[Smarty-pants]

^ How are you guys even able to get 24/192 files onto you iDevice?
I didn't think an iDevice would even let you upload anything above 16/48.
Although I guess it is pointless if it is downconverted to 44.1 anyway?
I tried researching this previously, and there is so much misinformation out there I couldn't find what was or wasn't true.

 

[aamefford]

  The Headphone Out of my Sony PCM-M10 recorder is just a convenience feature for monitoring or playback of recordings while still in the field, but using its analog Line Out, the OPPO HA-2's amp section makes a great companion.
 
Sony PCM-M10 Line Out > OPPO HA-2 > OPPO PM-1
 
 

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!

 

 

 
(OPPO HA-2 prototype - the released version might be different)

 

 
Oh!  That never crossed my mind!  I'll have to pull out my PCM-M10 and give it a try!  I forget that thing has a good line out.

 

[jexby]

^ How are you guys even able to get 24/192 files onto you iDevice?
I didn't think an iDevice would even let you upload anything above 16/48.

Although I guess it is pointless if it is downconverted to 44.1 anyway?
I tried researching this previously, and there is so much misinformation out there I couldn't find what was or wasn't true.

 
1.  using Onkyo HD app on my iDevices.  when connected to iTunes via usb cable, under the iPhone's applications pane (bottom left) the high-res/DSD files can be "added" (side loaded) into the Onkyo HD app.
Onkyo has this better documented.
 
2.  connecting my iDevice to Apple CCK cable direct into iFi micro iDSD from what the LEDs are changing/telling me the music is streaming 96 or DSD/DoP.
funny tho: Onkyo HD interface said certain files were 192kHz and being sent (negotiated) with micro iDSD at 192 kHz, yet yellow (96kHz) led always stayed lit.
(this was with Onkyo setting for Upsampling set = OFF)
 
weird

 

[miceblue]

^ How are you guys even able to get 24/192 files onto you iDevice?
I didn't think an iDevice would even let you upload anything above 16/48.
Although I guess it is pointless if it is downconverted to 44.1 anyway?
I tried researching this previously, and there is so much misinformation out there I couldn't find what was or wasn't true.

Aaah, I see what happened in my case.

I was using the Accudio app, which allows you to playback FLAC files, but apparently not HD resolution files. That was my problem. In iTunes, you can load up music into their app in the Apps tab and select "Add..." from the apps section at the bottom.

Someone kindly suggested the Onkyo player on the iTunes Store since it can playback higher resolution files (the basic player is free, HD player is $10 through the free app)...and indeed it does exactly that. The Geek Out has sample rate indicators, which is useful for diagnosing problem with digital playback in this case. Through the Onkyo HD player, I can properly playback 24/96 and 24/192 files just fine as indicated by the 48 x2 and 48 x4 sampling lights. That means the HA-2 should also be playing back the files at their native resolutions.

ALSO, the Onkyo HD player can play back DSD over DoP (more information on that can be found here). I can confirm that loading a DSD track through the Onkyo player plays back native DSD. The Geek Out shows the DSD x2 lights for playback of a DSD128 file.


This was all with using the 30-pin Apple Camera Connection Kit. When connecting to the HA-2 the setup would be:
iPhone -> CCK -> USB-microUSB -> HA-2 -> headphones

Unfortunately I can't think of any way to use the 30-pin to USB cable that came with the HA-2 to check sampling rates.

 

[stjj89]

Subbed

 

[money4me247]

lol you guys trying to figure out how to playback at a higher sampling rates are familiar with Nyquist–Shannon sampling theorem?
 
http://www.trustmeimascientist.com/2013/02/04/the-science-of-sample-rates-when-higher-is-better-and-when-it-isnt/
https://xiph.org/~xiphmont/demo/neil-young.html

 

[zilch0md]

 
Quote:

Oh!  That never crossed my mind!  I'll have to pull out my PCM-M10 and give it a try!  I forget that thing has a good line out.

 
Yes, the PCM-M10's proprietary sigma-delta DAC is tiny bit bright, which happens to be be perfect (with my tastes) for the neutral HA-2 amp with the PM-1 (on Low Gain) and the LCD-2-rev.1 (on Hi Gain). But really, again for my tastes, the HA-2's own ESS9018-M2 is equally bright (as used with digital iOS or Android sources).  So when I says "a tiny bit bright" I hope that puts it into perspective.  I recall that you like a darker sound than some folks, so mount your velour pads on the PM-1 and have fun!
 
Mike

 

[zilch0md]

Hi miceblue,
 
First, I want to say you're doing a great job ferreting out a lot of information about the HA-2 (in the Beta forums, too!)
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by miceblue /img/forum/go_quote.gif


Aaah, I see what happened in my case.

I was using the Accudio app, which allows you to playback FLAC files, but apparently not HD resolution files. That was my problem.
 

Spoiler: Remainder of post...

In iTunes, you can load up music into their app in the Apps tab and select "Add..." from the apps section at the bottom.Someone kindly suggested the Onkyo player on the iTunes Store since it can playback higher resolution files (the basic player is free, HD player is $10 through the free app)...and indeed it does exactly that. The Geek Out has sample rate indicators, which is useful for diagnosing problem with digital playback in this case. Through the Onkyo HD player, I can properly playback 24/96 and 24/192 files just fine as indicated by the 48 x2 and 48 x4 sampling lights. That means the HA-2 should also be playing back the files at their native resolutions.ALSO, the Onkyo HD player can play back DSD over DoP (more information on that can be found here). I can confirm that loading a DSD track through the Onkyo player plays back native DSD. The Geek Out shows the DSD x2 lights for playback of a DSD128 file.This was all with using the 30-pin Apple Camera Connection Kit. When connecting to the HA-2 the setup would be: iPhone -> CCK -> USB-microUSB -> HA-2 -> headphones. Unfortunately I can't think of any way to use the 30-pin to USB cable that came with the HA-2 to check sampling rates.

 

 
 
Does that warrant going back and updating this post, so that people don't get the wrong idea?:
 

Indeed. You're more or less correct. I measured analog signals from:

1. iPhone 4S -> digital out -> HA-2
2. iPhone 4S -> line-out -> HA-2
3. iPhone 4S -> CCK digital out -> HA-2
4. iPhone 4S -> CCK digital out -> JDS Labs C5D
5. iPhone 4S -> CCK digital out -> Geek Out 450 (with a USB hub and external power supply)

I recorded the audio at 24/192 and a spectrum analyser only showed signals at about 21 kHz, so it actually gets downsampled to 44.1 kHz (yes the original 24/192 file has signals above 20 kHz).

 

Thanks,
 
Mike

 

[money4me247]

close up pictures of the new oppo pm3
 

 

 

[ToddTheMetalGod]

Even though I gave up on portable audio due to what is in my opinion sub par sound quality for the price and noisy environment, I might give it another shot with the PM3. I like to go for walks late at night and this could make that more enjoyable.

 

[Praguepolo]

Sorry, I didn't have a chance to read the entire thread, has Oppo hinted to the price point for the PM-3? If they can come in or around (preferably under) the 500 USD mark it would be greatly appreciated.

 

[money4me247]

  Sorry, I didn't have a chance to read the entire thread, has Oppo hinted to the price point for the PM-3? If they can come in or around (preferably under) the 500 USD mark it would be greatly appreciated.

no official pricing announced. speculation & wishful thinking say $500ish hahah

 

[MikeyFresh]

^ How are you guys even able to get 24/192 files onto you iDevice?
I didn't think an iDevice would even let you upload anything above 16/48.
Although I guess it is pointless if it is downconverted to 44.1 anyway?
I tried researching this previously, and there is so much misinformation out there I couldn't find what was or wasn't true.

 
Others have already posted regarding the use of 3rd party music player apps (in my case Onkyo HF Player or CanOpener) and the somewhat clunky file management system within iTunes used to add the hi-rez tracks (they are actually called "documents" but no matter) to those apps, but I've also seen references elsewhere as to how people have added those tracks directly to the stock Music player app. This is for PCM files only, not DSD.
 
I have never been successful in getting this to work, so I'm wondering if anyone else has, or if this functionality has perhaps since been defeated by Apple, via a software or iDevice firmware update.
 
The description of the process was something like this:
 
1) DO NOT first add the hi-rez track or album to your iTunes library, store it in a separate folder, you will not use the iTunes sync button for the transfer.
 
2) Track must be in either ALAC or AIFF file format.
 
3) Either copy/paste or drag the hi-rez tracks from the separate folder directly to the icon for the connected iPod/Phone/Pad.
 
I use iTunes 10 on a Mac running OS10.8 Mountain Lion, and can't make this happen, but others swear it works. Anyone able to try it on a Windows machine?
 
Again, the key is supposedly not first having imported these hi-rez tracks into the iTunes library, that apparently ruins the process. I also don't know for sure if this is limited to 24/96 for instance, or if 24/192 will work. I can't get it to go at all.

 

[MikeyFresh]

^ How are you guys even able to get 24/192 files onto you iDevice?
I didn't think an iDevice would even let you upload anything above 16/48.
Although I guess it is pointless if it is downconverted to 44.1 anyway?
I tried researching this previously, and there is so much misinformation out there I couldn't find what was or wasn't true.

 
Not pointless/downconverted if using the CCK connected to an external DAC.

 

[zilch0md]

Off-topic...
 
 

Spoiler: In reply to the question of 192kHz benefits...

Quote:

  lol you guys trying to figure out how to playback at a higher sampling rates are familiar with Nyquist–Shannon sampling theorem?
 
http://www.trustmeimascientist.com/2013/02/04/the-science-of-sample-rates-when-higher-is-better-and-when-it-isnt/
https://xiph.org/~xiphmont/demo/neil-young.html

 
Using higher resolution files than 44.1/16 can audibly improve performance with DACs that aren't as well designed as the likes of Dan Lavry's creations.
 
Quoting the article at the link you provided:
 

There are definitely some converters that sound significantly better at a higher sampling rate than at a lower one, even in a blind test. But strictly speaking, the problem isn’t with the lower sampling rate – it’s with the converter.

 
But I'm personally not convinced there's any benefit to going higher than 96/24, even to protect myself from less than "perfectly" designed DACs, so I agree with the main point of the article, thanks to the author's concession, that I've quoted here.