[mulveling]

Did you say nude?


I just found this new to the market. It's so nude you could call it skinned.
It comes in a beautiful hardwood box.
Rosewood or ebony.
0.35mV
1.8g (1.7-2.3g)
Compliance 16 um/mN
20 ohms internal impedance
Super elliptical stylus
Boron cantilever
Copper wire 6N
Separation 32dB balance 0.5dB (that seems very tight)


Price? You will not believe it. Really.
Brand? Some oem manufacturer from China. I have an idea (Jasmine) but I haven't found any info yet. There two other models MC that look very nice to, specs and materials.

Do get rid of all cleaning cloths and magic dusters before installing.

That is definitely a clone / copy of the Van den Hul Colibri design, even down to a similar wood box. I had a Colibri XGW Stradivarius for a couple weeks in my system last year. Nice cartridge. Besides being very "open", an even more unorthodox aspect of this design is the monopole configuration (no front pole piece).

Personally, I rather like the sonic "contribution" of a nice metal or stone body. Wood is OK too, but I think I really prefer the others.

 

[]eep]

That is definitely a clone / copy of the Van den Hul Colibri design, even down to a similar wood box. I had a Colibri XGW Stradivarius for a couple weeks in my system last year. Nice cartridge. Besides being very "open", an even more unorthodox aspect of this design is the monopole configuration (no front pole piece).

Personally, I rather like the sonic "contribution" of a nice metal or stone body. Wood is OK too, but I think I really prefer the others.

Yes, well, next to it I had a page open on a local marketplace page, with a van den Hul Condor. But that is €2550 even 2ndH.

I don't consider it a 'clone'. You can't clone a van den Hul. He has too much specific expertise. It may look like it but I would consider it the highest form of flattery. I also gave an LP-audio Chinese cartridge that looks a lot like a Koetsu or Kiseki rosewood or purple heart. And it wasn't cheap. But it sounds great. I also still have an original Kiseki blue with van den Hul stylus. It's a bit loose but still sounds great.

The Chinese have been making OEM's for a while now and are making some really good cartridges. The LP-Audio have a Fritz Gyger cantilever assembly. It don't know what this is. But I didn't mention the price yet...it's €412 including VAT and transport.

The other 2 MC's are full alu bodied and wood/carbon/alu with low impedance (this is important and rare in low priced MC's) and cost only 250. Those are rock bottom prices for MC cartridges. With the distinction that these are proper cartridges. The only manufacturer that come near is AT.

The reason I mentioned the low impedance is that I use a transformer. That means you can use this old school method that really works great without negative effect.

 

[mulveling]

Yes, well, next to it I had a page open on a local marketplace page, with a van den Hul Condor. But that is €2550 even 2ndH.

I don't consider it a 'clone'. You can't clone a van den Hul. He has too much specific expertise. It may look like it but I would consider it the highest form of flattery. I also gave an LP-audio Chinese cartridge that looks a lot like a Koetsu or Kiseki rosewood or purple heart. And it wasn't cheap. But it sounds great. I also still have an original Kiseki blue with van den Hul stylus. It's a bit loose but still sounds great.

The Chinese have been making OEM's for a while now and are making some really good cartridges. The LP-Audio have a Fritz Gyger cantilever assembly. It don't know what this is. But I didn't mention the price yet...it's €412 including VAT and transport.

The other 2 MC's are full alu bodied and wood/carbon/alu with low impedance (this is important and rare in low priced MC's) and cost only 250. Those are rock bottom prices for MC cartridges. With the distinction that these are proper cartridges. The only manufacturer that come near is AT.

The reason I mentioned the low impedance is that I use a transformer. That means you can use this old school method that really works great without negative effect.

Sure, I realize it is different from a Van den Hul and could be quite good on its own merits. Those kind of prices could definitely disrupt the market, if they're good as you say. And a step-up transformer is also my preferred MC amplification approach - it definitely requires a low coil impedance.

Incidentally, I just now mounted a brand new Van den Hul Frog Gold in my office rig. I'm learning I don't always prefer the highest end offerings in a line for general "fun" listening time. First impressions are very good even from hour #1 - incredibly airy cart; image expands further past the speakers (though the small office room here is rather confining) that the other MC carts I've been playing with lately.

 

[penmarker]

The idea is that the SPU's stylus tip is mounted at a "standard" distance relative to the bayonet mount - 52mm. Under these conditions, "most" curved arms should find alignment according to their designer's intended alignment curve & parameters (minimum inner radius or IEC vs. DIN) - and this is fixed by the arm's wand length and offset angle (the amount of curve in the arm). The prerequisite to this is you must have accurately mounted to the manufacturer's recommended Pivot-to-Spindle distance. In practice, this can easily be off by a mm or 2 depending on who did it - and opinions will differ on how meaningful this discrepancy can be. So the SPU is "plug and play" with some caveats.

By contrast, headshells with "mounting slots" allow you to accommodate more cartridges with weird mounting hole to stylus tip distances (SPU takes that out of the equation), to absorb discrepancies in your actual P2S mounting distance, and even to twist the cartridge body in the headshell (i.e. change offset angle) to match different alignment curves than the one prescribed by arm manufacturer. You can even use this flexibility to slightly increase (or decrease) the effective length of your arm, at least until you run out of slot length. I have an FR64S arm which is "baked" for a Stevenson type curve, but I prefer Baerwald, so I ended up with a slight twist in the mounting for my alignment. I also ended up RIGHT at the end of the headshell slots (Koetsu cartridge), even with PS2 adjusted a mm below the prescribed 230mm (it just barely fits the Baerwald alignment).

The short/stubby SPUs have a distance of 30mm and I don't know how that's supposed to work lol.

There is also a "nude" version (not to be confused with "nude" styli) of SPU, the Royal N (see @]eep 's post above), which comes with an adapter to mount into standard slotted shells. You will have to do your own alignment there, as usual! This allows folks with fixed headshell arms to enjoy the SPU sound.

Thanks a lot. That makes sense.
I prefer Baerwald too and the cartridge always end up twisting in the headshell. The adjustment length is never long enough forward.

 

[]eep]

Sure, I realize it is different from a Van den Hul and could be quite good on its own merits. Those kind of prices could definitely disrupt the market, if they're good as you say. And a step-up transformer is also my preferred MC amplification approach - it definitely requires a low coil impedance.

Incidentally, I just now mounted a brand new Van den Hul Frog Gold in my office rig. I'm learning I don't always prefer the highest end offerings in a line for general "fun" listening time. First impressions are very good even from hour #1 - incredibly airy cart; image expands further past the speakers (though the small office room here is rather confining) that the other MC carts I've been playing with lately.

That's one of the cheaper ones. It only has one little problem; however much you love it, don't EVER kiss it or you know what happens.

I like that table too. I have a drilling platform type too but I can't afford it by Clearaudio.

So I looked up the others too and saw another one just in:
Same low price
Super elliptical stylus
Titanium cantilever
5N Sterling Silver coil
8 ohms
Also no front yoke

This one is a basic elliptical, but with ebony body and very low 2 Ohm.

These are basic elliptical MC. 5 or 12 ohms is really good. 0.4 or 0.5mV. The red one has 2 versions.

 

[mulveling]

My issue with "very low ohms" (under 4 ohms) is that one of these 2 must be true:

• Output level is also very low, due to fewer turns of very fine wire. Below 0.2mV I find it hard to deal with, even with a SUT. Even 0.2mV is tough; noise floor will emerge at higher volumes. I still have an Ortofon MC20 Mk 1 with an INSANELY low 0.07mV output!
• Wire gauge is increased to yield lower DC ohms with the same number of turns while keeping output level high. This increases moving mass - and wasn't "low mass" the whole point of going for a LOMC in the first place (I guess moving iron proponents would stick their noses in at this point lol)? Anyways, this appears to be My Sonic Labs' preferred approach.

My favored range is 5 - 12 ohms coils and output levels of 0.3 - 0.6mV.

 

[]eep]

My issue with "very low ohms" (under 4 ohms) is that one of these 2 must be true:

• Output level is also very low, due to fewer turns of very fine wire. Below 0.2mV I find it hard to deal with, even with a SUT. Even 0.2mV is tough; noise floor will emerge at higher volumes. I still have an Ortofon MC20 Mk 1 with an INSANELY low 0.07mV output!
• Wire gauge is increased to yield lower DC ohms with the same number of turns while keeping output level high. This increases moving mass - and wasn't "low mass" the whole point of going for a LOMC in the first place (I guess moving iron proponents would stick their noses in at this point lol)? Anyways, this appears to be My Sonic Labs' preferred approach.

My favored range is 5 - 12 ohms coils and output levels of 0.3 - 0.6mV.

Good points.

Adding this: depending on the number of windings on your SUT. If it is 1:20 you can deal with low output mV but you need very low impedance.
If your SUT is 1:14 (kind of a sweetspot imo) you can deal with a bit higher impedance but you need at least 0.2mV.

So these problems kind of fix themselves. Cross out against each other.

The real problems start with the air cores and unfriendly high impedances.

As always it is a matter of choosing the right compromise. The choice is there with these carts for a good price. And that's nice.

 

[]eep]

Sorry guys, I hope I'm not boring you. But there's a whole slew of models coming out of china and they really look serious business.

You want sapphire cantilever?

You want Shibata on sapphire?

Both of these are in the low $1000+ (€1250 and €1150 incl vat.)

You want mono? In the €300.

And one more affordable with a ceramic cantilever, hyperelliptic stylus, 5N OCC wire (is that true Ohno continuous casting?) low Ohm 0.3mV. The body is ebony on aluminum. Just over €400

These all look really well made and the same store also sells lots of high end gear (speaker drivers, cables, tubes, parts) as wel as AT cartridges, Hana, Ortofon, Nagaoka for the same price as in the West. And of course the whole range of LP-Audio cartridges which are already getting critical acclaim. Plus that I really like mine. Now of course this says nothing about customer service, quality control , pride of ownership (that's entirely up to you) yada yada yada.

This is starting to look like a candy store with a lot of shiny jewel boxes.

Oh, by the way, the Chinese have landed on the dark side of the moon, the Indians (1.2 billion of them) successfully landed on the south pole of the moon. The Americans have, uhm... Elon Musk's Space-X. You know where this is going. This is bringing boutique cartridge prices down to earth a bit and more within reach of the not so rich.

 

[CJG888]

Do you have some more information on that €300 mono cartridge? I’m looking for a step up from my AT MONO3/LP, and will be going to Beijing for a couple of days next month.

 

[]eep]

Do you have some more information on that €300 mono cartridge? I’m looking for a step up from my AT MONO3/LP, and will be going to Beijing for a couple of days next month.

Leider nur wenig. Schau selber.
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005005981555942.html

There's not much info on it. No manufacturer or reference. But it's made on a carbon base and looks really well made.

Also, try have a look at the Miyajima Kotetu. For sale at wodaudio and vinyl-gold (Poland) for a good price. And the Spirit (vinyl-gold.com, very friendly)

 

[]eep]

I couldn't resist. I bought the yoke less Silver coil rosewood body.

What I don't understand though... I'm in a dispute with FedEx over VAT that they 'payed forward for me' that I already payed when I bought it. AliExpress is supposedly a European site so everything is including VAT since 2021. That s№it is giving me stomach aches (really). I've been doing this for 40 years and it's still causing me anxiety bc of the unfairness of bureaucracy.

And just now, I payed the order and I get an instant discount for the amount of VAT. It says that 'over €150 sent from abroad must be imported and pay VAT'. HUH? So what is it? New rules. Again?

I'm ok with paying taxes even if it is highway robbery. But come on, make up your mind already. Maybe there was a backlash because people were getting angry for getting taxed twice and they pulled out of the agreement? Anyway, at least that doesn't happen again this way. And maybe it sails through customs without invoice like so often in the old days.

However, I'll probably be able to post a live picture in a few weeks.

 

[]eep]

I received the Chinese cartridge today. I just installed the new cartridge and I'm playing the first record.

It was well packaged. They could have thrown it off an airliner at 30k feet and it wouldn't have damaged anything. A hardwood box in foam in a cardboard box in 4 layers of bubble wrap...

No brand or identifyable markings anywhere.

Well made, very precise. The lacker has a bit of haze on it. I had to polish it a bit.
You can tell it doesn't have a front polepiece, titanium tapered cantilever and silver wire. And a bit of a blob to glue the diamond.

Threaded holes and a carbon fibre inlay for damping the contact area.

Just playing side 2. I just popped it in my cheap 9' arm to see if it works ok. I only adjusted the angles and dialed it to 2g. No tweaking yet. It sounds a bit strident but it's really cold out of the box. Also not much bass yet. And also, I am using the lazy way mc input (100 ohm) of the Gold Note, not a SUT.

But what it already shows is a very wide soundstage, great clarity and open sound, lots of detail, and handles old record without emphasizing clicks and pops.
And I payed €312 total for this little gem. Let's see how it runs in. Maybe it deserves a spot on a 12' arm with silver wire.

 

[mulveling]

@]eep Thanks for pics & impresisons. Physically it looks quite nice, from what we can see. The Rosewood is very pretty. The "titanium tapered cantilever" doesn't look tapered at all, but appears to be set in a very long joint pipe. Hopefully it develops more balanced sound in time. I've honestly been losing some patience with my new VdH - it's still a little soft / light on bass so far, and that's a real enjoyment killer. Suppose I should soldier on towards 100 hours burn in, but quite frankly that's a tall order when there are ~ 20 other MCs here which have a fully satisfying bass response and balanced sound - and by the way, most of those had it from hour #1! There aren't many cartridges from the big brands (Koetsu, Shelter, Benz, Air Tight / MSL, Ortofon) which frustrate me like this (OK, Ortofons frustrate me a bit with their slightly sterile midrange).

 

[]eep]

@]eep Thanks for pics & impresisons. Physically it looks quite nice, from what we can see. The Rosewood is very pretty. The "titanium tapered cantilever" doesn't look tapered at all, but appears to be set in a very long joint pipe. Hopefully it develops more balanced sound in time. I've honestly been losing some patience with my new VdH - it's still a little soft / light on bass so far, and that's a real enjoyment killer. Suppose I should soldier on towards 100 hours burn in, but quite frankly that's a tall order when there are ~ 20 other MCs here which have a fully satisfying bass response and balanced sound - and by the way, most of those had it from hour #1! There aren't many cartridges from the big brands (Koetsu, Shelter, Benz, Air Tight / MSL, Ortofon) which frustrate me like this (OK, Ortofons frustrate me a bit with their slightly sterile midrange).

Tapered might not be the right word. Stepped? I know the Dutch word for that but you might frown. Let's just says it's thinner at the tip. Lighter where it counts and stiffer where it matters most (that's r to the forth power in bending!).

Anyway, bass already present day 2. If it stays this level I'm satisfied. Deep and tight. It reminds me of the AT33 PTG but more open still. It's so good I'm thinking of rearranging cartridges and putting it on my silver wired 12" Acoustic Signature T2000. It should add strength to strength.

In my system I have plenty of bass from the Maggies in my room (to much actually) and to aid I just turn up the Genesis VI subs if needed.

I played Dominique Fils Aimée yesterday and that had plenty of bass and incredible space and very sweet sound.

 

[theeclone]

Tapered might not be the right word. Stepped? I know the Dutch word for that but you might frown. Let's just says it's thinner at the tip. Lighter where it counts and stiffer where it matters most (that's r to the forth power in bending!).

Anyway, bass already present day 2. If it stays this level I'm satisfied. Deep and tight. It reminds me of the AT33 PTG but more open still. It's so good I'm thinking of rearranging cartridges and putting it on my silver wired 12" Acoustic Signature T2000. It should add strength to strength.

In my system I have plenty of bass from the Maggies in my room (to much actually) and to aid I just turn up the Genesis VI subs if needed.

I played Dominique Fils Aimée yesterday and that had plenty of bass and incredible space and very sweet sound.

I think last time you or somebody else posted a link to this cart but it didn't work when I clicked at the time. Do you have the link handy? Thank you in advance.