[romaz]

 
(Romaz, you tested your HE1000 Headphone directly connected to a Briscati DAC (with a dual 3-pin female XLRs adapter) and you told me that it was already very impressive. Was the TotalDac D1 Dual better than the Briscati to drive direct the Headphone ? )

 
Yes, I am directly comparing my Bricasti M1 against the TotalDac d1-dual using my dual 3-pin female XLR Silver Dragon cable from Moon Audio (an excellent cable).  
 

 
The Bricasti has slightly better transient response.  The TotalDac is better in every other regard.  This is surprising to me because the Bricasti is not some entry level DAC and to be bested so convincingly has been humbling.  My bias was to like what I already owned better but having been exposed to this new truth, it is hard to go back.  The TotalDac simply has a blacker background (especially noticeable when HP connected directly to DAC) and while it is smoother, it hits harder with surprising punch and much richer tone.  Presentation is more convincingly real and to throw any amp on top of it almost adds a veil is what I am discovering.  Since the purpose of a DAC is to faithfully present the source, the source becomes that much more important.
 
I am hearing wonderful things about Vincent's upgraded TotalDAC server.  It has a new quad-core Cuboid cpu and the server now also has an improved AES/EBU port and large copper plate similar to the DAC to shield against EMI, minimize vibration and weigh down the server.  Reports elsewhere suggest a significant improvement in SQ and obviously excellent synergy with the DAC.  Having communicated with Vincent just a few days ago, unfortunately, he has no immediate plans to incorporate Roon but he has upgraded his software to utilize the new CPU.  
 
Alternatively, here is a photo of the Aurender N10.  This is a wonderful front end, so far the best I have heard and several levels above my purpose-built, Linux based CAPS server and Auralic Aries.  I am eager to see how it compares to the TotalDac server with reclocker.
 

 

[nepherte]

Originally Posted by romaz /img/forum/go_quote.gif
Having communicated with Vincent just a few days ago, unfortunately, he has no immediate plans to incorporate Roon but he has upgraded his software to utilize the new CPU.  

 
I asked that same question a fews days ago, and got the same reply. However, I also know that technically this is still possible. You can access the server via ssh and install the software yourself... I am still hoping that more customers request this feature once a linux version is available so that we can have this as a default option.

 

[romaz]

  Actually, it supplies 2x voltage and 4x power (that's just physics)
 

 
Even better.  Having spoken to Vincent about this, he told me 6.2v translates to about 1 watt at 32 ohms which is roughly the impedance of the HE-1000.  If this is 4x more powerful than the headphone port, then the headphone port outputs only 250 mW.  Regardless, via XLR, it drives it superbly.
 
 

 
I own a Totaldac d1-dual and I believe monoblocs would be overkill for headphones. Using the Totaldac balanced already significantly limits the usable range of my amplifier's volume know (for the 300Ohm HD800). With the monoblocs you will likely have to lower the volume on the DAC itself. 

 
I am aware you have this DAC as it was your review that got me started on this path of discovery.  Well done, btw.  My HE-1000 is much hungrier of current than your HD800 and for high dynamic range recordings, the extra headroom is not a luxury but a necessity.  Out of the headphone port (3.1v), I find the output to be barely enough.  I would not consider headphone direct to this DAC with the HE-1000 except via XLR.  As for the monoblocs being too much for headphones, yes, it sounds crazy but my gut tells me the difference will be there and it will be significant but that is what I hope to discover for myself.  If I can go without a dedicated headphone amp, that could justify the price.  Adding the monobloc doesn't increase power since you are still only getting 6.2v output per channel and so my volume levels will not increase.  Here are Vincent's own words:
 
"The d1-monobloc outputs the same power as the d1-dual, it just does it with more ease because the amplifiers are doubled (but the voltage is the same)."
 
 

  The music server would be the better investment I think (and actually considering it myself). I have been in talks with Vincent to see if I could run Roon on it once a linux built is available.

 
This is what I am hoping.  And with the monobloc, it only adds about 1000 Euros to the price since the reclocker is part of the package and so it would be foolish not to get it.  I also hope Roon becomes available at some point but here is what Vincent told me:
 
"I don't know if later I will also offer Roon, there is not plan for that yet. Remember that you can also down-use a d1-server as a reclocker, and connect a computer to it, with Roon software for example."
 
I don't want to hijack this thread with too much TotalDac talk since this should be about the Nagra but I believe these two (monobloc and Nagra HD) are very competitive options operating in the same price range and so hopefully it becomes clear which is better for headphone use.  While I am approaching the Nagra with an open mind, the headphone output of the Nagra seems too low and I struggle to know how dynamic the HE-1000 will sound out of the headphone port?  Comments thus far are with much easier to drive headphones.

 

[bmichels]

Aurender N10 is really much better than the ARIES ?!!

 

[romaz]

Yes, unbelievably better and easily evident within 30 seconds.  Also, it is expected to run Roon.  If the TotalDac Server is not better, I will get this for sure.
 
Here is a good recent review:
 
http://www.computeraudiophile.com/f10-music-servers/aurender-n10-review-25192/

 

[bmichels]

Yes, unbelievably better and easily evident within 30 seconds.  Also, it is expected to run Roon.  If the TotalDac Server is not better, I will get this for sure.

Here is a good recent review:

http://www.computeraudiophile.com/f10-music-servers/aurender-n10-review-25192/

If the N10 can soon run ROON, then this is very very good News. Where did you get this info ? is it placed for soon ?

 

[romaz]

Here is my concern with the Nagra and the HE-1000.  This is an excerpt from the 6 moons review which I'm sure most have seen but its worth highlighting:
 

"With the HD DAC, I even had sufficient gain to drive HifiMan's HE-6 though I'd not call that combination ideal. It lacked the grip, definition and jump factor which signify proper control."  
 

Not the kind of words I want to read for this kind of money.
 

The HE-1000 is not as current hungry as the HE-6 but it is much closer to the HE-6 in its demands for power than any of the Audezes.  Having carefully A/B'd the HE-1000 against the LCD-2/3/X, they all sound good and can play loud with any amp and that is the misconception with the HE-1000 and perhaps why some don't understand what the big deal is with this headphone.  Drive it properly with something with authority and grip and it is magical.  Drive it improperly and it will sound too soft.

 

[romaz]

If the N10 can soon run ROON, then this is very very good News. Where did you get this info ? is it placed for soon ?

Kerry
Jun 4
 

Are there any plans for Roon to work with Aurender?

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dannyDanny Dulai
Jun 4
 

Already in contact with Aurender 

No ETA....

 

[romaz]

If the N10 can soon run ROON, then this is very very good News. Where did you get this info ? is it placed for soon ?

Roon specifications were apparently submitted to Aurender and everyone else first week of September.  Now it's up to Aurender.

 

[nepherte]

@romaz: Agreed. Let's not hijack this thread. We can move our discussion via the appropriate channels (ie. Totaldac thread or PM). I was just excited somebody using the Totaldac directly with headphones and considering monoblocks / server / reclocker
 
I have no clue about what the Nagra is capable of outputting. Using only the headphone out of the DAC is something that @bmichels and I have briefly discussed during our little get together and seems a topic worth further exploring. I am however very much surprised about what the HE1000 requires. I had the opportunity to audition a pair from HeadAmp from a Cavalli DIY during the Denver Head-Fi meet and was pleasantly surprised by the HE1000 (though not that much to consider replacing my HD800).

 

[isquirrel]

I plan on testing the Nagra with the HE-1000 and with and without using the on board headphone amp. I was talking with Jack Woo this morning and he was saying that the HE-1000's do require a fair bit of current to drive them properly, this is something I have noticed. I am only 3-4 clicks down on the volume control compared to the Abyss, so I would estimate that as only 10% less gain. I have noticed that when running the HE-1000 on lower power amps they do not perform nearly as well. I can't help but think that the people who are having negative experiences with the HE-1000's are listening on amps that do not have the current to properly drive them.
 
What will be interesting and I wish I knew was how much current the on-board amp in the Nagra can deliver. 
 
I have managed to get Roon Server working on the Computer Audio Design CAT music server and use the iOS app as the control. It works flawlessly and has allowed me to go away from using JPlay and its limitations. CAD are in the process of becoming a Roon certified hard partner. They do some important things radically different to Aurender. I have had the N20 here for a couple of weeks and I prefer the CAT. However the CAT is definitely a no compromise music server and assumes that the user has some knowledge of computers and is not afraid to get under the hood so to speak. The Surender has been designed with a completely different more mainstream market in mind. Both have their place IMHO. I have Roon Sever running on Win 8.1 and am only using 35 processes and 750MB of ram while using Roon. I think that is quite impressive. Like you guys I love Roon its opened up my music library and scope for discovering new music through Tidal. TO think Roon are only 6 months out from the launch and they are already producing a product that is so well liked and is in my system anyway incredibly stable.
 
It is very interesting to read about the Total DAC unfortunately I have never heard one and they are difficult to get in Australia. Next time I am in Europe I will make time to have a listen.
 
I have arranged same day service so its possible that I will see the Nagra today or tomorrow.
 
 
@Romaz - what were the driver tubes in the Woo 234's that Tyll was using? The power tubes and rectifiers looked like the Takatsuki's?

 

[paulchiu]

  I plan on testing the Nagra with the HE-1000 and with and without using the on board headphone amp. I was talking with Jack Woo this morning and he was saying that the HE-1000's do require a fair bit of current to drive them properly, this is something I have noticed. I am only 3-4 clicks down on the volume control compared to the Abyss, so I would estimate that as only 10% less gain. I have noticed that when running the HE-1000 on lower power amps they do not perform nearly as well. I can't help but think that the people who are having negative experiences with the HE-1000's are listening on amps that do not have the current to properly drive them.
 
What will be interesting and I wish I knew was how much current the on-board amp in the Nagra can deliver. 
 
I have managed to get Roon Server working on the Computer Audio Design CAT music server and use the iOS app as the control. It works flawlessly and has allowed me to go away from using JPlay and its limitations. CAD are in the process of becoming a Roon certified hard partner. They do some important things radically different to Aurender. I have had the N20 here for a couple of weeks and I prefer the CAT. However the CAT is definitely a no compromise music server and assumes that the user has some knowledge of computers and is not afraid to get under the hood so to speak. The Surender has been designed with a completely different more mainstream market in mind. Both have their place IMHO. I have Roon Sever running on Win 8.1 and am only using 35 processes and 750MB of ram while using Roon. I think that is quite impressive. Like you guys I love Roon its opened up my music library and scope for discovering new music through Tidal. TO think Roon are only 6 months out from the launch and they are already producing a product that is so well liked and is in my system anyway incredibly stable.
 
It is very interesting to read about the Total DAC unfortunately I have never heard one and they are difficult to get in Australia. Next time I am in Europe I will make time to have a listen.
 
I have arranged same day service so its possible that I will see the Nagra today or tomorrow.
 
 
@Romaz - what were the driver tubes in the Woo 234's that Tyll was using? The power tubes and rectifiers looked like the Takatsuki's?

 
A coouple of reflections @isquirrel
 
1. Steve Guttenberg (CNET & Stereophile) did say the Nagra HD DAC head amp made "astonishing" music with the HE1000.
2. The 300B on that Woo 234 were Sophia Electrics.  The Takatsuki 300B would have added more sweetness in the delicate vocal ranges. 

 

[romaz]

  I can't help but think that the people who are having negative experiences with the HE-1000's are listening on amps that do not have the current to properly drive them.
 
 

 
I completely agree.  One prominent head-fier I know has recently had a complete change of heart upon further evaluation with a more fitting amp.  It's the same thing for the HE-6.

 

[romaz]

  I have had the N20 here for a couple of weeks and I prefer the CAT. However the CAT is definitely a no compromise music server and assumes that the user has some knowledge of computers and is not afraid to get under the hood so to speak. 

 
Your take on this is interesting as I have no experience with the CAT.  Same thing goes for Antipodes.  The problem with using PCs is while these machines that we are talking about are purpose-built, as you say, they are subject to a complicated OS that often requires tinkering and oversight.  While I have a computer background and have experienced my share of aggravation with Windows and am even tolerant of some of them, while listening to music, this is not the time I wish to have to worry about the OS.  For me, the simpler the better which is why Linux-based devices have greater appeal (CAPS, Aries, Aurender, etc).  Like you, however, SQ is paramount and so I am in search of the device that seamlessly combines SQ with trouble-free ease of use.  And yes, Roon is the icing on the cake.

 

[romaz]

 
@Romaz - what were the driver tubes in the Woo 234's that Tyll was using? The power tubes and rectifiers looked like the Takatsuki's?

 
I verified that the Takatsuki 300bs and 274s were in place.  The drivers were not the ideal Tung Sol round plate with oval mica that you use but rather the stock 6SN7 drivers that Woo supplies.  I realize the driver would have made a difference.  I am coming from a smaller tube perspective (2A3 and currently PX-4 which is somewhere closer to a 45) where everything is tighter and somehow the presentation I heard was not as controlled, especially in comparison to some of the other amps.  It also didn't help that my expectations were probably unrealistic.