[nm2285]

Well I've tried the Sennheiser HD280s; Sony MDR-V6s; Grado Sr-60, 80, 125; owned the HD497s; and own the HD590s. I like the 590s except for the fact that they're slightly too bloated in the midrange/midbass (too dark a presentation). I like the sound of my etymotic er-6 and am basically looking for something along those lines, but more refined and superaural. I'm also not a great fan of the Grado: too dynamic/forward for me. Price range around the 590s.

Lets hear some recommendations. Thanks!

 

[Emon]

More refined sound than the ER-6 but superaural? What about circumaural? And what do you mean by "defined"? I find the ER-6 to be quite defined and detailed, finding that detail in a full sized can will be difficult. What's your source and amp? You low impedence cans, which tells me you probably don't have an amp, which tells me you're probably on a budget and thus probably don't have a fantastic source. Not yet anyway, right?

But yeah, some more info would be helpful. Can't be sure what to recommend if we don't know if you have an amp or not...

 

[RnB180]

my akg 240m headphones were pretty darn neutral, if you want to hear how the actual recording sounds, these are pretty good.

 

[some1x]

If your amp is up to the task, try the HD600. The HD6x0 line is very natural sounding.

 

[catscratch]

The natural-ness of the HD600/650 is the subject of much debate here. Without going into any highlights, I would say that if the HD590 is too dark for you, the HD600 and especially 650 is not the direction you want to go into. They're darker than the HD590, even if they're a whole lot better.

I would recommend the new Sony's. The SA1000, SA3000, and SA5000, depending on how much you want to spend. They'll be bright, very open, and very detailed, without too much midbass bloat. Try them, you should like them.

Alternatively - and IMO preferably...

See if you can find a pair of used Stax Lambda's or Lambda Pro's. They should set you back about as much as a new pair of 590's. They're definitely what you want - light, quick sound with detail galore, yet also the lushness and fullness of a well-fashioned electrostat. Make sure that the corresponding amps are included in the package, since you'll need an electrostatic amp to drive them.

The term "natural" is a bit subjective. What is natural to you will vary with how you're used to hearing your music. If you're a musician and are used to hearing music from the stage, then the brightness and forwardness of Grados will sound natural to you. If you're used to heaing music from a large concert hall, then the warmth and laid-back character of the Senns will sound natural. In this regard, Staxes are more like Grados, though not quite as bright. I believe the old Lambda's are a bit brighter than the new 202/303/404 series, so they should be to your liking from that point of view as well.

 

[amartignano]

Quote:

Originally Posted by catscratch The natural-ness of the HD600/650 is the subject of much debate here. Without going into any highlights, I would say that if the HD590 is too dark for you, the HD600 and especially 650 is not the direction you want to go into. They're darker than the HD590, even if they're a whole lot better.

I disagree.

I had the HD590 and the HD650. The HD590 was one of the wors headphones I've ever head. Boomy and hars at the same time, with boosted mid-highs and recessed and not detailed highs.

To me the HD650 sounds much much better, in all department, but especially in the mid-highs and highs region, that is far more linear and linear in an absolute way. So IMHO the HD650 does not sound darker than the HD590, moreover, they sound clearer, more detailed and more "luminous" in the highs region, 'cause they have a very good balance overall, far better than the HD590, which is deficient in the mids at the point that some sounds are masked.

For nm2285: consider also the beyer DT880, slightly brighter than the HD650 (for me a little more correct balance than the HD650, which sometimes tends to be too generous in the bass region), but still very extended and balanced, a little more forward sound with a more rounded rendering of the timbre of the instruments IMHO. The HD650 however has a more correct headstage, a little more "distant" sound which someone can prefer.

Bye
Andrea

 

[setmenu]

Quote:

Originally Posted by catscratch The term "natural" is a bit subjective. What is natural to you will vary with how you're used to hearing your music. If you're a musician and are used to hearing music from the stage, then the brightness and forwardness of Grados will sound natural to you. If you're used to heaing music from a large concert hall, then the warmth and laid-back character of the Senns will sound natural.

Hi catscatch
The above is a very good point.
I regularly read of people here who prefer what to my ears would be an overly
soft and rolled off sound, warm mellow and easy going, and on the most part
a seemingly very enjoyable presentation.
My own preference is for a more incisive top end presentation, and when
I read of people describing the former warm sounding presentations as
neutral or natural I tend to think, huh?
It,s not that I necessarily enjoy a 'traditionally' bright sound, far from it,
more along the lines of finding the air and sparkle of a real instrument can
sound some what diminished with such 'warm' phones.
Though I do think cohesion is very important in how music is presented and
phones that are considered bright can sometimes be deficient in this area,
something that a little warmth can help along.
Whilst I do not realy consider my self a practicing musician , I have dabbled in
alto sax and no doubt this has colored my views, but to help maintain
a perspective it is always good to expose one self to an intimate live acoustic
performance one and a while to confirm that natural sounds tend
to be anything but rolled off.[especially close up in an interior environment]
But ultimately with such things, aim for whatever make you happy

Setmenu

 

[Andrea]

Quote:

Originally Posted by nm2285 Well I've tried the Sennheiser HD280s; Sony MDR-V6s; Grado Sr-60, 80, 125; owned the HD497s; and own the HD590s. I like the 590s except for the fact that they're slightly too bloated in the midrange/midbass (too dark a presentation). I like the sound of my etymotic er-6 and am basically looking for something along those lines, but more refined and superaural. I'm also not a great fan of the Grado: too dynamic/forward for me. Price range around the 590s. Lets hear some recommendations. Thanks!

Be sure to try the HD595 !! It sounds like they'd be just the right phones for you

edit: The natural step up from it being the HD650.
Don't give credit to the claims that it is "dark" ! Here's a "darkness" ranking from me: HD650 (<) HD595 <<< HD570

 

[amartignano]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Andrea edit: the natural step up from it being the HD650 (don't give credit to the claims that it is "dark" !! Here's a "darkness" ranking from me: HD650 < HD595 <<< HD570)

I agree (wow!, this is an event!

).

I've never understood how the HD650 can be dark, with any equipment.

(<-- Andrea)

(<-- amartignano/me)

Ciao
Andrea

 

[Andrea]

Quote:

Originally Posted by amartignano I agree (wow!, this is an event! ). I've never understood how the HD650 can be dark, with any equipment.

Yeah well said.

(wow!

)

 

[amartignano]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Andrea Yeah well said. (wow! )

Moreover, you know that I moved to the DT880 'cause sometimes I've found the HD650 to be a bit (I stressed a bit) too bright and cold on some sounds...

Ciao
Andrea

 

[Andrea]

Quote:

Originally Posted by amartignano Moreover, you know that I moved to the DT880 'cause sometimes I've found the HD650 to be a bit (I stressed a bit) too bright and cold on some sounds... Ciao Andrea

And on the other hand, I know of others that have found the DT880 a bit cold and have moved to the warmer sennheiser sound...

 

[amartignano]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Andrea And on the other hand, I know of others that have found the DT880 a bit cold and have moved to the warmer sennheiser sound...

Probably, probably, this is a different meaning given to the word "warm": HD650 is "warmer" in the sense that the tonal balance is a little more on the bass side respect to the DT880, DT880 for me is "warmer" in the sense of the timbre of the instruments, even if they an overall slightly brighter sound. Can you understand me?

Ciao
Andrea

Ps. A thing that probably I forgot to say: I've ended on the DT880 because I was looking for an headphones with the frequency extension, dynamics and detail of the HD650, but with a timbre more rounded, near to the flatted-Grado Rs-1. And the DT880 is that, for what I've heard. And now I'm done, this is the headphone for me, no doubt (I've tried all the others "top", except AudioTechnica). Probably I will look for a good amplification in the future.

 

[Andrea]

Quote:

Originally Posted by amartignano Probably, probably, this is a different meaning given to the word "warm": HD650 is "warmer" in the sense that the tonal balance is a little more on the bass side respect to the DT880, DT880 for me is "warmer" in the sense of the timbre of the instruments, evev if they an overall slightly brighter sound. Can you understand me? [ ]

Yep, of course I follow you,

actually I expected that interpretation. But sorry, that's not the case, or that's not the way I got it. Obviously, I'd need to hear the Beyer, but as yet I can say (repeat

) that I can't figure out what could be ever named 'cold' of the HD650.

Also, that transient sounds (and something similar goes for vocals too) can be bright (sharp) as much as they can be smooth (soft) I sure can vouch for, maintain that I'm enamoured of that feature, and name it "accuracy" (that is, a part of it).

In this sort of way, the HD595 is a slightly more forgiving/warmer phone (you may like it!).

 

[BrokenEnglish]

Quote:

Originally Posted by amartignano Moreover, you know that I moved to the DT880 'cause sometimes I've found the HD650 to be a bit (I stressed a bit) too bright and cold on some sounds...

holy goly...

...strange things are happening around these forums...

maybe you're just a victim of higher impedance on your integrated amps output, amartignano?