[Whitigir]

Reizhon4, I would audition the IM-04 along with the IM-03 together if possible.  IM-04 is the more natural type with large soundstage whereas the IM-03 is brighter which some people perceive as having more detail.  The smooth sound signature of 04 also means you can listen to it for hours.  

IM-04 out of Apex Glacier portable amp and listening to 'Chilled house Ibiza 2014' album is a treat.  The IM-04 presents the instruments in a very natural way which on EDM tracks is really beautiful to listen to.  Add to the excellent bass, the large 3d soundstage and I am finding myself surrounded by music.  I am looking outside the window to a crystal clear blue sky.  I can see the mountains on the horizon, it is indeed a beautiful day.  Listening to the sax on 'Jubel' by Klingande with this view - Sublime.

I totally agreed here, especially if you have an upgraded cable, the im04 is superb in sound stage and 3d rendering.

 

[Reizhon4]

Thanks for your answers!
 
I didn't put IM-04 into consideration first because from what I've read he need to be amped and is less tolerant / flexible with the source. I'd like to go minimalist with IEMs, no amp if possible..and it was a bit out of the budget I first decided (near 300$)
 
Reviews / feedbacks (first page for example) seems to say IM-03 is some kind of IM-02 with a bit of a warm side on it, more smooth, still transparent but more engaging, musical and natural sounding. Maybe I might like that. Is IM04 more on a warmer side? Are we really talking about really significant differences between IM03 and 04?
 
Does someone knows how IM03 would compare with ath-CKR9? FX850? or FA-4Exb?
 
Wich one could be the best for musical genre I mentioned? 

 

[Malevolent]

Just received my Lunashops cables and I must say, they fit so much better than the (terrible) stock cables.
 
Sound wise, I couldn't tell a difference, but still, I'm a happy camper, now that I don't have to constantly fiddle with the memory wires to fit around my ears.
 
Plus, they look great! Well worth the cost.
 

 

[Gandasaputra]

Just received my Lunashops cables and I must say, they fit so much better than the (terrible) stock cables.

Sound wise, I couldn't tell a difference, but still, I'm a happy camper, now that I don't have to constantly fiddle with the memory wires to fit around my ears.

Plus, they look great! Well worth the cost.

I agree, I bought that clothed luna csble for my im03. The cable glides around my ear comfrotably yet it doesnt affect the sound either, as far as I know. Which one do you put that cable for?

 

[chailee80]

  I’ve read this whole (quite big!) thread as I might be interested with IM03.
 
I’m looking for IEM mostly for Jazz (no vocal at all, piano and saxophones matter the most) classical (baroque, ancient music with sings sometimes) ambient, avantgarde, world (traditional acoustic instruments) with a few voices too and just little trip-hop, psych rock (but I might probably use a different IEM for that) 
 
So I’m looking for something with the most natural sound, well balanced, precise with good details but not too analytic and cold I guess, a bit of an aerial, overhead sound with widest soundstage possible, not tiring to listen for long period. Would the IM03 be a good idea? Or maybe another IEM to advice for those purposes? 
 
I don’t have a big experience yet with those midrange - highend IEM so sorry to ask, I know it’s not comparable but when reading « wide soundstage » for ATH-IM series, is it something approaching a bit from an open full size headphones? something we could believe coming from outside the head, or still really inside the head, frontal and lateral? I’m actually listening my music with a Beyer DT770 250ohms (amped with dac) who doesn't really suit my expectations for the above-mentionned musical genres.. so I guess it should be easy to have something more opened..maybe even with IEM? 

 
As for my source, it will be an iPhone 6 for now and I will probably invest in a dedicated DAP like AK120 later. Would it be a good match with IM03 and a big improvement from the iphone for IM03? 
 
Thanks for your help! 

Sounds like you might want to take a look at final audio's heaven iem lineup. They work quite well with the genres you listed and have a very wide soundstage for an iem. The only iem i've heard that has that outside your head feel is final audio's piano forte series but they are crazy expensive. None of the ath-im series has really wowed me with its soundstage, they all sound fairly average for an iem to my ears. That being said the im02 is very good for its price, very natural, nicely balanced, good details, fairly smooth up top with a touch of warmth down the bottom. Bass can be a bit lacking for large orchestral pieces, some people feel the need to eq it up a bit.
You would have been better off with the beyer dt880 imo, much more open and suited to those genres imo.

 

[Reizhon4]

Thanks for the recommendation for Final audio's, I'll dig into that.
 
I agree with the price point of im02, it's a good argument for it but I'm afraid it would too cold and chirurgical and bad for long period compared to IM03 (still from feedbacks I've read..) what do you think?
 
As for DT770, it was initially to play piano at night and watch movies hehe, I will probably look for a DT880 or HD600-650 later.

 

[Raketen]

I find classical quite enjoyable on the IM02, jazz as well. It's a great all-rounder imo, though not for for some older/suboptimal recordings (or poor rips/compression) which might be a bit of a problem if you have a lot of vintage classical.

Don't find it particularly 'cold' or very fatiguing either (hearing-wise, fit is...), though I tend to like a bit of brightness - i find it's under that line for me where the treble/details are present without being aggressive- suppose it depends on what you're used to (my most used pair of headphones is HD 25 which a lot of people seem to find aggresively bright (though they also get praised as relatively flat so idk, maybe my opinion is totally invalid here

).
 
per consensus, I guess the main thing it lacks is that extra little bit of bass/low-mid sustain/'warmth' - which seems to be what you are fearing (though I don't miss it too much in jazz/classical, for instance the other day was listening to Yusef Lateef's "Eastern Sounds' album which has some nice stand up bass in it, and sounded great on the IM02). Actually looking for a 'warm' companion to the IM02 myself within the next year- mainly split between im03 and Sony XBA-H3, slightly leaning to Sony, though possibly I'm just a little too taken with the idea of trying a hybrid in-ear next. Have you looked into the H3 at all?

 

[Reizhon4]

Helpful, thank you. I'm listening mostly contemporary classical and jazz (Ecm records as a good example of it) and post bop jazz stuffs, many piano generally with lossless files or 320kbps so old recordings/bad compression won"t be a big problem I guess..
 
Do you think im02 gives enough body to a piano solo or a tenor saxophone for example? That might be where what you called that "extra little bit of bass/low-mid sustain/'warmth" could be important right? I don't think I want something really warm in general, just a compromise between great details, transparence and soundstage (as it seems to be a good idea for contemporary acoustic stuffs right?), and a bit warm mids to give pianos / saxophones / vocals a mellow, full bodied, natural texture (as it seems to be a good idea for jazz 

) and enough bass to let a double bass give a good scope to the song without disturbing the rest..I don't know if this can be reconciled in one IEM.. 
 
I haven't looked into H3 yet, I will probably. What can you tell about those?
And what do you find tiresome with the fit of im02 exactly?

 

[Malevolent]

I agree, I bought that clothed luna csble for my im03. The cable glides around my ear comfrotably yet it doesnt affect the sound either, as far as I know. Which one do you put that cable for?

 
Yup, that's why I got them. I love the feeling of the cables just gently resting over the back of your ears, and not hanging out thanks to those pesky memory wires. 

 
I got one for my IM04, and another for my IM50/70. Though my wife is looking to steal the all-black cloth cable for her IM02. She'll trade it for a Nobunaga Labs cable, which is a little too rigid for her liking.

 

[Raketen]

.

 

[Gandasaputra]

 
 
I got one for my IM04, and another for my IM50/70. Though my wife is looking to steal the all-black cloth cable for her IM02. She'll trade it for a Nobunaga Labs cable, which is a little too rigid for her liking.

 
Let me know if you find a difference in IM50/70 sound quality when the lunashop cable is used. I found the IM70 sounds under-powered with the lunashop cable attached, so the IM70 is better left with the stock cable.

 

[ZapX629]

  Does someone knows how IM03 would compare with ath-CKR9? FX850? or FA-4Exb?
 
Wich one could be the best for musical genre I mentioned? 

I don't have first hand experience with the others, but I can say that for anything acoustic, the CKR9 are absolutely heavenly. The sense of realism in the music is just wonderful. Jazz, World, Baroque, and Medieval sound sublime and are my absolute favorites to listen to with these IEMs. I've never heard acoustic or wind instruments sound better from an IEM. The timbres and resonances are hauntingly gorgeous, the sense of space in the room, theater, or club is excellently replicated, and the music is euphoric. The kind of thing you want to close your eyes and get lost in. The bass is the most detailed and pristine I've ever heard, to the point you often feel you're listening to speakers. Nothing is wasted or offensive, but it's all there when you need it. I don't mean to gush about them so fervently, but for the kind of thing you (and myself) listen to, it'd be a crime not to at least check them out. 

 

[Malevolent]

 
Let me know if you find a difference in IM50/70 sound quality when the lunashop cable is used. I found the IM70 sounds under-powered with the lunashop cable attached, so the IM70 is better left with the stock cable.

 
Sure, will do. Will have time over the weekend to do a test between the stock and Lunashop cables. Anyway, my wife has stolen the all-black cloth cable from me, and I'm stuck with her Nobunaga cable. 

 It's thin and light, but not very supple. Still better than the stock cable in terms of comfort anytime of the day, though.

 

[Reizhon4]

 

   
A little tough for me to say as I'm not really an audiophile type listener and a bit forgetful so I contentedly adapt to different headphones fairly quickly. I do happen to own the 32 ohm variant of the 770s and just for kicks made some comparisons with randomly selected tracks (well, mostly determined by foobar search for 'ecm' in my rather erratically tagged library). Yeah, it's ludicrous comparing over ears to an in-ear, but maybe gives some sense and also was a fun exercise for my nightly listening as I hardly ever do any compartive listening 

Boulez Conducts-  Mahler Symphony #8 - Though the soundstage isnt' great, this probably isn't a great recording for headphones to begin with. Considering that, the IM02 handles it ok, a little better than the 770s, which i think get a lot of their sense of relative spaciousness from the mids sounding a bit quiet, but weirdly has almost the opposite effect from this full orchestra and choir and seems to be missing a lot of substance.
Thomasz Stanko Quartet - 'Suspended Variation I' - 02 handles this type of bass quite well, and each of the quartet instruments (sax,bass,piano,drums) feels full bodied to me, again the bass of 770s is better, but otherwise they are par for a fairly intimate recording.
John Hassell - 'The Moon Came in...' - gosh, forgot how pretty this track is, sounds great on 770s but that kinda sub-bass resonance is lacking on IM02 in direct comparison, though it handles rest of the track nicely kinda misses that sense of space too.
Arvo Part - 'Litany', like the Mahler, a bit narrow/crowded on the 02, otherwise clear, a little to forward, though I think this one sounds better than the mahler on the 770s.
Eberhard Weber - 'Seven Movements' - IM02 actually handles this really well, on par w/ 770 - it's all upper register flanged bass combined w/ sax, and the sense of space is enchanced as its from a live recording and the 02 is pretty adept in those ranges that express reverb i guess.
Annette Peacock - Tho An intimate kind of track, with female vocals which the 02 handles really well, piano and strings very well presented, I'd give slight preference to 02.
Lester Bowie - 'No ****'  oddball brass-heavy song in a kinda oddball mix- has some shrill trumpet which penetrates a bit harsh on the 770s but again the 02 rolls off in a forgiving way (though still might make some ears bleed), but also has a rolling tuba beat in the background that still has presence on the 02.
Jack Dejonette - 'India' I think this sounds really good with the extra soundstage of the 770s (which in my limited experience is pretty decent for closed-back), maybe a little too forward on the 02 with the sax solos being too upfront, but the bass, drums and baritone clarinet sound really great.
Luciano Berio - 'Naturale', very sparse viola track with some percussion and folk vocals, sounds just great on the 02 to me, which really captures all the reverby details, surprisingly preferred 02 to 770.
Keith Jarrett - Shostakovich-  Prelude and Fugue No. 13 in F sharp major, solo piano, kinda similar reverby room to the berio track but with warmer acoustics which gives 770s stage some advantage, but sounds very good on the 02.
Vijay Iyer & Rudresh Mahanthappa - 'Rataplan'  - this has a lot of piano low-end and harshly bright saxophone mix- really penetrating on the 770s but the IM02 rolls off a bit right below that. On the 770s the pianos low end feels a bit like a black hole the sax is stabbing out from, on the 02 it loses that rumble to its detriment... i'd say neither phone handles it particularly well, maybe the recording quality isn't so great either.
Enrique Batiz conducts Ginastera- Harp Concerto - I think this one full orchestra recording sounds a lot better on the 02 compared to some of the others I've tried, not exactly sure why- maybe just due to favorable dynamics and headphone friendly stereo mixing - or my brain has completely adjusted to the 02s for tonight.
 
*edit* Also did some sampling of more piano stuff: Ravel from Angela Hewitt, is a bit odd-  with the Sonatine 'anime' section i found the placement/imaging very nice but not particularly spacious. Feels a bit too forward,  but then the v-ish response on my JVC 90s has details that feel a bit more 'sparkly' and spacious though I genrally find it a lot more direct/narrow in presentation than the IM02. Marc Andre Hamelin playing Godowsky's Passacaglia '44, which is a fairly dark recording that I would think benifit from IM02 presentation- also think sounds better with the fxt90 (I have listened to it a lot on the HD25s which are very direct/closed presentation).  Could just be a matter of my particular taste... not that the 02 sounds bad with them (and it's bass sounds fairly similar to the 90's for me) but maybe I am reacting against the stronger mids? On the other hand, I listened to some jazz tracks on Ran Blake's 'Driftwoods' and 'All that is Tied, and Paul Bley's 'Open to Love' and preferred the IM02- i think these records have much more obvious room sound than the classical recordings, which 02 represents very well. I think earfonia's original review stated that the 02 tends to emphasize mids a bit and the 03 the highs a bit, so maybe the 03 could be good (for my taste, at least) if it has slightly de-emphasized mids compared to the 02 (unfortunately no graph for the 03 on goldenears).
 
Like I mentioned before, I don't find them to be particularly 'cold', but they do present recordings 'as is' (aside from pleasant details) without much illusion of spaciousness- definately in-head, but fine separation/imaging within that and better than my other in-ears (though I've only heard the "budget" end of the spectrum (JVC fXT90s, Yamaha EPH100, Denon 751, Etymotic 6)). For "naturally textured, full bodied" acoustic piano/sax/vocals- I feel like it is very recording dependant, it won't add anything that isn't there already, but the details convey texture well and I think it will present those instruments very well depending on the mix.  I have come around a bit to your fears about soundstage after trying various orchestral pieces (and also losing out on certain types of bass response, in spite of otherwise solid bass representation), but I think that's pretty common with IEM, hardly unique to the im02- even my 770s weren't much of an improvment, in spite of what in my limited experience is a decent soundstage for closed phones. Really makes me wish I could try the 03 or those Final Audios out- maybe some of the open in-ear designs do well with that too?
 

(fit issues- it's just a bit odd for my ears, a few others on the thread have mentioned as well- for a good fit they seem to either sit deep, comfortably inside the outer ear or shallow, with the nozzle resting on the outer ear and the driver housing completely outside, supported by the cable. - mine it rests right on the edge with my normal medium tips, and the nozzle is too wide for me to use small tips & deeper fit for any length of time, so I have to use a spacer and the large tips to make a comfortable shallow fit, does affect the sound a bit, albiet subtly. There are various solutins people have come up with if you look through the thread pictures. )
 
As to the H3, I've only done a little reading but its supposed to have a fairly warm sound, with the idea behind the hybrid thing is that you can combine the  mid&high of balanced armature drivers, with the low-end friendly properties of a dynamic/coil driver... that, and it just looks kinda cool 

 

 
 
Wow, that’s a great listening comparaison, feedback, wasn’t expecting you would compare with DT770! As I have them myself (250ohms) I’ve been listening to few of the songs of your playlist while reading your thoughts and compare. I don’t want to get off topic too much so I hope few others will also be interrested here with Beyer comparaison maybe..
 
May I ask what was your source/DAP for the listening? 
As for i’m concerned I’ve listened through 320kps streaming services or my lossless files when I had the titles, all through a decent dac I guess (upgraded Maverick Tubemagic D2) and vintage Marantz amp wich might tend to give a real warm coloration, some little background noise and al.l (I’ll upgrade for a headphone/iem amp soon).That’s probably not ideal, but to catch up I know that dac gives a pretty decent soundstage usually, with good separation between instruments. 
 
Tomasz Stanko Quartet - 'Suspended Variation I'
 
I’ve been listening a lot of Stanko with Beyer actually, I agree it’s decent but in that specific song or other, piano lacks of details to me, sounds like « cloudy » (I’ll have to come to a more specific description but that the best adjective that comes now..) but that’s something a I always reproached with my piano listenings and beyer.. It’s something arround the mids being too backwards I think. The whole song doesn’t clearly lack body as you said but I think DT770 is not good for details either here. i thought IM02 being analytical and all would have a little advantage for that specifically.
 
John Hassell - 'The Moon Came in...' Didn’t know that one, nice relaxing song. Althought i’ll not give impressions on it (youtube, live recording

)
 
Arvo Part - 'Litany',
I enjoy DT770 with this and generally Arvo part, not too bad, except maybe when it gets crowdy, tends to lacks of details. not clear enough I think. (I’m pretty sure DT880, HD600 would do better here.) 
 
Eberhard Weber - 'Seven Movements'  Won’t comment either (bad youtube sound) but if im02 handles this as you says, that should work for other Jan Garbarek stuffs too! I think thoses songs are living if soprano saxophone is not too restrained as it’s tend to be the case with DT770..
 
Annette Peacock - Tho 
Good to know it works here with Im02, as I enjoy that kind of piano sounding, vocal jazz song register. Would you say IM02 is enjoyable enough for intimate piano/vocal stuffs then? From what I understood, IM03 should me even more enjoyable with the extra warm giving natural texture to vocals.
 
Lester Bowie - 'No s** t : Usually those oddballs mix doesn’t sound bad on DT770 but I agree with the harsch trumpet here. Good to know the background tuba still exist here with IM02 as I hear it from far away in Beyer 

 
Jack Dejonette - 'India’. I tend to agree with you about the beyer soundstage here, good stereo image, enjoyable to listen but same reproach as for the Tomasz Stanko song about « cloudy » piano in the begining of the song. I have to dig into that!
 
Luciano Berio - 'Naturale' Well, that’s the kind of stuffs I love listening to chill out, so that’s good if im02 gives the reverbs and the whole atmosphere of this.
 
At the end, I think I should have to start somewhere and decide what could be the closest to the sound I’m expecting. I’m not really exigent I think (for now, head-fi readings might change that

), just like to optimize the most for the money I spend hehe. But choosing without references to compare might drive me crazy quite fast! I already appreciate Beyer sounding for what it is (even if it comparing with iem might be a bad idea), I just want something a little more clear, transparent, keep a good soundstage, some bass when needed and a little warm in the mids as I said before. Your comparaison for that is very helpful, thank you! Too bad you couldn’t compare to im03! But I'm thinking maybe it would be too big of a jump to go blind straight forward with IM03, taking into consideration it’s 100$ more expensive.. What do you think? 
Since I have to choose another headphone (DT880, HD600, K701…) and headphone amp, those 100 might be better invested in that first I guess.
 
What reference(s) of Final Audios were you thinking about?
 
My last listening experience with Beyers recently was with Lo-Jo « 310 lunes » (studio mastering) if you have the possibilities to listen to it. It’s a nice album, well recorded I think. I would be interested to see hear your impressions and how it sound on IM02!
Regarding the whole album, I could say beyer gives a decent soundstage here (still, for closed up headphones I guess), just a few instruments being presented in a too frontal way in terms of space and sometimes backwards in terms of pure sounding (Truffaz trumpet here for example https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XUO9UUW_Bnc) General impression make me think it could get tiresome to listen for long, not sure why but I think it’s something related to the presentation of instruments in space. I don't know how would that be with im02.. Anyway, feel free to give your impressions if you can!
 
 
 
 

 

[Reizhon4]

  I don't have first hand experience with the others, but I can say that for anything acoustic, the CKR9 are absolutely heavenly. The sense of realism in the music is just wonderful. Jazz, World, Baroque, and Medieval sound sublime and are my absolute favorites to listen to with these IEMs. I've never heard acoustic or wind instruments sound better from an IEM. The timbres and resonances are hauntingly gorgeous, the sense of space in the room, theater, or club is excellently replicated, and the music is euphoric. The kind of thing you want to close your eyes and get lost in. The bass is the most detailed and pristine I've ever heard, to the point you often feel you're listening to speakers. Nothing is wasted or offensive, but it's all there when you need it. I don't mean to gush about them so fervently, but for the kind of thing you (and myself) listen to, it'd be a crime not to at least check them out. 

Thank for the recommandation, I've come to read your detailed review too, you seems to have a lot of enthusiasm in every words about them! 

 I really like the description you make of them, close to what I'm looking for. I'm still thinking about CKR9 as a good challenger, as they seems to be pretty good ones for the price asked (still considering IM03 being more expensive) 
I was just wondering about the microphonics, as they seems to be present. I truly hate that and the fact that cable doesn't seems to be upgradable to kill them could be a deal breaker for me if they are really annoying. Is it disturbing you? Do you have a good tolerance for microphonics normally? 
 
May I ask what are your sources/DAP with it? Do you think an iphone 6 would drive them good?

Finally a stupid but practical question regarding the fit. I often fall asleep with my others (little) IEMs, would you see it as something possible with CKR9? If that's really "the kind of thing you want to close your eyes and get lost in" that might happen quite frequently 

  That's something I'm wondering about for IM03 too, as they seems to be bigger than IM02 too..