[Fargeg]

Some more food for thought (or at least something that I've noticed) is that dips and peaks in other parts of the FR can also affect perception of bass. BA drivers beget more tuning flexibility; just in general, they should allow for more granularity in dialing in certain bass characteristics.

If you measure how pinna activation affects perceived loudspeaker frequency response, phase cancellation creates a pretty deep upper treble notch around 10 kHz. The roll-off past the ~8 kHz resonance caused by plugging up the ear canal tends to create a similar notch in IEMs.

I find the depth/shape of this notch and the overall upper treble quantity relative to bass amount to be closely linked to bass quality in both headphones and IEMs, so I deliberately reshape the dip with EQ by ear when I've got a craving for more tactility, slam, and/or texture. My current MH755 preset looks like this:



My guess regarding why BA bass tends to sound worse than DD bass is that single BA drivers struggle to properly replicate the full-range performance of high-quality DDs, while using separate BAs for bass and treble to compensate introduces incoherency in bass/treble presentation that's extremely hard to eliminate.

 

[Precogvision]

Meetup Notes 10/15/2022

Hey everyone, some quick notes from this weekend! We haven't had a meetup in a while, so it was good to get together and see some new faces too. Thanks as usual to @MRSallee for hosting

Left-to-right: me, Juan, Mark, @Cameleon303, Kyle, Chitoh

Audeze MM 500: Wow, an Audeze that's actually got some respectable tuning. These follow in the LCD-5's footsteps (a headphone that I'm not a big fan of), but it sounds like the shouty upper-midrange of its bigger brother has been pulled back a bit. Bass sounds slightly rolled under 50Hz, although I'm fairly certain that, like most planar headphones, these probably have very good extension on paper. In any case, bass notes sound slightly blunted for impact to me. Treble sounded fairly neutral. Decent sense of technicalities; I wouldn't consider these best-in-class for detail, but they're good all-rounders. The build on this headphone is also pretty damn nice. Probably my favorite Audeze headphone to date if we're ignoring the use of DSP (in which case, I wouldn't know which is my favorite).

Audio Hekili: The Hekili has a very sizable amount of bass boost that's mostly under 200Hz, but that comes across slightly bloated, perhaps at around ~150Hz. Nice bass overall, very fun. This does affect lower-midrange timbre by giving it a slightly thicker body. Upper-midrange is conventionally structured with some slight recession from 3-4kHz, and then the Hekili actually has some pretty respectable extension via a series of upper-treble peaks. I can't remember what the Lokahi - its predecessor - sounded like at this point, but I think this is better overall. It doesn't necessarily sound more natural, but the tonality is more palatable. I'd probably place this at around the ~$500 mark blind, which is why I was mildly surprised when I checked the price. Good stuff.

Fiio FH7s: Not bad. This is more or less what I associate with being one of the better examples of Fiio's "house sound". This means good amounts of warmth from a heavy (and bloated) bass shelf, a conventional rise for the ear compensation, and then a spike somewhere in the mid-treble for sparkle. I guess you could call this something like Andromeda tuning with upper-midrange. B-tier sense of technicalities or so. Fun, decent enough IEM, although I'm not sure if it's worth the $400 price.

Moondrop Stellaris: These don't sound good. The level of ear compensation at 3kHz is well into shrill territory, and this is followed by a series of uncontrolled peaks in the treble. The ergonomics of this IEM is also the stuff of nightmares. Really not sure what Moondrop was thinking with this release, but it's a miss from me, at least relative to the other planar IEMs on the market and the standard they've set as a brand. Only thing this...well, thing might have going for it is its sense of detail and that's a stretch.

Moondrop Void: These sound decent enough. No major peaks or valleys that I could really hear in the ten minutes or so that I put on them. I would say that they have a slightly artificial timbre in general. Basically, they sound sort of "cheap" when it comes to a sense of technicalities. Vocals are hard to pin-point in the head and staging is two blob, perhaps not unlike the Sennheiser HD6XX series. Normally I wouldn't comment on this, but the build of the Void is reminiscent of something you might expect from a $20 pair of Amazon Basics headphones. These need some work, especially if they're supposed to be competing with something like the HD6XX.

Some other odds and ends that I heard, and lots of re-listens. Heard the CFA Ara, B2 Dusk, IE600, Monarch MKII, S8, Meze 109 Pro, and some others again. Not too much has changed for me in terms of my impressions on those. Borrowed Chitoh's IER-Z1R though, so that's probably going to get re-ranked. Been meaning to make some updates to my ranking list for a while, just haven't gotten around to it.

 

[DaveStarWalker]

Fiio FH7s: Not bad. This is more or less what I associate with being one of the better examples of Fiio's "house sound". This means good amounts of warmth from a heavy (and bloated) bass shelf, a conventional rise for the ear compensation, and then a spike somewhere in the mid-treble for sparkle. I guess you could call this something like Andromeda tuning with upper-midrange. B-tier sense of technicalities or so. Fun, decent enough IEM, although I'm not sure if it's worth the $400 price.

Hi,

I am surprising by that statement.

Because this is absolutely not the case of its big brother, the FH9...

But it is said that the FH7s and FH9 share a comparable low-end spectrum...

Also for the technical side. I have not listened to the FH7s so I have no opinion, but I compared the FH9 to the most technical in-ear monitors on the market = no problem.

About the tuning, the same. As much as the U12T for instance is a very generic tuning (and not very exciting, by my standards), this is not the case at all of the FH9... of which the FH7s is said to be a "safer" version.

Well, subjective linstening sessions can definitely take us down very different paths, but obviously we don't hear the same things at all, and in the same way.
That being said, I have not listened to the FH7s. So no real opinion, but surprised by what I just read.

 

[raphaos]

Meetup Notes 10/15/2022

Hey everyone, some quick notes from this weekend! We haven't had a meetup in a while, so it was good to get together and see some new faces too. Thanks as usual to @MRSallee for hosting



Left-to-right: me, Juan, Mark, @Cameleon303, Kyle, Chitoh

Audeze MM 500: Wow, an Audeze that's actually got some respectable tuning. These follow in the LCD-5's footsteps (a headphone that I'm not a big fan of), but it sounds like the shouty upper-midrange of its bigger brother has been pulled back a bit. Bass sounds slightly rolled under 50Hz, although I'm fairly certain that, like most planar headphones, these probably have very good extension on paper. In any case, bass notes sound slightly blunted for impact to me. Treble sounded fairly neutral. Decent sense of technicalities; I wouldn't consider these best-in-class for detail, but they're good all-rounders. The build on this headphone is also pretty damn nice. Probably my favorite Audeze headphone to date if we're ignoring the use of DSP (in which case, I wouldn't know which is my favorite).

Audio Hekili: The Hekili has a very sizable amount of bass boost that's mostly under 200Hz, but that comes across slightly bloated, perhaps at around ~150Hz. Nice bass overall, very fun. This does affect lower-midrange timbre by giving it a slightly thicker body. Upper-midrange is conventionally structured with some slight recession from 3-4kHz, and then the Hekili actually has some pretty respectable extension via a series of upper-treble peaks. I can't remember what the Lokahi - its predecessor - sounded like at this point, but I think this is better overall. It doesn't necessarily sound more natural, but the tonality is more palatable. I'd probably place this at around the ~$500 mark blind, which is why I was mildly surprised when I checked the price. Good stuff.

Fiio FH7s: Not bad. This is more or less what I associate with being one of the better examples of Fiio's "house sound". This means good amounts of warmth from a heavy (and bloated) bass shelf, a conventional rise for the ear compensation, and then a spike somewhere in the mid-treble for sparkle. I guess you could call this something like Andromeda tuning with upper-midrange. B-tier sense of technicalities or so. Fun, decent enough IEM, although I'm not sure if it's worth the $400 price.

Moondrop Stellaris: These don't sound good. The level of ear compensation at 3kHz is well into shrill territory, and this is followed by a series of uncontrolled peaks in the treble. The ergonomics of this IEM is also the stuff of nightmares. Really not sure what Moondrop was thinking with this release, but it's a miss from me, at least relative to the other planar IEMs on the market and the standard they've set as a brand. Only thing this...well, thing might have going for it is its sense of detail and that's a stretch.

Moondrop Void: These sound decent enough. No major peaks or valleys that I could really hear in the ten minutes or so that I put on them. I would say that they have a slightly artificial timbre in general. Basically, they sound sort of "cheap" when it comes to a sense of technicalities. Vocals are hard to pin-point in the head and staging is two blob, perhaps not unlike the Sennheiser HD6XX series. Normally I wouldn't comment on this, but the build of the Void is reminiscent of something you might expect from a $20 pair of Amazon Basics headphones. These need some work, especially if they're supposed to be competing with something like the HD6XX.

Some other odds and ends that I heard, and lots of re-listens. Heard the CFA Ara, B2 Dusk, IE600, Monarch MKII, S8, Meze 109 Pro, and some others again. Not too much has changed for me in terms of my impressions on those. Borrowed Chitoh's IER-Z1R though, so that's probably going to get re-ranked. Been meaning to make some updates to my ranking list for a while, just haven't gotten around to it.

@Precogvision Do you have a plan to update your IEM preference list anytime soon? I see that you've tried some new IEMs like the FiR Frontier series but I didn't see them on your list yet. Thx

 

[DavidLovesIEMs]

Meetup Notes 10/15/2022

Hey everyone, some quick notes from this weekend! We haven't had a meetup in a while, so it was good to get together and see some new faces too. Thanks as usual to @MRSallee for hosting



Left-to-right: me, Juan, Mark, @Cameleon303, Kyle, Chitoh

Audeze MM 500: Wow, an Audeze that's actually got some respectable tuning. These follow in the LCD-5's footsteps (a headphone that I'm not a big fan of), but it sounds like the shouty upper-midrange of its bigger brother has been pulled back a bit. Bass sounds slightly rolled under 50Hz, although I'm fairly certain that, like most planar headphones, these probably have very good extension on paper. In any case, bass notes sound slightly blunted for impact to me. Treble sounded fairly neutral. Decent sense of technicalities; I wouldn't consider these best-in-class for detail, but they're good all-rounders. The build on this headphone is also pretty damn nice. Probably my favorite Audeze headphone to date if we're ignoring the use of DSP (in which case, I wouldn't know which is my favorite).

Audio Hekili: The Hekili has a very sizable amount of bass boost that's mostly under 200Hz, but that comes across slightly bloated, perhaps at around ~150Hz. Nice bass overall, very fun. This does affect lower-midrange timbre by giving it a slightly thicker body. Upper-midrange is conventionally structured with some slight recession from 3-4kHz, and then the Hekili actually has some pretty respectable extension via a series of upper-treble peaks. I can't remember what the Lokahi - its predecessor - sounded like at this point, but I think this is better overall. It doesn't necessarily sound more natural, but the tonality is more palatable. I'd probably place this at around the ~$500 mark blind, which is why I was mildly surprised when I checked the price. Good stuff.

Fiio FH7s: Not bad. This is more or less what I associate with being one of the better examples of Fiio's "house sound". This means good amounts of warmth from a heavy (and bloated) bass shelf, a conventional rise for the ear compensation, and then a spike somewhere in the mid-treble for sparkle. I guess you could call this something like Andromeda tuning with upper-midrange. B-tier sense of technicalities or so. Fun, decent enough IEM, although I'm not sure if it's worth the $400 price.

Moondrop Stellaris: These don't sound good. The level of ear compensation at 3kHz is well into shrill territory, and this is followed by a series of uncontrolled peaks in the treble. The ergonomics of this IEM is also the stuff of nightmares. Really not sure what Moondrop was thinking with this release, but it's a miss from me, at least relative to the other planar IEMs on the market and the standard they've set as a brand. Only thing this...well, thing might have going for it is its sense of detail and that's a stretch.

Moondrop Void: These sound decent enough. No major peaks or valleys that I could really hear in the ten minutes or so that I put on them. I would say that they have a slightly artificial timbre in general. Basically, they sound sort of "cheap" when it comes to a sense of technicalities. Vocals are hard to pin-point in the head and staging is two blob, perhaps not unlike the Sennheiser HD6XX series. Normally I wouldn't comment on this, but the build of the Void is reminiscent of something you might expect from a $20 pair of Amazon Basics headphones. These need some work, especially if they're supposed to be competing with something like the HD6XX.

Some other odds and ends that I heard, and lots of re-listens. Heard the CFA Ara, B2 Dusk, IE600, Monarch MKII, S8, Meze 109 Pro, and some others again. Not too much has changed for me in terms of my impressions on those. Borrowed Chitoh's IER-Z1R though, so that's probably going to get re-ranked. Been meaning to make some updates to my ranking list for a while, just haven't gotten around to it.

That's my Hekili. Super legit for 300 price tag.

 

[frix]

I found you huck!

 

[Precogvision]

Hi,

I am surprising by that statement.

Because this is absolutely not the case of its big brother, the FH9...

But it is said that the FH7s and FH9 share a comparable low-end spectrum...

Also for the technical side. I have not listened to the FH7s so I have no opinion, but I compared the FH9 to the most technical in-ear monitors on the market = no problem.

About the tuning, the same. As much as the U12T for instance is a very generic tuning (and not very exciting, by my standards), this is not the case at all of the FH9... of which the FH7s is said to be a "safer" version.

Well, subjective linstening sessions can definitely take us down very different paths, but obviously we don't hear the same things at all, and in the same way.
That being said, I have not listened to the FH7s. So no real opinion, but surprised by what I just read.

sheeesh are you trying to bait me

I don't think I would say the U12t has generic tuning. Generic implies non-specific and applicable to a wide body of products. In the most objective sense possible, the U12t measures nothing like most IEMs on the market. But sure, I can definitely see the 'not very exciting' sentiment.

I'm not sure I'd agree with the FH7S and FH9 speculation either, though...

FH7S is noticeably more V-shaped (more bass emphasis, more mid-treble), so I'm not sure if I'd consider it 'safer'. Granted, I don't have Crin's FH9 unit graphed for direct comparison on my squig.link, but I have heard his particular unit.

Spoiler: FH7S vs. FH9

@Precogvision Do you have a plan to update your IEM preference list anytime soon? I see that you've tried some new IEMs like the FiR Frontier series but I didn't see them on your list yet. Thx

Spoiler: FiR Frontier Scores

Hey, they're on the list, but just with "bias" scores because either listening conditions weren't ideal (like at a show) or I didn't have time to listen as long as I would've liked. I've been meaning to get around to updating it, but truthfully, the list is more or less just a way for me to keep track of everything that I've heard. I don't strictly subscribe to my own scores even, just because I know the scores could change if I actually A/B-d specific sets.

 

[DavidLovesIEMs]

I found you huck!

You just had to look for the big brown dog

 

[frix]

You just had to look for the big brown dog

It was pretty easy indeed

 

[WAON303]

I thought generic tuning mostly referred to typical chi-fi v-shape.

It's that type of tuning with somewhat bloated bass, recessed lower mids and uneven upper mids / lower treble.

IE: Fiio FD5 and a number of KZ IEMs.

 

[WilliamBlake]

Custom Art FIBAE 7U Impressions

Price: $1500 USD
Configuration: 7BA
Unit kindly provided for review by @piotrus-g of Custom Art.

Hey all, sneaking one more set of impressions in. I've had a few requests for this IEM, so I reached out to Piotr of Custom Art who was kind enough to hook me up with a review unit (with some superb shipping speed!). Custom Art is based out of Poland and was founded way back in 2012. The Fibae 7U is the brand's latest IEM that supersedes the Fibae 7, the previous halo model of the lineup.




On paper, bass on the 7U is about equal parts sub-bass and mid-bass. It is possible that I am wrong, but I do not believe the 7U uses vented BA woofers. The 7U's bass has a slightly dry texture to its transients and attack is fairly clean despite what sounds like a mid-bass emphasis in practice. The booms to kick drums fade out quickly and with a lack of weight; generally, these qualities are more reminiscent of my experience with the Knowles BA woofers. The 7U's bass does seem to struggle with conveying rumble and tickling my ears, such as at 0:30 on Seori's "Lovers in the Night". Perhaps it requires more sub-bass quantity, or the CIEM version of the 7U, to compensate for the higher SPL leakage BAs usually exhibit. In any case, the bass here is acceptable for a BA configuration, but not much else of note to me.

I don't have much to say about the midrange of the 7U because of it just being...good. I would say it sounds fairly neutral with some slight warmth to male vocals. Female vocals are more forward and have a good sense of wholeness, vibrance, to their upper-harmonics thanks to the 7U's treble response.

Now, speaking of which, the treble of the 7U merits more commentary. It's characteristic of unlidded BA tweeters with a sizzle-y quality to shakers and a splashy fade to the connection of cymbals. The splashiness is attributable to some valley after the ~10kHz region before the 7U exhibits a strong spike at ~15kHz. Relative to the 64A U12t which shares some of these qualities, the U12t has more energy at 5kHz (by virtue of its recession from 3-4kHz) which puts more weight behind the initial "thock" of percussive hits. In general, then, the 7U has a "feathery" treble response wherein transients don't have much weight behind them. The good part is that it extends damn well. The bad part is that it doesn't sound natural at all. Listener mileage will also vary depending on how high up one can hear (it's somewhat fatiguing to me on certain tracks like Loona's "Eclipse") and whether one is willing to sacrifice a more natural treble response for more extension.

However, a clear benefit of this less-than-linear treble response presents itself with the 7U's imaging. The contrast between recessed mid-treble and boosted upper-treble enhances the 7U's sense of space and layering capability; it sounds surprisingly open for what is such a small IEM physically. Center imaging on the 7U is also fairly palpable, easy to visualize and pinpoint in the head-stage. For a sense of detail, the 7U can generally be considered a good performer, probably in the "A" range in my book. The tuning is not egregious enough to sound completely unnatural (thus diminishing perceived detail) and the excellent treble extension aids this impression. Dynamic contrast is typical of most multi-BA configurations, the 7U sounds upwards-compressed, perceptively skewing towards the loud points of tracks.

Overall, the 7U is good sounding IEM that I feel could use some minor refinements here and there. If I'm being perfectly blunt, it's not really to the level of something like the Elysian Diva (which also clocks in at $1500); I feel that the 7U's competition lies more with the likes of the kilobuck crowd. But maybe comparing to the Diva is unfair given just how high a bar it sets. I still think there's a lot of potential to be had here - the 7U at least has some character - and there's something to be said about a smaller brand having the confidence to send out a review unit knowing my uber-critical standards. I can certainly tip my hat off to that.

I'm still mulling over the bias score which I'll enter on my ranking list after I spend some more ear time with the 7U.

All critical listening was done with the stock cable, stock tips, and my iBasso DX300.

Hi Precog, regarding your 7u review, how do you think custom art totl relate to the Ier m9?

 

[DaveStarWalker]

sheeesh are you trying to bait me

I don't think I would say the U12t has generic tuning. Generic implies non-specific and applicable to a wide body of products. In the most objective sense possible, the U12t measures nothing like most IEMs on the market. But sure, I can definitely see the 'not very exciting' sentiment.

I'm not sure I'd agree with the FH7S and FH9 speculation either, though...

FH7S is noticeably more V-shaped (more bass emphasis, more mid-treble), so I'm not sure if I'd consider it 'safer'. Granted, I don't have Crin's FH9 unit graphed for direct comparison on my squig.link, but I have heard his particular unit.

Spoiler: FH7S vs. FH9

Spoiler: FiR Frontier Scores

Hey, they're on the list, but just with "bias" scores because either listening conditions weren't ideal (like at a show) or I didn't have time to listen as long as I would've liked. I've been meaning to get around to updating it, but truthfully, the list is more or less just a way for me to keep track of everything that I've heard. I don't strictly subscribe to my own scores even, just because I know the scores could change if I actually A/B-d specific sets.

Hi,

Thanks for your answer.

OK, I can read this.

Only one term is inappropriate : speculation. I specify :

About FH9 = repeat, imao one of the best uiem of the market, every prices, every technologies, and tuning wise.

About Fh7s = don't know, I haven't listened them yet. But, your appreciation is quite a surprise for me. See above.

 

[twiceboss]

I thought generic tuning mostly referred to typical chi-fi v-shape.

It's that type of tuning with somewhat bloated bass, recessed lower mids and uneven upper mids / lower treble.

IE: Fiio FD5 and a number of KZ IEMs.

generic tuning is now an Aria and its gang...

 

[DaveStarWalker]

The Harman curve has become a generic tuning. It's true.

For the u12t, I should have said a lackluster tuning. Quite dull.

 

[o0genesis0o]

The Harman curve has become a generic tuning. It's true.

For the u12t, I should have said a lackluster tuning. Quite dull.

U12T dull? With that bass and that 15k peak? Are we even listening to the same IEM?