[doctorjazz]

Actually, don't generally go for the hype, have disliked many things that get hyped as "the latest and greatest", ordered it out of curiosity, was surprised it sounded so much better than what I had been listening to (the iBasso DX90, which is very well regarded in these parts). Of course, if one knows all without listening, no need for an audition...

Pono's claims are all based on the benefits of high resolution audio and double blind tests have already shown that no-one can hear the difference between Redbook and 24/192, so it is NOT just my opinion.

I suppose I shouldn't be surprised that there are people on this thread in denial of science but it's still sad.

seems to me like you are the one who got caught up in the hype.
just ignore thier claims and listen and decide for yourself.

btw, the fact that "no-one can hear the difference between Redbook and 24/192" in that video got nothing to do with actual quality of Pono Player.

 

[doctorjazz]

Pono's claims are all based on the benefits of high resolution audio and double blind tests have already shown that no-one can hear the difference between Redbook and 24/192, so it is NOT just my opinion.

I suppose I shouldn't be surprised that there are people on this thread in denial of science but it's still sad.

seems to me like you are the one who got caught up in the hype.
just ignore thier claims and listen and decide for yourself.

btw, the fact that "no-one can hear the difference between Redbook and 24/192" in that video got nothing to do with actual quality of Pono Player.

 

[fiascogarcia]

   
Pono's claims are all based on the benefits of high resolution audio and double blind tests have already shown that no-one can hear the difference between Redbook and 24/192, so it is NOT just my opinion.
 
I suppose I shouldn't be surprised that there are people on this thread in denial of science but it's still sad.

It sounds like you've just discredited the functionality of every new DAP since the iPod.  Not arguing  against your comment about sonic differences with Hi Res formats, again IMO it's the mastering that makes the difference.  I don't plan on buying a Pono, but I would guess at it's price point it will make for some satisfied purchasers.

 

[olddude]

Nope, we're dealing with a high resolution nay-sayer.  therefore, any DAP that plays hi-res is a fraud, as clearly, according to scientific tests, people can't hear a difference.  Or so the nay-sayers say.
 
Too bad so many of us can hear the difference.  Oh well.

 

[Ableza]

  Out of curiosity, how so?  What is it that you want from the player?  I know I want folder to folder play, and DSD (which it can do, I read), and a way to kill the screen with a button instead of a timer.  But those aren't stopping me from using it.  It sounds like you have more issues and they are stopping you from using it.  

Yes it's just my own personal thing.  I only need a portable DAP when I'm flying.  I use IEMs because they are (to me) far more portable and convenient than other types of phones.  I like loading my DAP with tracks from my library and then putting it in shuffle or random play, and then I want the ability to easily skip a track when something comes up that I'm not into at the moment.  As good as the Pono player sounds, I would like it to have adjustable EQ so I can fine tune it to my IEMs.  The Shuffle play function is very unreliable, often repeating tracks and not selecting from the entire loaded library.  The track skip function is poorly implemented in that sometimes it works and sometimes it doesn't.  Plus it does get a bit hot in my shirt pocket.  So I went back to my iPhone/Beyer A200P combo and will wait to see if Pono offers software in the future to give me what I want. 

 

 

[doctorjazz]

Hmmm, never had a problem with the shuffle, use it when I walk the dog/shovel snow, stuff like that. The "next" also hasn't given me any problems, though it does require the touch screen, and that is generally a bit unreliability, if the screen is still on when I put it in my pocket, I often do wind up setting off some function or other. The shape isn't great for pockets, also agreed, but not much different than using a DAP and an amp, I'd think.

As for "science" "proving" that no one can hear past red book CD, that brings back the "perfect sound forever" business, no one needs the bits thrown out for red book, humans can't hear that. I really don't want to spend much time on that. (The same argument was made for MP3 at one point, "we're only throwing out bits that can't be heard/aren't important"). I believe it has been debunked. Analog (good recording, good gear) IS better sounding than most digital, all things being equal, which shouldn't be the case if no one can hear anything not in the red book standard. But, I guess those of us that can hear the difference in players/sources are suffering from some mass psychosis, or hyper-suggestability, or are looking for ways to waste our money, or some combination of the above. Good thing we have some "objective" folks, can't be fooled by the hype

 

[Sam Edwards]

I know David Pogue from the New York Mac Users Group (NYMUG) back in the 80ies. He was working as an arranger on Broadway and he was chairman of the Music Special Interest Group (SIG). He knows his music. 
So lets be reasonable here. The kind of differences we're willing to pay for are not something that the average Joe doesn't appreciate. I'm fine with that. 
I think his A/B switch might be the culprit. It doesn't look like a high end device. 
Also if one was even a touch louder people will pick it as 'better' almost every time. I'm not sure how much time was spent getting the levels the same.
But Apple puts a lot of energy into selling music that is optimized for their hardware. Pono is just getting started. 
I knew when I bought a pono I was voting with my wallet for higher quality music playback. I'm going to test it against my iPhone and see which I actually prefer. 

 

[Ableza]

Like I said a few days ago:
 
Quote:

  A 24-bit sample of crap still sounds like crap.  A 5-bit sample of an excellent recording - like some of the old Mini-Disk recordings I have - can sound fantastic.  High bit rate all by itself is completely meaningless.  It's the quality of the original source that matters the most.

 
Getting better than CD digital versions of material by making high-res samples from the original masters is the promise of the Pono system.  High-res all by itself is meaningless.

 

[jlbrach]

I really dont understand all the arguments,if the question is whether or not Pono is better than an Iphone or whether FLAC and Hi-Rez are better than MP3 then the answer is yes!If the question is whether or not Neil Young is doing a good thing by promoting better sounding music the answer is yes!If the question is whether or not Pono is a good product and value at 400 dollars I assume the answer is yes......on the other hand  is Pono appreciably better than what already exists in the DAP world the answer is No!

 

[Sam Edwards]

  I really dont understand all the arguments,if the question is whether or not Pono is better than an Iphone or whether FLAC and Hi-Rez are better than MP3 then the answer is yes!If the question is whether or not Neil Young is doing a good thing by promoting better sounding music the answer is yes!If the question is whether or not Pono is a good product and value at 400 dollars I assume the answer is yes......on the other hand  is Pono appreciably better than what already exists in the DAP world the answer is No!

Agreed!

 

[olddude]

"Next" doesn't work without the display on?  I use it all the time, no issues.  Two pushes of the center (round) button and it advances to the next track.  Three presses and it goes back a track.  I carry it in my shirt pocket or in a belt pouch, the display is off, works fine for me.  You just have to be careful to have your finger centered on it and make the presses firm and discrete (no overlapping, or it goes into Stop mode).  As for size, it's a better size than my DX50 w/JDSLabs C5 stack, and it's lighter (though an odder shape) than my X5.
 
What I don't like is that the screen dim timer is either too short or too long.  I set up my album, start it, and slide the device into my pocket or pouch.  The display is still on and anything that touches the screen (fabric, finger, cord, whatever) will cause the selection to skip or reverse or stop.  I tried the short timer and it made it too hard to make selection as it would time out.  And the next shortest time caused the issue above.  So that I would like adjusted/fixed.
 
I don't use shuffle so I can't say, looks like we have a couple of people with different experiences.
 
Very rarely do I want an eq on any device, I generally use tips on my iems to fine tune the sound.  And, with a balanced cable, I really don't want to eq anything as the sound is so rich.  Once in a while I get a track that's a bit harsh up top, but that's an issue with the track, not the device.  Synergy with the Fidues is nigh-on perfect.
 
As to Apple products, my Colorfly C3 was better than my iPhone.  Same TF10 iems, no contest.  Then I used a couple of amps with it, better still.  Got a custom cable for it, even better.  Then I got a DX50 and used it with the JDSLabs C5 I was enjoying so much.  Sounded better than the Colorfly with the same amp.  Got some Dunu1Ks, sounded better than with the TF10s and the custom cable.  Found them a bit bass-y so got some Altone200s, loved the detail.  Then wanted to play my DSD files (I know, nothing above 320 sounds "better" but I guess I can't tell that and I felt like wasting my money) so I got an X5.  Ran that with no amp, it was better than my DX50 stack and my Colorfly w/amp.  But the Altone synergy was iffy with it so got FidueA83s.  Way better than all the rest.  Then my son messed everything up and gave me a Pono.  Tried that with the Fidues and the Comply tips, ehh, so went to the Altones.  Yeah.  Then thought about changing tips so went back to the Fidues but changed out the Complys for silicons.  Oh my.  Then I read a post from someone here who tried and liked Moon Audio balanced cables on his Fidues with the Pono.  OK, why not.  Got them and oh my god!  No joke.  So the idea of going back to my iPhone (now a 6) doesn't appeal to me at all.  

 

[olddude]

  I really dont understand all the arguments,if the question is whether or not Pono is better than an Iphone or whether FLAC and Hi-Rez are better than MP3 then the answer is yes!If the question is whether or not Neil Young is doing a good thing by promoting better sounding music the answer is yes!If the question is whether or not Pono is a good product and value at 400 dollars I assume the answer is yes......on the other hand  is Pono appreciably better than what already exists in the DAP world the answer is No!

Well, that I can't agree with on a cost basis.  The Pono is better than my X5 at about the same price.  It's better than (so I read from people here) a DX90  at about the same price.   It's certainly better than my C3 or my X1 or my DX50/C5 stack.  Is it better than an AK240?  I doubt it (don't have one) but at one sixth the cost, why should it be?  As to the $800-1600 devices, I don't have them so I can't say.  I've seen people on these threads say it is better than an AK100.  If not, well, they cost double to triple the cost of a Pono.  So let's keep the apples with the apples (oops) and the oranges with the oranges.  The Pono is APPRECIABLY better than other popular DAPs in its price range.  Who said it's even trying to better than devices that cost so much more than it does?   

 

[lamode]

 
It sounds like you've just discredited the functionality of every new DAP since the iPod.  Not arguing  against your comment about sonic differences with Hi Res formats, again IMO it's the mastering that makes the difference.  I don't plan on buying a Pono, but I would guess at it's price point it will make for some satisfied purchasers.

 
Not at all! The implication by Pono is that their sound quality must be better because it's a 24/192 device. They completely ignore the importance of power supply, circuit design (both digital and analogue), component quality, etc, that actually DO make an audible difference, and are the reason why 16/44 on a dCS Elgar DAC sounds very different to 16/44 on a no-brand laptop DAC. I think we all do want DAP makers to continue improving SQ in ways that actually work.
 
If Pono had just advertised themselves as another DAP, I wouldn't have a problem with them, but they clearly claim a lot more which simply isn't true, and their business model is built on the anticipated revenue stream resulting from these false claims, in the form of purchasing HD music files which sound exactly the same as people's existing 16/44 FLACs. That's why it's a scam/ snake oil/ whatever you want to call it.

 

[lamode]

 
Too bad so many of us can hear the difference.  Oh well.

 
Yet no-one in the history of the world has been able to hear this difference when participating in a proper double blind test.

 

[olddude]

I'm blocking your posts because you seem to be a Johnny-One-Note who really is only here, apparently, to start trouble.  Have at it.