abyss with more authority and słam, which is mostly prevalent with electronic music, heavy metal, rock&roll, but also with symphonic music.
2. In jazz- especially from60-ties end earlier recordings I appreciate ENVYs ability to forgive some imperfections in recordings, while Riviera does not forgive. The same with vocals. This means that with RIVIERA you see artists on scene enlighted with halogen light rather than candles….but you can easily switch tubes….
3. Symphonic works sound more monumental with Riviera, that does not mean ENVY can not create big sounstage, you rather look at music
in front of you with Riviera ,while ENVY wraps The sound around you in more intimate way.
4. Small Classic music performances are much more pleasantly presented with Envy, I can not tel why;(
5. There is really some 300b bliss in female vocals in ENVY presentation , I know it well from my previous experience with 300b amps and loudspeakers. I like it very very much, although my vocabulary is not good enough to describe it precisely.

I tried my best in remarks above but I am aware it may not satisfy your expectations, maybe I will write more but now I am just listening

SUMMING UP- in my opinion these two amps demand head to head comparison in well known system to make choice and purchase one of them. You also need to evaluate different headphones- some extraordinary surprises may happen.
Your best valued recordings may guide you as well, but be aware you can hear it like never before.
I am glad to have both amps and to share my thoughts with you. If you can- go for both and experiment. It will take years of listening pleasure to give justice to both amps.

Great write up. Thanks. Maybe to add: price of the riviera is more than double, almost triple, depending on where you buy. That will probably be a big factor for those on the search for their dream amplifier.

 

[hifixman]

It is difficult job do describe differences between these two fantastic amps. So -some common features of them both first. They both play in highest league still avaliable for reasonable price. Craftsmanship quality of these manufacture ,boutique, all handmade products is amazing. Made in small numbers will bring proud of ownership, I am positive they will stay in any collection for very long time. Overall impression after long time is that for me there are no weak points sonically, just different presentation, but on highest level - creation of 3D space, perfect sense of being there with concert recordings, finest resolution of detail, full frequency spectrum extension with deep very resolving bass reproduction, sparkling high frequency when present on recording, pure , neither accented nor smoothed midrange, explosive dynamics with
proper material, dead quiet background.
The most intriguing and also common feature for both amps is wide possibility of tubes rolling, thus creating whatever you wish and can imagine. This makes impossible to describe REAL character of both amps. I was completely satisfied when received them and started listening. All above mentioned positive remarks are atributed easily to factory units, with standard tubes. As I wrote in my previous posts I thoroughly enjoyed Riviera for couple of months and started tube rolling later on. This was amazing experience but I have to say clearly that IMHO this is personal decision of owners whether they leave The amp character as its creators intended or will search their own. With ENVY I was satisfied with Full Music upgraded tubes from The very beginning, but being aware of possible improvement ( or just a change) in sound character I started experiments with other tubes.
These experiments were not cheap, tubes are expensive but it is worth every cent to try, so much satisfaction it brings and expands my knowledge. I collected a lot of tubes that will remain in my collection, each of them bringing the new and sometimes unexpected qualities to my system. I must recall a lot of post of Head fiers that inspired me a lot- thanks!!!!
I will not mention different 12AU7 applied with Riviera-this was evaluated in detail elewhere in our thread. Instead I will underline The need to mess around with 300B tubes for ENVY. You will not regret trying WE (current production) or ELROG - by now standard version. Both will stay with me. In future I will try Molibdenium too. I did not experiment with 6sn7 leaving it for future. There is also a lot of possibilities
. The next aspect to consider is headphones choice. I had most satisfying results with RIVIERA and Abyss 1266TC, other headphones did not come close. Focal Utopia is not good choice imho, although ONLY in direct comparison. But with ENVY it also shines, forget its narrow(???) scene or other minor issues also described elsewhere. This is for me perfect pairing. ZMF Verite open or closed are great headphones, Meze Empyrean too, but I found Abyss and Utopia superior in most respects and in overall presentation.
So pointing out some different features of both amps-
1. Despite of high power delivered by both amps Riviera drives Abyss with more authority and słam, which is mostly prevalent with electronic music, heavy metal, rock&roll, but also with symphonic music.
2. In jazz- especially from60-ties end earlier recordings I appreciate ENVYs ability to forgive some imperfections in recordings, while Riviera does not forgive. The same with vocals. This means that with RIVIERA you see artists on scene enlighted with halogen light rather than candles….but you can easily switch tubes….
3. Symphonic works sound more monumental with Riviera, that does not mean ENVY can not create big sounstage, you rather look at music
in front of you with Riviera ,while ENVY wraps The sound around you in more intimate way.
4. Small Classic music performances are much more pleasantly presented with Envy, I can not tel why;(
5. There is really some 300b bliss in female vocals in ENVY presentation , I know it well from my previous experience with 300b amps and loudspeakers. I like it very very much, although my vocabulary is not good enough to describe it precisely.

I tried my best in remarks above but I am aware it may not satisfy your expectations, maybe I will write more but now I am just listening

SUMMING UP- in my opinion these two amps demand head to head comparison in well known system to make choice and purchase one of them. You also need to evaluate different headphones- some extraordinary surprises may happen.
Your best valued recordings may guide you as well, but be aware you can hear it like never before.
I am glad to have both amps and to share my thoughts with you. If you can- go for both and experiment. It will take years of listening pleasure to give justice to both amps.

I heard it in socal, simply put it doesn't have enough power to drive Susvara.

 

[Axel]

I heard it in socal, simply put it doesn't have enough power to drive Susvara.

I concur.
Listened to the ENVY with the Susvara at the HIGH END show in Munich, and it ran out of gas.

Highly enjoying the Riviera +Susvara combo, it simply is sublime. With the addition of the G-73R tube, sooo good.
Also received a new cable for the Susvara, made by Acoustic Revive (from Japan), makes this combination even better.

It has been years since such a headphones setup caused me to listen to hours over hours of music without thinking about sound quality or comfort issues.

 

[Ragnar-BY]

price of the riviera is more than double, almost triple

AIC-10 is indeed very expensive, especially after the Riviera raised prices, but it is worth noting that it is much cheaper to change tubes. Putting the best tube in AIC-10 is 200-400 euros, but I don't even know about the complete set for Envy... 2.000 - 4.000? Plus higher power - Riviera can easily replace a speaker amplifier for sensitive speakers like Klipsch. Plus longer tube life and less hassle with tube selection.

So, although this amplifier can hardly be called a bargain, it is not only for a luxury brand. The price is hard to swallow, but the manufacturer tried to sweeten the pill as best they could.

P.S. I can’t believe myself that I am now trying to rationalize the price of an amplifier with almost 20 thousand euro retail

 

[kawhia]

AIC-10 is indeed very expensive, especially after the Riviera raised prices, but it is worth noting that it is much cheaper to change tubes. Putting the best tube in AIC-10 is 200-400 euros, but I don't even know about the complete set for Envy... 2.000 - 4.000? Plus higher power - Riviera can easily replace a speaker amplifier for sensitive speakers like Klipsch. Plus longer tube life and less hassle with tube selection.

So, although this amplifier can hardly be called a bargain, it is not only for a luxury brand. The price is hard to swallow, but the manufacturer tried to sweeten the pill as best they could.

P.S. I can’t believe myself that I am now trying to rationalize the price of an amplifier with almost 20 thousand euro retail

I completely agree that it is great as an integrated amp for speakers, and the thing with changing tubes is a bargain, comparatively speaking
I am very happy with my AIC and wouldn’t want to change it with any other amp out there
However it is a very expensive piece of audio gear. No doubt about that!

 

[kawhia]

Nightmare on Elm St. I was going for a nice listening session… But the batteries of the remote for my Auralic Aries streamer are empty. AFAIK I cannot turn on the streamer without the remote. How stupid is this?!

 

[MayUseAny]

I keep experimenting with bepre 300B preamp from bottlehead. It works well for AIC-10 and I have to say so far I think it adds the desired 300B ring with a touch nicer bass without sacrificing too many sparkles along the way. Its a nice way to boost your AIC-10

 

[Spawn300Z]

I completely agree that it is great as an integrated amp for speakers, and the thing with changing tubes is a bargain, comparatively speaking
I am very happy with my AIC and wouldn’t want to change it with any other amp out there
However it is a very expensive piece of audio gear. No doubt about that!

Everything else that I believe would compare cost a fortune to tube roll or is straight solid state.

I’m still curious if it would be worth upgrading the TT2/MScaler with the Lina DAC/Clock in the chain with the Riviera. Just waiting on someone to try.

 

[normie610]

I keep experimenting with bepre 300B preamp from bottlehead. It works well for AIC-10 and I have to say so far I think it adds the desired 300B ring with a touch nicer bass without sacrificing too many sparkles along the way. Its a nice way to boost your AIC-10

300B preamp is the way to go

 

[barbz127]

Interesting that youre adding a tube pre - are you not able to get what you need from tube swapping in the AIC?

 

[Ragnar-BY]

I’m still curious if it would be worth upgrading the TT2/MScaler with the Lina DAC/Clock in the chain with the Riviera.

If you already have an M-Scaler and AIC-10 - go for DAVE. For TT2 owners DAVE is a no-brainer upgrade with only one drawback - less power at the headphone output. Which is completely irrelevant for the owner of AIС-10. This may sound unconvincing from someone who sold his DAVE but I was rather looking for a different type of sound. If you really like the way Chord DACs play - with an emphasis on detail and accuracy of sound images, then DAVE is the perfect upgrade. I would say that in terms of arranging sound images and displaying a complex recording space, this DAC is unsurpassed by anything.

 

[Spawn300Z]

If you already have an M-Scaler and AIC-10 - go for DAVE. For TT2 owners DAVE is a no-brainer upgrade with only one drawback - less power at the headphone output. Which is completely irrelevant for the owner of AIС-10. This may sound unconvincing from someone who sold his DAVE but I was rather looking for a different type of sound. If you really like the way Chord DACs play - with an emphasis on detail and accuracy of sound images, then DAVE is the perfect upgrade. I would say that in terms of arranging sound images and displaying a complex recording space, this DAC is unsurpassed by anything.

My problem is the Dave and Lina DAC is at same price point. Unless the Dave 2 is introduced or get one used at a great price. I’m not sure it’s worth it for me. Dave was released in 2015 I believe and is almost 8 years old. The Lina is also upgradable.

Plus I would move my TT2/MScaler to one of my other systems and sell one of the other setups.

 

[Axel]

I keep experimenting with bepre 300B preamp from bottlehead. It works well for AIC-10 and I have to say so far I think it adds the desired 300B ring with a touch nicer bass without sacrificing too many sparkles along the way. Its a nice way to boost your AIC-10

The AIC-10 is an integrated amplifier, I don't recall it has a direct (that bypasses the volume control) input.
How are you using a preamp with it?

 

[hifixman]

The AIC-10 is an integrated amplifier, I don't recall it has a direct (that bypasses the volume control) input.
How are you using a preamp with it?

There is a AFC-10

 

[MayUseAny]

Interesting that youre adding a tube pre - are you not able to get what you need from tube swapping in the AIC?

I tried 8 different tubes, I sue GR-73 black label and its great. I love the sound, the intensity of it etc. But 300B just ads 1-3% more bass and this harmonic feeling that 300B is known for. Its hard to describe but it makes it all more pleasurable and less intense. I love it. Changing tubes affect the sound much more, but so far GR-73 + 300B preamp is the best combination.