[chi2]

Quote:

Originally Posted by schneller /img/forum/go_quote.gif I put the black filters in again. Just played "All I Need" by Radiohead. It is a HQ rip...and it distorts a lot. Like the entire bass line sounds distorted. But this isn't the only song. I am hearing a lot of distortion in the highs and lows. This is with about 55% volume on a Sansa.

Sorry to hear that. Was it from beginning on or did it develop over time? Could it be that the filters are defective? How about a headphone amp - in order to rule out any possible problems of the Sansa's output stage. However, 55% volume may mean that the distortion doesn't result from clipping. Do the exact same songs sound ok when listened to with other IEMs?

 

[dfkt]

Quote:

Originally Posted by schneller /img/forum/go_quote.gif I put the black filters in again. Just played "All I Need" by Radiohead. It is a HQ rip...and it distorts a lot. Like the entire bass line sounds distorted. But this isn't the only song. I am hearing a lot of distortion in the highs and lows. This is with about 55% volume on a Sansa.

Wow, that sounds bad. I never noticed any distortion with the Phonaks, not even with insane bass test tracks (Techmaster PEB, Bass Mekanik, etc). Only thing that comes to mind (besides the phones being damaged) is the Sansa's awful EQ which distorts bady even at mild levels. But I assume you don't use the EQ?

 

[dfkt]

Quote:

Originally Posted by paulie888 /img/forum/go_quote.gif Martin, I had no idea that the Clip was (potentially) capable of well over 100mW output at 16 ohms, that should make it capable of driving just about any earphones to ear-splitting levels quite easily. I've always liked Sandisk's offerings and have owned a couple of their Sansa MP3 players in addition to the Clip, but one deficiency I've found in all their players is their relatively low output in comparison to iPods and Zunes, unfortunately. I'm not very fond of iPods due to the limitations that Apple builds into them, but one thing they definitely have going for them is the extremely high output they have. I remember my friend's iPod being able to blast her stock earphones so loud they were almost like miniature speakers, and we were able to hear the music quite easily from about 6 feet away! That's one thing the Sandisk could never do, and I've often wondered why they didn't design higher output into their players. Paul

Well, the older Sansa players used completely different innards, PortalPlayer/Nvidia chips (which really aren't that great). Some iPod iterations used PortalPlayer implementations as well, and I never was particularly fond of their sound quality - loudness quantity of course never was an issue, as you already said.

Only the Clip, Fuze, and new "v2" e/c/m200 use the high quality Austrian (yay for us!) AMS chips. Let's hope other brands will follow suit.

http://www.rockbox.org/twiki/bin/view/Main/SansaClip

 

[schneller]

Yes, I am using the EQ on the Sansa.

Actually, it is a e260 v2 version.

 

[schneller]

I take that back, I can hear it on my CK7s as well. So it must be the recording/Sansa.

 

[paulie888]

Martin,

Thanks for the information regarding the chips used in the Sansa players. I see that apparently there is a Clip V2 out, does that use the AMS chip as well? I hope Sandisk sticks with this setup for the foreseeable future, as I'm extremely happy with the Clip I have now, and I may want to purchase the 4gb or 8GB version sometime in the next couple of months.

I had no idea that the E/M/C 200 series used the same AMS chip as well. I do have an old M200 series with 1GB that is still functioning well, how do I tell which version it is? Also, what chip does the Sansa View use, by the way?

I'm still deciding between whether to buy the Clip or the Fuze right now; the price difference is trivial, and I may just keep my existing Clip and get the Fuze for its bigger and far more functional screen, since it'd make it that much easier to browse a larger 8gb music collection - much less scrolling needed, which can get rather tiresome on my Clip, even though it only has 2 GB.

Paul

 

[dfkt]

Quote:

Originally Posted by schneller /img/forum/go_quote.gif Yes, I am using the EQ on the Sansa. Actually, it is a e260 v2 version.

Quote:

Originally Posted by schneller /img/forum/go_quote.gif I take that back, I can hear it on my CK7s as well. So it must be the recording/Sansa.

Sansa EQs are the worst I've ever heard. Just never, ever use them... at all.

AMS-based Sansas sound great flat, thanks to the good hardware. But unfortunately they sound like s**t when tinkering with the software EQ.

The "bad" thing about the Phonaks is that you certainly will notice every flaw in the recording or source.

 

[dfkt]

Quote:

Originally Posted by paulie888 /img/forum/go_quote.gif I see that apparently there is a Clip V2 out, does that use the AMS chip as well?

Yes, speculations are that it's basically the same hardware, but with a different firmware. Some people believe it's just to address the larger memory space. It's not certain yet, however.

Quote:

Originally Posted by paulie888 /img/forum/go_quote.gif I had no idea that the E/M/C 200 series used the same AMS chip as well. I do have an old M200 series with 1GB that is still functioning well, how do I tell which version it is? Also, what chip does the Sansa View use, by the way?

Only the new v2 versions use AMS chips. The View is basically the same as the v1 e200, so it's also a PortalPlayer/GoForce design. Not recommended for good audio quality.

How to find out what player you have:
How to tell if you have a e200v2 - Sansa e200 v2 - abi>>forums
How to find out if you have v1 or v2 Clip - Sansa Clip - abi>>forums

Don't know about the m200, sorry.

Quote:

Originally Posted by paulie888 /img/forum/go_quote.gif I'm still deciding between whether to buy the Clip or the Fuze right now; the price difference is trivial, and I may just keep my existing Clip and get the Fuze for its bigger and far more functional screen, since it'd make it that much easier to browse a larger 8gb music collection - much less scrolling needed, which can get rather tiresome on my Clip, even though it only has 2 GB.

Well, the Clip is an excellent audio player. The Fuze is the same, but also a quite bad video player. Don't get it for the video features. The firmware doesn't appear to be as stable as the Clip's, from all I heard. The SD slot sure might come in handy, though.

Best you ask these questions on anythingbutipod.com, you might get better answers than from me - and we also wouldn't get completely off-topic in here.

 

[moonsurf]

So far I'm loving the sounds coming out of PFEs!! Beautiful and detailed Mids, and with a little eq with grey filters, the bass is very good too. However, I sometimes think the general sounds quality is somewhat anemic time to times. Is there anyone else thinks the samething? Or, have any of you been able to get over this by using different tips??

 

[chi2]

Shure black foam sleeves/olives give much better isolation than the standard tips. They improve the amount and extension of the low frequencies, too. However, the high frequencies get a bit too much tamed by them. The ideal tips for me are the large Phonak silicone sleeves "stuffed" with Comply T-500. Good isolation (admittedly not as much as the Shures provide) but they make the highs sparkle & shine - in combination with deep and controlled bass. As to my perception, the black filters give slightly stronger and deeper bass and less pronounced high frequencies than the grey ones. That's why I prefer the black ones.

 

[moonsurf]

Thanks for sharing that again Chi2!!
I think I will grab some shure foam tips in next week or so. Anyway, I think PFE's are great IEM at great value. Again, I wasn't a big fan of IEM before, but I'm in love with PFE's now. Especially, I love how good they sound at low volume, which may be the reason sometimes I think they lack little power. Anyway, they sounds beautiful to my ears with the grey filters with a little eq to lower the mid and boost bass.

 

[schneller]

I too went out and bought the Shure black foam tips (Apple Store) and found them to be the most comfortable compared to the included silicon and Comply tips. I am using the black filters.

All in all, I paid some $60 less than what I had planned and more or less got 90% of what I wanted coming from the ATH-CK7s.

I sometimes miss the bass of the CK7s but am happy to now have more balance, especially on the treble side. The PFEs are far more comfortable and isolate a whole lot better...even better than the Klipsch X5s.

Overall, they are a great value...but I still can't help but wonder what I am missing from the $200-250 price range. Perhaps I will upgrade again when Sleek makes a v2 of the SA6s or when prices for the ATH-CK10 come down another $150, I will consider those.

Otherwise, I think the PFEs will get me down the road a while longer.

 

[paulie888]

Martin,

Thanks for answering my questions even though we started veering dangerously off-topic...

It's funny how a discussion about something can devolve into something totally different, doesn't it?

I promise this is the last time I'll go off-topic, so here goes...

1) Can you confirm that the Fuze has exactly the same chip as the Clip, and therefore its sonic signature is identical? What about in terms of output? I just checked the prices of the 8gb versions, and their prices are practically identical. It's just that you get so much more with the Fuze and its expandable memory, and also its bigger screen. I really do not intend to view any videos on it, I was more interested in using the added screen real estate to more easily browse my music collection; I can already anticipate massive frustration trying to negotiate a 8gb music collection on the Clip's tiny screen!

2) How durable are the Phonaks in terms of cable construction and overall sturdiness? Since I intend to use them as everyday earphones, do you think they can take that kind of ab(use)? How do you typically store your Phonaks, do you keep them in the case or just wrap them around the Clip? Do you think they could live up to being wrapped around the player multiple times daily without the cables fraying or tearing?

Thanks,
Paul

 

[dfkt]

Paulie,

1) Yes, they should sound exactly the same. I never heard a contrary opinion from people who have both players.

2) The Phonaks might not have the exactly best build quality, but they're far from being shabby. I assume they should survive wrapping them (not too tight) around the player. Myself, I store both the Clip and the Phonaks in the two compartments of the Audéo case. Love that case, two compartments are really better than one.

 

[schneller]

So far I have no initial concerns with build quality.

The replaceable filters can only take so many changes, but that is to be expected. Otherwise, my only worry would be about the wire and where it meets the driver assembly. But that is the case with all IEMs. (The Klipsch X10s are known to break there.)