[Sovkiller]

IMO yes, but you need to invest huge amounts of money on the system that will be able to do that, not becasue you invest 1000.00 in a headphone setup you will rival 1000.00 speaker setup OK? IMO is all the opposite to what people claim, you need to invest more in heapdhones to get something similar to the real sound...

 

[virusvoodoo]

Quote:

Originally Posted by cotdt /img/forum/go_quote.gif You take my words out of context. What I said was that the Gilmore Lite paired with a K701 is a terrible combination. The amp itself is good, when paired with a different headphone. It's not that tastes are different so much as the fact that the headphone is used in a different system (amp, source, music). But in Real Life, people's tastes are not so different. Everyone who has heard the various rigs I've built either say they like them (when I like them) or hate them (when I also hate them). Most people also don't like the sound of Bose. So tastes are not so different. When they do differ, we have these threads to give our opinions and reasoning. So I do not see what bothers you. All is well.

Try to open up your mind!

Do those people have high-end headphones rigs? If not then they probably won't have much experience to scale your rig to. The most they've spent on is probably some $50 on some Sony earbuds/earphones from Best Buy or Walmart. Unless they own some high-end Grado's, Ultrasone's, AKG's, Sennheiser's, Beyer's, etc... you should not generalized people's taste are all like you based on their responses.

Even if they do own high-end headphones, it doesn't equate to AKG K701's > HD-650's when they all agree with you. How many people do you know compared with the vast amount of people that you don't know? Just because those around you have similar taste as yours does not mean that there aren't any other that would prefer the HD-650's or others instead of your K701's.

Plus that claim about "people's tastes are all not that different" is such rubbish! Why do you think there are so many different high-end headphones, and speakers for that matter, exist? It's because they each tailor a different sound that particular groups of people prefer over other brands. This also doesn't mean that one is neccessarily better the others in its league. If these two statements weren't true then we'd only have one brand for headphones and just one for speakers.

As an example, I used to be like that with HD-515's I thought those were amazing until I got some HD-555 as I only had Sony headphones before owning the HD-515's. I moved onto HD-600's & Shure E3C's and I now have the HD-650's and Ultimate Ears Super.fi 5 Pro's but I learned from my experience so I will not make such claims as yours. I know there are many different headphones and while I like the ones I currently have, there are others that I may prefer over these but haven't gotten a chance to try out yet.

With a close mind and such blanketed statements like yours, I know I will never know what others will sound like and will miss out a lot.

 

[Xsparc7]

I don't listen to headphones when I'm at home. I'm happy with my speakers set up and I personally do not think that any headphones could match the pure enjoyment that I get out of the speakers. But then when you're talking about SQ (which is very subjective and can be defined in 1001 ways), they might match or even surpass the speakers at some point. But I've yet to see one. Btw, how do you define the headphones and speakers to be in the same class? based on monetary value?

Using my speakers as the reference, I'm still searching for a good pair of headphones that will give me the closest experience that I'm getting from my speakers. I doubt it that I'd find the perfect replacement.

To me, headphones are just an alternative mobile solution to speakers. It ain't the real thing.

 

[d-cee]

Quote:

Originally Posted by cotdt /img/forum/go_quote.gif You take my words out of context. What I said was that the Gilmore Lite paired with a K701 is a terrible combination. The amp itself is good, when paired with a different headphone. It's not that tastes are different so much as the fact that the headphone is used in a different system (amp, source, music). But in Real Life, people's tastes are not so different. Everyone who has heard the various rigs I've built either say they like them (when I like them) or hate them (when I also hate them). Most people also don't like the sound of Bose. So tastes are not so different. When they do differ, we have these threads to give our opinions and reasoning. So I do not see what bothers you. All is well.

I happen to know people who like the sound of Bose, I also know people who like the sound of the GLite + K701.

I think what's bothering people is the way that you express your own opinion as the only valid opinion without considering that tastes vary greatly

 

[virusvoodoo]

Quote:

Originally Posted by d-cee /img/forum/go_quote.gif I happen to know people who like the sound of Bose, I also know people who like the sound of the GLite + K701. I think what's bothering people is the way that you express your own opinion as the only valid opinion without considering that tastes vary greatly

That is exactly my point in my post!

 

[warpdriver]

Everytime I listen to any set of reasonably competent speakers, I realize how colored headphones sound. The only thing that headphones have an advantage in is resolution, but most headphones seem to not do as good a job at instrument separation, and lack of listening fatigue. I do not find most headphones to be linear sounding at all. Unless you get to the stupid-expensive headphones, most of them have some gap or peak that would be inexcusable in even $300 speakers. Look at the treble spike in a Grado, or the roll off of the Shure IEMs, or the exaggerated bass and veil of the HD650. Even my K701 which I consider quite neutral has upper midrange glare. You'd figure by now they could have designed a more linear sounding headphone, but the perfect headphone is far from being a reality.

However, headphones are more convenient and you can get clear crisp sound in any environment where listening at full volume is not possible. So for me, headphones give me 80% of the sound quality in 95% of my music listening time.

For me, I could NOT live without headphones, but even a modest speaker rig (say $600 speakers, $300 amp, and $200 source) can involve me in the music more than the most expensive headphone rig I've heard including the electrostatics.

 

[Dept_of_Alchemy]

Quote:

Originally Posted by cotdt /img/forum/go_quote.gif Model is called Dual LS205EB. They are not the best I've heard but sound very good for the money. I prefer it over headphones. You don't need $4000 speakers to beat the HD650. These $40 ones already do it.

*FLAME*!!!!!!11one

 

[unclejr]

I'm not 100% convinced, but I'd give detail to the phones and soundstage to the speakers (in general).

 

[Redo]

Quote:

Originally Posted by warpdriver /img/forum/go_quote.gif You'd figure by now they could have designed a more linear sounding headphone, but the perfect headphone is far from being a reality.

Speakers vary in sound just as much as headphones. Headphones with a ruler flat FR don't sound quite as good, because the drivers are directly against your ear. And IEM's are quite different as well up close and personal. There's a different law of acoustics that close I swear.

 

[Wmcmanus]

It depends.

That's the short answer.

The long answer would take more time than I have in this world to fully explain. But even if I could put words to it, you would be better off doing your own listening and then decide for yourself.

The medium length answer is that for moderate budgets, headphones can take you a lot further than speakers can, assuming that you can suspend your imagination a bit in terms of the soundstage issues which are quite problematic for headphone systems.

There are too many factors at play with speaker systems to truly get audiophile sound quality on an extremely low budget (most notably the room issues that cannot be dealt with so easily). Headphones take the room out of the equation and thus can deliver crystal clear music which comparably priced speakers cannot touch. But this is because of faliures in the delivery system, not faliures in the speakers themselves. Yet, at the same time, even moderately priced speaker systems will give you certain things that even the best headphone systems cannot.

So depending on what you value most in your listening sessions, a solid argument could be made for either headphones (details, intimacy, clarity) or speakers (soundstage, realism, sense of venue) as being "better" within nearly any budget.

But at the extreme end budget-wise, headphones just can't match up, IMO. Assuming that you're willing to spend "any" amount for your own paticular "ideal" headphones system and speaker system such that you'll have the best of both worlds. If you're like me, you'll want to listen to your speaker system 80% of the time, no matter what headphone alternatives you might have at your disposal.

This shouldn't come as any surprise. You could make the same kind of coomparisons between full size headphones and IEMs. There would be all sorts of good arguments for IEMs (convenience, portability, and even the intimacy of the sound signature since the drivers are in your ear canals and thus more immediate). But when you compare an extreme IEM system to an extreme full size headphone system, the hedphones will win because they have a better delivery mechanism. Likewise, an extreme speaker system will be better than an extreme headphone system for the same reason, only the differences will be even more pronounced.

But to get there, your speaker system has to be good enough to be able to match the best headphone systems available in terms of details, intimacy, and clarity, and that is a TALL order, especially when considering the room issues which are often hard to deal with. Yet, once your speaker system gets to that level, it is no longer a fair fight; headphones cannot keep up because of their inherent limitaitons (soundstage, realism, sense of venue) no matter how well they do everything else.

More realistically, you probably won't be able to get your speaker system to that same level of details, intimacy and clarity that your headphones can offer you, so then you're back to the trade off and having to decide which things are more important to you.

My overall take on it is that as the budget decreases, headphones tend to offer a better bang for the buck and as the budget increases speakers tend to win more hearts.

 

[SteveM324]

My speaker based system consisting of Thiel CS6, CAT SL-1 Ultimate Preamp, Classe' CA400 power amp, Linn LP12 Lingo/Eko, Rega Saturn and Magnum Dynalab MD106T blows away any headphone system that I have owned including K1000, HD650, RS1, K701 and CD3000. But I still love my K701/Saturn/Raptor for intimate late night listening. IMO, no headphone at any cost can match a great speaker based system for dynamics, soundstaging, imaging and (for me) musical satisfaction.

 

[cotdt]

Quote:

Originally Posted by SteveM324 /img/forum/go_quote.gif My speaker based system consisting of Thiel CS6, CAT SL-1 Ultimate Preamp, Classe' CA400 power amp, Linn LP12 Lingo/Eko, Rega Saturn and Magnum Dynalab MD106T blows away any headphone system that I have owned including K1000, HD650, RS1, K701 and CD3000. But I still love my K701/Saturn/Raptor for intimate late night listening. IMO, no headphone at any cost can match a great speaker based system for dynamics, soundstaging, imaging and (for me) musical satisfaction.

I agree! AKG K701 comes the closest!

 

[Fitz]

My current main speaker system ended up costing me just a few hundred dollars to put together by buying used equipment, and if I had to pick what I wanted to listen on, I'd choose it in a heartbeat over any headphones I've heard to date.

 

[drizek]

As far as Team Budget-Fi is concerned, id like to see a $10 speaker system that can outperform the KSC75.

Realistically, you are looking at something like this http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16836121122 or http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16836119101 . And im not even sure how the logitech will do.

 

[wovenhand]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wmcmanus /img/forum/go_quote.gif There are too many factors at play with speaker systems to truly get audiophile sound quality on an extremely low budget (most notably the room issues that cannot be dealt with so easily). Headphones take the room out of the equation and thus can deliver crystal clear music which comparably priced speakers cannot touch.

I was just going to say this. With headphones - the room doesn't matter, which for me is a huge +.
A room will always resonate at a certain frequency depending on room size, and if your room is re-eally bad you can also suffer phase cancellations.

A "mid-end" phone will most likely sound better than a high-end stereo set up in a bad room.