Owning 1 vs 2 endgame systems?
Nov 29, 2023 at 11:33 PM Post #16 of 62
TLDR: I'd value feedback on buying two endgame headphone systems to meet my wide variety of musical tastes. Is that easier than trying to find a compromise to suit all musical styles and recording quality? I have analysis paralysis and would drive myself crazy going too far down the rabbit hole and prefer to buy generally well-regarded gear where "you can't go wrong", even if not "perfect". I've never come across this question in any forum and would happily read elsewhere for anyone that has seen it discussed already.


Brief background. Listen to music all the time. In my office during work and after work for pleasure. Always planned for an endgame music room but I got married and wife kyboshed that, so short of getting a new wife (thoughts?) I am looking at headphones only. I'm 53 so ears aren't perfect. Have visited high end stores when they used to exist and am a complete expert at reading audio forums. LOL. I have baaaaaad analysis paralysis, which is why I'd prefer to get a system(s) that 95% of people say it's unbelievable without trying to get every last ounce of perfection. Completely inane that I listen to Air Pod pros given my interest in music and willingness to invest dollars.

I listen to everything but Jazz - alternative, 80s pop, 80s hair band, country, lots of new-age/post rock, R&B - and classical is limited to soundtracks. So a classical/jazz focus is not the top priority. I appreciate high quality recordings and all they entail but also want to enjoy lower quality sources. I want to get to the point of diminishing returns and stop. I'm very cynical, for example, about super expensive cords.

Do I get two systems, and use different ones depending on the music I am listening to? I won't go more than two. Here's an example of what I am thinking merely based on what I read and how I interpret it, focusing on the mainstream consensus vs. all the bespoke unique offerings that may be great but are not widely "validated". There seems to most consensus on end game headphones, less on Amps, and reading about DACs makes my brain hurt.

Do I get an Abyss 1266 for rock/alternative/R&B and a Susvara for more vocal and acoustic music? Do I get a warmer AMP, maybe tube (Feliks Envy, Enleum ss) and a more clinical AMP (Oor & Hypsos), and combined with a good DAC(s) can I create two systems to mix and match with this gear and combine depending on what I am listening to? I'm assuming I would get gear suited to each headphone based on the music I would listen to on each. Seems like I can get TOTL for ~$7,500 or less on any one headphone, AMP, or DAC, and that would be my per item budget at this point. Value for my money is not my top priority - distinguishable improvement in sounds is.

I'm first and foremost interested in "Is this a good approach, albeit expensive, and easier than trying to meet all my needs in one system.", or am I going about it wrong? One system would obviously be easier than two, but maybe more maddening to try and pick. I won't spend a lot of time, if any, buying and selling, and would rather buy stuff than is generally regarded as really good, call it a day and enjoy.

Thanks for any input.
I would get two systems - one for work and one for home. One tube, one solid state. The tube amp should offer some tube rolling options so you can bend it slightly wet or dry, etc. to taste. I'd recommend tube amps with tube rectification (more sonic tuning options to again bend to taste w/o having to buy a net new amp as your tastes subtly change over time). Relo the headphones between the two locations depending on mood (and because most TOTL headphones come with some type of carry case to faciltate transportability). Regarding the headphones, given your genre preferences, yes, the 1266 is an option but (as a former owner), I find their sound signature a bit niche if you are going for widest use cases. There are other very, very competent alternatives also with excellent bass and less sonic quirks -- Final D8K or D8Kpro, T+A Sol P, a gently used LCD-4 (the last one is quirky but not as quirky as a 1266). Susvaras live up to the hype (but do not buy new and especially not at full retail price). I owned the Sus, they gave me a headache but that isn't the headphone's fault but instead my individual frequency response sensitivities.
 
Jan 14, 2024 at 9:50 PM Post #17 of 62
I've had my gear for a couple weeks after a 5-week backorder. It's certainly better than the Air pods. LOL. A couple questions for anyone that would like to share their thoughts.
* Using Quboz, I've noticed some songs sound magical, while others sound just ok. So there's going to be some music that will never sound amazing, regardless of how good your systems is?
* I havw Quboz going from my PC to the DAC using a USB-C output. Is that the best sonic connection, or do I need to do something different with software or hardware to get the maximum? Does, for example, HQ player improve the sound?
* 80/90s rock and pop don't sound as good as other genres. Adding another Headphones to the Susvara for 80s/90s would be the best solution rather than amp or DAC?

Thanks!
 
Jan 14, 2024 at 9:55 PM Post #18 of 62
I would get two systems - one for work and one for home. One tube, one solid state. The tube amp should offer some tube rolling options so you can bend it slightly wet or dry, etc. to taste. I'd recommend tube amps with tube rectification (more sonic tuning options to again bend to taste w/o having to buy a net new amp as your tastes subtly change over time). Relo the headphones between the two locations depending on mood (and because most TOTL headphones come with some type of carry case to faciltate transportability). Regarding the headphones, given your genre preferences, yes, the 1266 is an option but (as a former owner), I find their sound signature a bit niche if you are going for widest use cases. There are other very, very competent alternatives also with excellent bass and less sonic quirks -- Final D8K or D8Kpro, T+A Sol P, a gently used LCD-4 (the last one is quirky but not as quirky as a 1266). Susvaras live up to the hype (but do not buy new and especially not at full retail price). I owned the Sus, they gave me a headache but that isn't the headphone's fault but instead my individual frequency response sensitivities.
Thanks Ardberg. I work remote, so I can have all my gear with me every day. I'm in Texas and have a 12x12 office. Do I have to worry about some tubes making the room to warm, where it's part of the purchase decision? What do you mean when you say 1266s are quirky? I'll have to look into some of the ones you mentioned.
 
Jan 14, 2024 at 9:55 PM Post #19 of 62
Well, Susvara is NOTORIOUS for revealing all the flaws of the recording. Use a different endgame dynamic headphone for those recordings. ZMF Atrium is amazing for those purposes :)
 
Jan 14, 2024 at 10:00 PM Post #20 of 62
Well, Susvara is NOTORIOUS for revealing all the flaws of the recording. Use a different endgame dynamic headphone for those recordings. ZMF Atrium is amazing for those purposes :)
Do you literally change headphones based on what type of music you feel like listening to? Maybe now I'm seeing how people end up with so many at once......
 
Jan 14, 2024 at 10:01 PM Post #21 of 62
Do you literally change headphones based on what type of music you feel like listening to? Maybe now I'm seeing how people end up with so many at once......

Yep. I don't need utmost resolution from the Susvara with less than stellar recordings
 
Jan 14, 2024 at 10:23 PM Post #22 of 62
Do you literally change headphones based on what type of music you feel like listening to? Maybe now I'm seeing how people end up with so many at once......
.... also based on what type of sound I feel like hearing. I liken having different headphones to having a different seat / table at a given music venue: the perspective changes.
 
Jan 14, 2024 at 10:29 PM Post #23 of 62
Thanks Ardberg. I work remote, so I can have all my gear with me every day. I'm in Texas and have a 12x12 office. Do I have to worry about some tubes making the room to warm, where it's part of the purchase decision? What do you mean when you say 1266s are quirky? I'll have to look into some of the ones you mentioned.
Tubes can get warm but not that warm. The 1266 has exaggerated bass and it is very engaging but I find the mids and treble suffer in timbre compared to alternatives such as Final D8K or Pro, Solitaire P, Gjallarhorn GH 50 JM, and LCD-4.
 
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Jan 14, 2024 at 10:30 PM Post #24 of 62
I've had my gear for a couple weeks after a 5-week backorder. It's certainly better than the Air pods. LOL. A couple questions for anyone that would like to share their thoughts.
* Using Quboz, I've noticed some songs sound magical, while others sound just ok. So there's going to be some music that will never sound amazing, regardless of how good your systems is?
* I havw Quboz going from my PC to the DAC using a USB-C output. Is that the best sonic connection, or do I need to do something different with software or hardware to get the maximum? Does, for example, HQ player improve the sound?
* 80/90s rock and pop don't sound as good as other genres. Adding another Headphones to the Susvara for 80s/90s would be the best solution rather than amp or DAC?

Thanks!

If you're using Qutest, it's best to use Rob Watts filter rather than bypass that with HQ Player.

Another improvement would be adding tube sound to your Susvara. To keep everything good about your OOR+Hypsos and inject real tube magic on it, get an Envy with either Elrog Mo or WE300B and hear something very close to what Senneheiser HE-1 sounds like.
 
Jan 14, 2024 at 10:40 PM Post #25 of 62
If you're using Qutest, it's best to use Rob Watts filter rather than bypass that with HQ Player.

Another improvement would be adding tube sound to your Susvara. To keep everything good about your OOR+Hypsos and inject real tube magic on it, get an Envy with either Elrog Mo or WE300B and hear something very close to what Senneheiser HE-1 sounds like.
You like Envy better than Woo Audio? I've read a lot about Woo on the forums.
 
Jan 14, 2024 at 10:44 PM Post #26 of 62
You like Envy better than Woo Audio? I've read a lot about Woo on the forums.
I know I may be in the minority, but I personally find the Envy to be an overly wet, muddy mess. I love direct heated triodes but there are several other tube amps which I think have the "romance" and holography of a DHT while retaining a very clean and detailed presentation compared to the Envy, e.g. DNA Stratus or an Eddie Current 2a3 or 300B based amp such as the Aficionado or Studio Jr / Studio B.
 
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Jan 14, 2024 at 10:44 PM Post #27 of 62
You like Envy better than Woo Audio? I've read a lot about Woo on the forums.

Envy with Elrog or WE300B is more affordable than the WA33 Elite + JPS. However, I'd take the Envy over the stock WA33 anyday.
 
Jan 14, 2024 at 10:47 PM Post #28 of 62
I know I may be in the minority, but I personally find the Envy to be an overly wet, muddy mess. I love direct heated triodes but there are several other tube amps which I think have the "romance" and holography of a DHT while retaining a very clean and detail presentation compared the Envy, e.g. DNA Stratus or an Eddie Current 2a3 or 300B based amp such as the Aficionado or Studio Jr / Studio B.

Stock tubes are pretty meh. The Elrog fixes that but retains the right amount of wetness with none of the gooeyness. Micro and Macro dynamics are elevated to what they're supposed to sound like from their price
 
Jan 14, 2024 at 10:50 PM Post #29 of 62
Stock tubes are pretty meh. The Elrog fixes that but retains the right amount of wetness with none of the gooeyness. Micro and Macro dynamics are elevated to what they're supposed to sound like from their price
No debate that Elrogs can fix a lot of amp sins but I still prefer bending the slightly drier DHT amps in a wetter direction (typically via rectifier swaps) rather than trying to bend a really wet amp drier.
 
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Jan 14, 2024 at 10:52 PM Post #30 of 62
Stock tubes are pretty meh. The Elrog fixes that but retains the right amount of wetness with none of the gooeyness. Micro and Macro dynamics are elevated to what they're supposed to sound like from their price
Do the majority of people tube roll vs sticking with stock? I could drive myself crazy with all the options!
 

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