[scrypt]

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Originally posted by Matthew-Spaltro Metal = white trash huh. Then how come everyone I know who listens to metal are some of the nicest people you could ever meet in your life. I'm sure they would take great offense to you calling most metal listeners "white trash".

See above. I used the term White Trash ironically to refer to the lords of misappropriated myth (like Varg), not "most metal listeners." I thought that people would get the joke. Perhaps I didn't say it clearly enough.

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Oh and by the way Jon Lord and Ritchie Blackmore are two of the most talented (or pretty close) muscians in the world on their instruments. For you to call them "cliche" is rude and just not true at all. I could talk about rap music being cliche all day but I won't. I'm taking the high road on this.

Nice of you *not* to say you think rap is cliche. How's the high road look from your vantage, Spaltro?

I've had to bite my tongue about Blackmore and Lord many times in the company of people who hated rap. I myself have taken the high road and said nothing many many times. But after reading the bajillionth post about how bad rap is, I have to interject that I don't respect the gods of metal, either.

If you want to love and appreciate Deep Purple and its off-shoots, don't let me stop you. But people have the right to call things cliche that seem so. And while I can understand why you might respect their musicianship, it would be nice if you could understand that I have reasons for not respecting it. If I told you what I truly think of rock music and its effect on society, the Theodor Adorno overtones would result in my having far more people than you and my esteemed colleague, KR, on my ass.

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Most metal lovers that I meet enjoy all kinds of different styles. Classical, soft rock, and some even enjoy hip hop and rap.

Then consider yourself blessed. My experience growing up and being in NYC has been far different -- though I've yet to meet a metal musician who didn't respect classical music.

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Why should I apologize for not liking rap music?

No one has to apologize for disliking a certain kind of music -- not me for disliking metal, not you for disliking rap. But it would be nice if the people who went on and on about how "rap sucks" and "isn't music" stopped and thought about what they were saying. It was having to listen to the racist opinions and embarrassing music of metal musicians in NYC that made me decide to stop making my living as a studio musician for a few years. I've no doubt that attitudes have improved in recent years, but this thread hasn't helped to convince me.

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Sterotypes are dangerous.

Let that be the lesson of this thread.

 

[Matthew-Spaltro]

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Originally posted by scrypt See above. I used the term White Trash ironically to refer to the lords of misappropriated myth (like Varg), not "most metal listeners." I thought that people would get the joke. Perhaps I didn't say it clearly enough.

Okay. Fair enough.

"Nice of you *not* to say you think rap is cliche. How's the high road look from your vantage, Spaltro?"

Okay. That is a good point allso.


"I've had to bite my tongue about Blackmore and Lord many times in the company of people who hated rap. I myself have taken the high road and said nothing many many times. But after reading the bajillionth post about how bad rap is, I have to interject that I don't respect the gods of metal, either."

Why would you dis respect or respect Deep Purple when you have not meet the members of the band in person

"But it would be nice if the people who went on and on about how "rap sucks" and "isn't music" stopped and thought about what they were saying."


To be fair to me. I never said that rap "sucked" or "isn't music"

That yo yo comment I made earlier was just a joke. I guess I should have put a smiley next to it.

 

[Matthew-Spaltro]

BTW Scrypt why would you dis respect Deep Purple for good musicanship? That is a good thing. Is it because they rubbed it in people's face's instead of concentrating on the melodies?

 

[OriginalReaper]

Rap isn't even a music style (hip-hop is). Rap is a voical/lyrical style. By saying all rap sucks, you are also saying that Rage Against the Machine sucked, because Zack de la Rocha rapped. Zach's stuff is deep, strong, exciting, and has nice metaphors.


"With poetry I paint the pictures that hit
More like the murals that fit
Don't turn away
Get in front of it

\/chorus\/
Brotha, did ya forget ya name?
Did ya lose it on the wall
Playin' tic-tac-toe?
^chorus^

Yo, check the diagonal
Three brothers gone
Come on
Doesn't that make it three in a row?

[chorus]

Yo, check the diagonal
Three million gone
Come on
'Cause they're counting backwards to zero"

Now, give this guy (and rap) some credit and maybeyou'll realize there are others like him out there.

 

[williamgoody]

I hate to say it, but this should be a lesson as to how the words we use to convey opinions really affect and influence others.

Metalhead started this thread around the connotation that "Rap sucks", which I'm sure came from his opinion of Rap.

If he had stated his feeling as more connotative of his actual opinion, i.e. "I really don't like Rap", I'm sure there would be some "less emotional" discussions going on here.

It's all in the words you choose to use.

 

[Matthew-Spaltro]

I said I didn't like the art of rapping. I did not say there arn't any rappers who have talent. I choose my words just fine.

 

[wahoox2]

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I hate to say it, but this should be a lesson as to how the words we use to convey opinions really affect and influence others. Metalhead started this thread around the connotation that "Rap sucks", which I'm sure came from his opinion of Rap. If he had stated his feeling as more connotative of his actual opinion, i.e. "I really don't like Rap", I'm sure there would be some "less emotional" discussions going on here. It's all in the words you choose to use.

You have got to be kidding. Metalhead stated his opinion. HE IS ENTITLED TO IT. He started a thread for all of us that are in agreement with him, and you are going to defend the thread-crappers?
Give me a break.
I take what I said about some of the folks in this thread being like Jehovah's Witnesses.
You folks are closer to like Nazi's, pushing your beliefs down other people's throats, because you feel they aren't "cultured"; or haven't heard "good rap". Or you want the "reasons" for not liking it, like we need to validate our likes/dislikes to you.
Not everyone is going to like EVERYTHING.
Deal with it, and stop thread-crapping. Start a "COME HERE TO CONVERT" thread if you want to "teach" everyone the virtues of rap.

 

[williamgoody]

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Originally posted by wahoox2 You have got to be kidding. Metalhead stated his opinion. HE IS ENTITLED TO IT. He started a thread for all of us that are in agreement with him, and you are going to defend the thread-crappers? Give me a break. I take what I said about some of the folks in this thread being like Jehovah's Witnesses. You folks are closer to like Nazi's, pushing your beliefs down other people's throats, because you feel they aren't "cultured"; or haven't heard "good rap". Or you want the "reasons" for not liking it, like we need to validate our likes/dislikes to you. Not everyone is going to like EVERYTHING. Deal with it, and stop thread-crapping. Start a "COME HERE TO CONVERT" thread if you want to "teach" everyone the virtues of rap.

Obviously you can't read.

Did I say he was not entitled to his opinion? Did I say he was wrong? Did I defend rap in that last post in any way, shape, or form?

All I said was that if he chose what could be a potential better choice of words to convey his opinion, instead of condemning an entire "genre" of music (which I believe I pointed out about myself that I'm not a big fan of most of it), people might not be so quick to question and return the condemnation.

Now go learn how to read.

Matthew, I wasn't singling you out at all, just making a point.

 

[wahoox2]

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Matthew, I wasn't singling you out at all, just making a point

Nor was I singling you out, william. Other than my "you've got to be kidding" remark, the rest was aimed at others.

 

[williamgoody]

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Originally posted by wahoox2 Nor was I singling you out, william. Other than my "you've got to be kidding" remark, the rest was aimed at others.

Gotcha, appreciate the explanation.

It's all good.

 

[Matthew-Spaltro]

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Originally posted by williamgoody Matthew, I wasn't singling you out at all, just making a point.

It was the words you choosed

 

[KR...]

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Exactly -- you are so removed from reading what I've said that you deny the possibility of a preponderance of empirical evidence and instead spout your usual generalizations. You seem unable to analyze a single statement on your own -- all you can do gesture nebulously and make inarticulate non-reasoned references to "the truth": "The Truth Is out There."

Pseudo-intellectualism... got to love it. You are too much, LOL!!!

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Gosh, KR -- and here I thought you were the fount of web knowlege, the one who was going to inform us all about matters esoteric and topical. It never occurred to me that you'd be uninterested in a potential source of musical information.

Most of my research is not done on-line. However, when I posted several theories and facts in other threads, certain people just didn't believe me, so I had to show them something. As far posting trivia and links, I am only trying to help people out. I don't understand how you took this the wrong way. Part of this website is helping each other out, what's wrong with that?

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What did you say moments ago about *my* knowing nothing about metal? Yes, yes, of course -- no self-respecting metal band has *ever* used keyboards. I don't have to "convince" someone who fails to do his homework.

Sorry to have hurt your feeling there, that was just a little joke. Most of the bands I listen to use keyboards. So wipe your tears away little guy, you will be ok.

(note: Before you get sad again, that also was a joke)

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Fascinating -- the sessions I did for years and decade of experience with bands are reducible to "hanging out with a bunch of idiots" instead of amounting to the kind of research journalists do routinely while writing a story.

Hey, you called them racist and you couldn't stand to be around them, you made them come off as being idiots. They sound like real jerks that give metal a bad name, so **** them. I was agreeing with you! Stop being so damn pessimistic.

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And while we're on the subject: I didn't "paintbrush" an entire *genre of music*.

cough...

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And of course metal is, among other things, the soundtrack of the white trash of the world -- it's as true in Oslo as it is in the States.

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Thank you, Dr. McCoy.

Way to make fun of me for not being racist.

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How could he? He's in jail.

He has release two full albums since being in jail. He has also went to say that metal is ... well I won't repeat that. But, let's just say that he denounce all metal and rock music and leave it at that.

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It's you who has continually told people they were ignorant, therefore it's you who should "already know" about the existence of every genus of metal, rap and Serbo-Croatian zydeco in the known universe.

That's right, I know everything about everything. Thanks for pointing that out.

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Again, through your verbal alchemy, I have become not a person who may use the word *white trash* ironically because he is white, but rather a white person who feels free to use the N word. And yet there is not one instance anywhere in the world -- in a book, on a forum, in an interview -- in which I've used the N word. And to call ignorant every single black person who has ever used that word in any context is itself a bit spare on the book-learnin'.

How in the hell did you make that jump?

Here is what I said :

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Truth be known that NO, and I repeat NO self respecting black person would ever call themselves that term or use it when referring to their friends. The ones that do are ignorant period, that includes you as well.

Do you not get that it's not ok to call white people, poor or not, metal fan or not, white trash, and even more so if you are white. Same thing goes for any racist term. Why is this so hard for you to understand? This is not about being PC, this is about having self-repect and being a decent person.

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Really, a lot of this pointless debate could have been cleared up if you'd paid attention and noticed that I spoke of metal musicians who hated rap, not all metal.

Yet many metal musicians who hate rap also like Jazz and Blues. So it's not a racist thing. They just don't like rap. Not everyone who doesn't like rap is a racist or "unconsciously racist" sorry to break this to you.

 

[MetalHead666]

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Originally posted by OriginalReaper Rap isn't even a music style (hip-hop is). Rap is a voical/lyrical style. By saying all rap sucks, you are also saying that Rage Against the Machine sucked, because Zack de la Rocha rapped. Zach's stuff is deep, strong, exciting, and has nice metaphors.

Hey, I have nothing against rap/metal or rap/rock, I like rage against the machine a lot. The only reason I don't like rap is because there is no music in it.

 

[KR...]

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KR... if you honestly believe that blacks only refer to each other as "nigga" in music and movies then you've been living in suburbia too long. It's VERY common.

I don't live in suburbia. I know it's very common, and it's sad, sad state of affairs. There are however a lot of black people who also feel that it's very degrading and wish they would stop. What can I say.

Read this : http://www.ferris.edu/news/jimcrow/caricature/

 

[williamgoody]

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Originally posted by MetalHead666 Hey, I have nothing against rap/metal or rap/rock, I like rage against the machine a lot. The only reason I don't like rap is because there is no music in it.

Not for nothing man, but could you knock it off with the sweeping generalizations?