[Priaptor]

Thanks.  Awesome review.  As an owner of the LCD-X I am very interested in your comments.  
 
One of your critical points of not recognizing how loud you were playing is, IMHO, as it pertains to speaker systems actually a "good point" rather than a "critical point".  The very best speakers will also give you that perception because of the ability of the transducer's coherency.  My main speaker system consists of the unique NOLA Concert Grands and just what you described with the HE1000 is a "critical point" I noticed with these speakers when I got them setup.  
 
It sounds like the latitude, based on your description, is truly amazing.
 
I look forward to comparing them to me my LCD-X

 

[immtbiker]

Orthos are usually quite fast but my benchmark for 'lightning quick' are 007/009 followed by hd800 and he6 .. 

 
I don't think the 007's are quick at all. In fact, just the opposite.

 

[rgs9200m]

Sorry for being off-topic, I just wanted to answer catspaw's question about gaming phones, and my answer is an Oppo PM1; no peaky highs, great comfort (esp. w/ velour pads), very refined sound, deep/controlled bass, great, musical, articulate mids. Sort of the polar opposite to HD800s. (I own both of these.) I would suggest any replies to this belong in an Oppo thread, not here.

 

[musicman59]

My beta HE1K has shown up

. Fedex delivered it in one piece and put it right next to my door.

Be patient (one more time) and let them burn-in for at least 100 hours. IMO they clearly changed compared to just out of the box....

 

[buson160man]

  Funny, I tested myself not long ago and I can hear up to 18.3 kHz . WEll I can hear up to 19k, but its a lot quiter there . If I remember correctly, when I was doing my driving liecence (this was in a silenced room) I was able to get above 20khz by a bit as the doctor told me, and he also asked me If I had any visual impediments as it seems most people dont have that good of a hearing unless their brain is compensating for visual deficiency.
 
I do have to say that his review does not tell me much however (I thought LCD-2, LCD-3 and LCD-X were barely better than my modded HE-400, so I will take his advice with a grain of salt). Clearly better but barely better if that makes any sense.
 
I do however need the best gaming headphone I can get withouth it killing my ears due to treble peaks in games, so I will keep looking and see what is the best I can get (so far, its the HE-560 but I decided that untill I test the HD800 and the HE1000 Im not buying it).

   I appreciate the time and effort that money put in to do his review. But not to be negative his review was one with a limited number of headphone amps. I myself really do not like the schiit amps all that much. There are better amps out there. With better amplification the results I am sure would have been somewhat different.
  It looks like you have not upgraded the stock cable on your audeze phones. I have on my ldc2 v2 prefazor headphones and I can tell you that the stock cable that audeze provides ,is not a very good cable at all . In fact it sucks you are really not hearing what your audezes are capable of until you hear it with a better cable. Most of the criticisms though probably not all were alleviated by the cable upgrade. My LCD 2 v2s are not detail monsters but the clarity of sound improved enough that I am satisfied with them .
   I heard the 1000 but only briefly at the axpona show. They were using a hiifi man headphone amp ( I think it might have been a prototype) It sounded promising but considering it was in the ear expo room with some ambient noise bleeding through it was really not the best listening environment.

 

[reddog]

Be patient (one more time) and let them burn-in for at least 100 hours. IMO they clearly changed compared to just out of the box....

Thanks. I plan on burning them in between 100 hours and 160 hours. I was hoping the folk from Team Hifiman would had stated how long it should be burned in, like they did for HE-400i demo unit. But already I like the way they sounded when I listened to Frank Zappa's GUITAR. I shall try 100 hour burn in time and go from there. Thanks again for the advice. I still feel like a newbie to some of this stuff and appreciate suggestions and what not.

 

[Music Alchemist]

  I think some actual beta testers are struggling a bit with describing how this headphone performs. The combination of driver surface area, extremely low mass, new / optimized magnet structure - we're experiencing a headphone that can respond extremely quickly to impulse, without the 'edges' we've heard in the past with other ortho's - due to the extremely low diaphragm mass / optimized magnetics. We have a headphone here that can present as very fast AND laid-back / relaxed. When the music hits hard, this headphone will shake your spine. When music is delicate, layered, textured - this headphone delivers. Many are calling it a genre master; that really tells us a lot about its technical capabilities.
 
As always, you and everyone will need to decide if it's the headphone for your needs and preferences; I guess the point I'm trying to make is while driver speed has often meant certain strengths / limitations in the past, IME - that assumption should not be applied to the HE-1000.

 
Just wanted to say that this post was the tipping point for me. I found that virtually every headphone I heard in the past had strengths in certain genres and weaknesses with others. Usually, when I hear genre master, I think compromises that may hinder ultimate technical performance. But since the HE1000 seems to be able to nail every genre without making compromises, even surpassing most other headphones technically, I am SOLD. Already made arrangements to purchase it once I have the funds. Also set this (which I made myself and entitled "One HEK of a RYgg") as my wallpaper, to use as daily inspiration.

 

[prot]

I don't think the 007's are quick at all. In fact, just the opposite.

Diff strokes for diff folks
Admitedly I spent much more time with the 009 but the 007 is just barely diff for me .. tad slower/warmer/veiled or however you wanna put it. Of course my 'barely' was already described as a big diff by others.
And 009 does not seem fast if you listen only to it... more like effortless. So effortless that I did not think about it as fast the first time ... couldve sworn the hd800 was faster. But then I did put em side by side on the same amp (some totl stax with dual output) and the 009 was quite clearly faster.
Also, the playback chain matters a lot .. even one of the slow audeze may seem faster on an aggresive amp/dac combo than a 009 on a warm tube amp and lush Dac.
Anyway, it's not like I'm some truth bearer .. that's my exp and yours is same as valid.

money4me247
I am familiar with your work . And that's one of the reasons I appreciated your review so much. Thx for the hek & gaming additions, guess I was wrong and did read too much into the silky/relaxed reports

 

[jamato8]

Some guy's 'barely better' is another's 'night and day'. I'm usually in the former camp and I see quite often ppl using words like night&day, destroys, etc for diffs that I know to be barely audible and only in quiet envs. You'll have to find same minded people and read their impressions, otherwise you need to 'translate'. One issue with that: ppl from the barely camp dont usually write nice, long and very detailed reviews...they barely write 5 lines... and that's why they arent usually picked for actions like this. Noone likes short, clear and honest reviews, everyone likes nice 'stories' about the sound.. manufacturers and buyers the same.
Gotta admit, I like reading a nice, well written review too .. but when it comes to buying decisions I'll go with the concise & brutally honest few lines. I know there is no perfect product (not even perfect-for-me) and I'd like to know the issues in advance .. plus, page-long praises have a funny smell (at least to me).

Anyway, I think @money4me247 wrote a very nice review which has everything one needs .. thank you! But of course he cant compare with all HPs on the face of earth and noone can satisfy everyone.

As to your gaming HP quest, the he1000 is prolly not your target since it was already described several times as somewhat more laidback/slower/silkier than the usual orthos .. that's a typical audiophile signature and the opposite of the 'action HPs' needed for gaming. The faster/exciting he4xx/5xx/6 should be better for your usecase... or even a hd650.. or hd800 if you can tame the highs .. or the some of the other flagships releasing this summer (pioneer, dharma, ether) which seem to be all on the more faster/neutral side.

P.S.
hope I do not get banned for this... ppl ask Qs, it's normal to have some lateral discussions. I find @Hifiman's 'dont make me ban you' attitude kinda pricky .. just do the work and link the relevant posts in the FP. And btw, wasnt there a special kind of thread for impressions? (where you can mark the review posts and have them autolinked in FP, etc..)

 
I agree, there can be quite a dichotomy in descriptions of what is better and how much. How much more personal and subjective can you get than in this audio interpretation. So many variables, too many to account for accurately but we try. 
 
This is a dedicated thread by Hifiman for impressions and I know they wanted to keep it that way. On this same forum there is a more general thread for dialogue and that is what Hifiman was hoping would be used, while keeping this thread condensed into a true impressions thread, good or bad. That is my take on this. 

  I think some actual beta testers are struggling a bit with describing how this headphone performs. The combination of driver surface area, extremely low mass, new / optimized magnet structure - we're experiencing a headphone that can respond extremely quickly to impulse, without the 'edges' we've heard in the past with other ortho's - due to the extremely low diaphragm mass / optimized magnetics. We have a headphone here that can present as very fast AND laid-back / relaxed. When the music hits hard, this headphone will shake your spine. When music is delicate, layered, textured - this headphone delivers. Many are calling it a genre master; that really tells us a lot about its technical capabilities.

Yes and that is something I mentioned in part of one of my short impressions, is that the sound is neither typical headphone nor speaker. For me, and I have many, many years of experience, this is a totally new experience in listening. I don't have common ground to fall back on except top say that the HE1000 are totally different from other phones I have tried except for the shared traits that they do have, they sit on my head and have a wire attaching them to an amplifier. 
 
I am listening to Band of Horses, on DSD. There is a disconnection between the sound and having it "in" my head. It is residing outside of my head in an area not like a good speaker system but also not connected in the way other phones have felt, including the R10, though I will say the Sony R10 are still special, I won't take that from them. 
 
Part of this new ground for me is one, the phones get sound right. Guitar, voice, drums, audience sound, are all there, free to be where they are in the recording and yet the recording is taken to a new level in the retrieval of auditory cues. So as these beta HK1000s are out here, not only are they new, for me at least, the need to explore new ways to describe them and find adjectives to convey as best I can, reaches deeper and makes me use some brain cells that have laid dormant for some time, like coming out of the deep freeze of an Alaskan winter. And this isn't bad at all, new phones, a new sound, and exploring, for me, new ways to describe what I am hearing. 
 
The HK1000 definitely do something differently, and they are doing that differently, right. 

 

[DreamKing]

   

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!

@DreamKing, thank you for your positive feedback. didn't include comfort aspects in my review as those things may be subject to change. for physical comfort of the HE-1000 beta vs HE-560: the HE-1k's earpads are softer and much larger width and height. earcup depth at the back both hifiman models actually measures out quite similarly, but I do think the HE-1k's earpads are shallower at the back (especially accounting for compression from its extra softness). I am currently strongly advocating for deeper earpads on the HE-1k (though I have not personally run into any problems with the earcup depth).
 
The HE-1k is slightly heavier than the HE-560 but not nowhere near as heavy as something like the LCD-X. Do note that the "felt" weight on the K7xx, HE-560, and HE-1000 is less than the actual weight as well due to the suspension design on those headphones. My LCD-X also feels lighter on my head as I have a suspension strap mod. In the spoiler is the actual total weight of all my headphones for comparative purposes.
 

Spoiler: My measured weight of all my headphones (on kitchen scale, not the same as official quoted weights)

AKG K7xx = 294 grams
[size=1em]PM-3 = 331 grams[/size]
HE-560 = ~403 grams* (w/ cable still attached since I hate fiddling with the hifiman screw connectors)
Alpha Prime = 451 grams
HE-1000 = 486 grams
Audeze EL-8 = 504 grams.
Audeze LCD-X = 682 grams

Besides advocating for deeper earpads, my only other concern relating to comfort has to due to the fit of the leather suspension strap. Currently, I can see users having heads too small for even the smallest setting (actually have links to more detailed posting on both those issues buried in the value section of my review). I would personally benefit from such a change as well since I am currently using a headband mod to get the best fit (though they do fit my head in stock configuration). I fully expect our beta feedback will be taken into account prior to official release, so do note that all these concerns really only relate specifically to the beta units for now. We will see how the final production version turns out

 

I see, really hope these comfort concerns will be examined by Hifiman for changes that will transpire in the production units to accommodate as many owners as possible. 

 

[TeamHiFiMAN]

Fang will most likely be shortening the actual suspension band to try and fit people with smaller heads.
 
It's a simpler fix than adjusting the steps on the headband itself.
 
Hope this helps.

 

[goldendarko]

Fang will most likely be shortening the actual suspension band to try and fit people with smaller heads.

It's a simpler fix than adjusting the steps on the headband itself.

Hope this helps.

That's great news! That has been my only complaint about these headphones so far. Sonically they are a marvel and I think will be a reference for years to come. Well done team hifiman

 

[reddog]

I am burning in my HE1K's, every 24 hours I will listen for an hour, to see how the sound signature changes. I will burn them in a minimum of 100 hours.
I am using my Asgard 2 to burn in my HE1K, but will likely turn to my lyr 2 after the first 50 hours of burn time. And if the HE1K still needs further burn time I will use my rag, in balanced mode, for 24 hours. I am very impressed with how the HE1K sounded out of the box, nice and natural, although the bass has not opened up, and not impactful sounding as of yet.

 

[reddog]

Fang will most likely be shortening the actual suspension band to try and fit people with smaller heads.

It's a simpler fix than adjusting the steps on the headband itself.

Hope this helps.

That is great news, the headphones fit but on the smallest setting to fit my head.

 

[money4me247]

@preproman, no worries. I don't mind constructive conversations even if our opinions don't match. Speaking specifically on the LCD-3F. Have my posting in a spoiler as it does seem semi off-topic, but I do hope to clarify my background so you can better understand my perspective and hopefully, it will help you put my thoughts on the HE-1k into perspective and see how my impressions relate to your own personal goals.
 

Spoiler: some background that may help clarify my thoughts

Originally Posted by preproman /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Quote:

I personally also find the LCD-X and LCD-3 to be extremely comparable in sound quality with even more subtle differences that are quite difficult to hear even during direct comparisons for both audiophiles and non-audiophiles.

 

This is where I think we're not on the same page.  Try to make clear which LCD-3 you're talking about, (for me anyway)  LCD-3C or LCD-3F.  You know you (meaning people in general) and me, tend to listen for the things we don't like the most (well at least I do).  That being said - U-shaped sound sigs. 
 
Having both the LCD-3F and the LCD-X side by side deciding which one to keep.  Right off the bat the midrange magic stood out for me on the LCD-3F (a good thing) and the lack of it in the LCD-X also stood out like a sore thumb (a bad thing)  YMMV of course.
 
That brings me around to the HE1000.  Even a slight mention of a recessed midrange on these has me already worried.  We all have different requirements for our headphones and a solid midrange (not recessed) in "one" of mine.  YMMV of course.
 
Just trying to get a handle on this midrange thing.  Not being a beta tester, I can for now anyway only rely on what others have to say and their impressions.
 
All in the name of constructive conversations.

 
To clarify, I was specifically speaking about the differences in sound quality attributes (rather than sound signature tuning) between the LCD-X  & LCD-3F being quite subtle. I found the differences in sound stage, imaging, detail resolution, and transient speed to be extremely difficult to differentiate between the LCD-X and LCD-3F. I would give the LCD-X the edge in transient response speed. Perhaps the edge in detail resolution to the LCD-3F. The other aspects too close to call for me either way even after multiple long direct side-by-side comparisons. Overall, I am left with the strong feeling that technical abilities between these headphones are extremely close and hard to call IMO. Can easily see a persuasive argument for either one especially depending on the source track or genre being tested.
 
I was in a similar situation as you deciding between the LCD-X and the LCD-3F. I do agree with you about the sound signature tuning of the LCD-X vs LCD-3F. Did not find either to be 'ideal' presentations of neutral with a extra bit of warmth underlying their tonal presentation and some coloration to both sound signatures. I found the LCD-3F more mid-centric and the LCD-X a bit more bass-heavy. On the LCD-X, I did not find the mids on the whole to be recessed, but there was definitely a darker presentation to the LCD-X compared to a "neutral" *** pair of headphones. I did find the recession to the upper midrange on the LCD-X to be most pronounced in direct comparisons to the LCD-3. While I personally could not differentiate between the extra 'smoothness' to the mids that people ascribe to the LCD-3F (thought both the 3f & X had quite organic mid-range though the 3F did have more forward mids), I did find the LCD-X to appear to have an extra bit of edginess in the treble region (possibly ~5 kHz) in a direct comparison against the LCD-3F while the LCD-3 seems to smooth out that region. I can see some people ascribing a v-shaped sound sig on the LCD-X's due to their extra sparkle in the upper registers, but I personally found the lower treble to be a bit recessed as well, so I personally would not categorize the LCD-X as v-shaped or mid-recessed though I can see how those terms can be broadly applied. I think the LCD-X's coloration is a bit more unique and complex that those traditional categories. I personally found the LCD-3F's bass quality a bit lacking for my preferences. Subbass seemed noticeably recessed to my ears and there was a lack of impact/slam to the 3F's bass (only in a direct comparison against the Xs). Upper registers on the 3F do seem to lack air to my ears in comparison to more 'neutral headphones'*** and I thought the LCD-X's slightly crispier treble presentation suited my tastes better. I do want to note that the LCD-X is my complimentary pair of headphones and I do not think it typifies a neutral presentation. I use it primarily for bassier tracks such as edm or rock or metal when I want to dance or rock out. Works for hip hop as well depending on the artist. Some of the more lyrical-focused rappers, I still prefer the HE-560. It's just the trashy rap that I use the LCD-X for usually (not a knock against the LCD-X, just for some rap songs really you can totally cut out the vocals since they aren't saying anything worthwhile anyway hahah, but the song just has an enjoyable beat)
 
***(HE-560's tuning represents what I think to be more linear and flat frequency response curve though I can understand people who comment that it is a bit on the brighter side of neutral. I have recently noticed the extra edginess to the treble on the HE-560 so I can see how it deviates from neutral. However, the that edginess does not bother me as much as a lack of air (in the upper 12+ kHz region) or a recession in the 6-10 kHz region, so I can personally be quite happy with the HE-560's tuning and use it as my main. HD800 is also quite close to what a consider to be linear as well, though I personally rate it as definitely a tad bit brighter than neutral, the PM-1 is definitely warmer than neutral to my ears).

 
Now all that background being said, for a pair of headphones to really work as a primary pair of headphones for me, I am not looking for an u-shaped sound signature at all. My HE-560's get much more head-time than the LCD-X, and I do think their mid-range is quite capable. maybe some subtle upper mid recession as well especially in contrast to that 4 kHz edge, but I do think that too much in the 1-3 kHz region can cause a bit of fatigue after long listening sessions.
 
For the HE-1k, I tried to clearly articulate that the subtle initial impression of a u-shaped sound signature was simply due to the he1k's extreme quality improvements in the bass and treble over the he-560 rather than any sort of quantitative emphasis. I do think it is very much an illusion that resolves with a bit of 'brain-burn-in' time. While I haven't gotten the chance to do a direct comparison of the HE-1k against the LCD-3F, I do strongly feel that the HE-1k's midrange is much more realistic and detailed than the LCD-3F while maintaining that unique liquid cohesion. I refrained from saying those sort of comments in my review as I do not have the LCD-3F on hand for direct comparisons and feel that direct comparisons from LCD-3F owners will be more insightful than me using my audio memory. The additional tuning or emphasis of the midrange mentioned in the critique was not meant to say to that there the entire overall midrange required an elevation as I felt overall the midrange extended quite linearly from the bass response (though there was an 'illusion' of more bass due to the extension and improved resolution of the sub-bass, aka the 'sub-woofer effect').
 
My critique of the mid-range was a specific concern with male vocals (especially spoken vocals, and extremely source dependent), NOT the overall mid-range tuning, which I personally find to be quite accurate overall. I meant that the midrange had the greatest room for improvement to my ears as the bass and treble was extremely well tuned for my preferences. I did NOT mean that the midrange lacked quantity against the bass and treble.
 
My mid-range concerns only related to certain male artists' voices while the remaining mid-range instruments were extremely realistic and did not sound recessed at all. If you listen to any rock or metal song on the HE-1k, you can clearly hear the guitars being showcased as the most prominent feature of the song, which would indicate to me that the mid-range on the whole is not recessed. On the LCD-X, you can clearly hear the bass being emphasized over the guitars in the same tracks.
 
The possible causes that I speculated may have contributed to my concern were either:
1) subtle variations within the midrange
2) variation in the 80-150 Hz region (fundamental frequency of the male voice, really more of a bass tuning than midrange issue). Can possibly be a not enough 'brain-burn-in' effect due to me not having experienced this sort of sub-bass presentation previously, so the upper mid-bass is not as relatively prominent/over-emphasized as I am used to on a pair of headphones (aka the sub-woofer effect).
3) a dynamic range being wider than I am used to (so I may not have adjusted to the variations in volume levels for male vocals in comparison to the rest of the track)
4) simply just due to the the mastering of the source material. 
 
edit: *****Important Note!!! After much more extended testing, I am leaning more towards the idea that my critique on certain male vocals is more related to the HE-1k's dynamic range and the source material. Will update my review with a spoiler labeled 'frequency response balance on hip hop and rock' with specific test tracks and my findings when I have more free time. *****