Moondrop in-ear monitors Impressions Thread
Mar 19, 2019 at 12:07 PM Post #1,681 of 11,972
If anyone questions 'burning in' their KPE:


I always question it... but I always do it because, well, what’s the harm? :). But it is burnin without listening - I just leave gear playing some random streaming station off of a spare phone or amp for 3-4 days before seriously listening to it, that way I avoid the effects of “brain burnin”. Also, no point in getting a pre and post burn in impression - after 3-4 days audio memory is so bad may as well not have listened at all. One day I will have an audio measurement rig like @crinacle or @Hawaiibadboy and will do a real set of experiments. In the meantime, since there is no harm, why not!
 
Mar 19, 2019 at 12:10 PM Post #1,682 of 11,972
hey guys... so ive always had my tips really close to the nozzle (like 1mm away) and enjoyed the kp .i recently pulled the tip out a bit more like 2-3mm away and now the mid-bass doesn't seem to be lacking and sound stage sounds bigger..

I wonder if it is an insertion depth effect... in the literature that comes with the Final E tips they discuss this and provide some generic graphs to illustrate the effects. If I can remember to, I will check for a copyright mark, and if none will take a photo and post here.
 
Mar 19, 2019 at 1:01 PM Post #1,683 of 11,972
hey guys... so ive always had my tips really close to the nozzle (like 1mm away) and enjoyed the kp .i recently pulled the tip out a bit more like 2-3mm away and now the mid-bass doesn't seem to be lacking and sound stage sounds bigger..


I totally agree with this.

I`m using custom nozzle grills with 1mm thick "trompet" ring that holds grills in front of nozzle + stock S-size tips that are 3.2mm over that.
So, my tips edge is actually about 4.2mm over the nozzle edge.

Improvement could be coming from:
1. Insertion depth
2. better tip edge adjustment (softer) to ear-channel shape
3. larger air-chamber due to longer distance

anyway, recommend to try "playing" with it :wink:

Who is using stock tips, then I also recommend to use "locking-rings" or mechanical keyboard rubber rings on nozzle lower part to stop tips "slipping" out of place when inserting into ear-channel.

Hopefully will get my measurement rig set up soon so I could test differences.
 
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Mar 19, 2019 at 1:24 PM Post #1,685 of 11,972
It kind of bothers me how much tips can effect the sound. But actually the KPE is less sensitive than BA types for my ears.

Haha. Yup, bothers me too. I remember one guy on another thread a while back was arguing the point that tips had no effect on sound whatsoever, as that would mean all IEMs were the same...which he said they clearly weren't. He got quite annoyed. Couldn't get the logic.
In the end I gave up...there's no arguing with some people. But it is a weird thing.
 
Mar 19, 2019 at 1:36 PM Post #1,686 of 11,972
https://crinacle.com/2019/03/03/on-the-record-burn-in/
I also have the same impression, that the sound did not change for my KPE over time.
Just out of curiosity:
* How many hours did You have them playing before making final judgement?
* Did You use them often during burn in process or did You leave them playing without listening after initial impressions for longer time?
* What is Your source gear (also amping power in V/mA)?
* Did You use same song(s) to evaluate possible differences?
* Are You sure tips stayed in same position on initial and final listening?

Just curious as many here have experienced change without listening (brain-burn-in), me included. Pseudo or not, I think using sine-sweep to evaluate "burn-in" is wrong method as it doesn`t define driver physical abilities/technicalities same way as music does (with lot more going on than simple sine sweep). sine sweep doesn`t show up driver agility, speed, reverbs, delays, soundscape, imaging etc. ...which we all know are not properly out-readable from FR graphs of sine-sweep. Pink/white nose could show up more but this also isn`t real music.
I`m not firm beliver of burn-in and have subjectively experienced it only with 2 IEMs out of many and I don`t belive it is brain-burn-in, expectation biased or just pure pseudo.
There are also similar subject about cables - which one side says changes nothing no matter what material used. Well, in this case its also about physics and cable impedance, which is luckily pretty easily measurable but again, harder to prove with sine sweep. Either way, I wouldn`t follow one man opinion no matter how many IEMs he has owned or measured, neither belive simple man "euphoric" impressions about SQ change due to burn-in. All I can say that I personally experienced it with KPE and thus belive it can happen with this particular IEM.
 
Mar 19, 2019 at 1:37 PM Post #1,687 of 11,972
Totally agree. The tips are essential to getting good sound. What I wish was there was a way to remove the ear canal from the equation.. somehow. Etymotic has this advantage and so do over the ear headphones.
 
Mar 19, 2019 at 1:40 PM Post #1,688 of 11,972
I have a pair of Velodyne Vpulse IEMs that have a few THOUSAND hours of playback on them. I recently got an old stock unopened pair because I love the bass on them. To my surprise the sound on the new pair was different in sound. Treble was more crispy, soundstage was a bit less. Bass not as resonant on the new pair. Mids were a bit better to my ear. These IEMs definitely burn in.
 
Mar 19, 2019 at 1:58 PM Post #1,689 of 11,972
I totally agree with this.

I`m using custom nozzle grills with 1mm thick "trompet" ring that holds grills in front of nozzle + stock S-size tips that are 3.2mm over that.
So, my tips edge is actually about 4.2mm over the nozzle edge.

Improvement could be coming from:
1. Insertion depth
2. better tip edge adjustment (softer) to ear-channel shape
3. larger air-chamber due to longer distance

anyway, recommend to try "playing" with it :wink:

Who is using stock tips, then I also recommend to use "locking-rings" or mechanical keyboard rubber rings on nozzle lower part to stop tips "slipping" out of place when inserting into ear-channel.

Hopefully will get my measurement rig set up soon so I could test differences.
Here`s how my KPE looks with "tip slip lock rings" and nozzle grills/rings (probably will stay with this setup, except backplates will be changed):
9939957_l.jpg
 
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Mar 19, 2019 at 2:01 PM Post #1,690 of 11,972
I have a pair of Velodyne Vpulse IEMs that have a few THOUSAND hours of playback on them. I recently got an old stock unopened pair because I love the bass on them. To my surprise the sound on the new pair was different in sound. Treble was more crispy, soundstage was a bit less. Bass not as resonant on the new pair. Mids were a bit better to my ear. These IEMs definitely burn in.

...and there you have it. Burn in is real and physical. Definitely experienced it with KPE and have with one or two other iems. I also think that individual sets can vary too.
But how you approach something, expectation bias, confirmation bias...they all have a part to play too.
 
Mar 19, 2019 at 3:05 PM Post #1,692 of 11,972
Etys are not mine, but I have them for a longer time. I'm using them with SpinFit CP240 (biflange) with sleeves, which gives you possibility to use any kind of tips. I don't like triflange tips.

Red tips are from Sony NW A35 earphone set. I like them a lot. I haven't got any other pair of tips called Sony Hybrid tips, but those are probably the same.

10260694.jpg
 

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Mar 19, 2019 at 3:23 PM Post #1,693 of 11,972
Hey. These are comparisons between the cables used with the Moondrop A8, done by @Hawaiibadboy here, posted per community request.

A8_CABLE_DIFFERENCE_OVERLAY_FIN.png


Method:
A8_CABLE_DIFFERENCE_OVERLAY_METHOD.png

I am too tired right now to go into specifics, so take it for what it is. Once HBB posts proper hi-res graphs of the 3 moondrops, I will overlay them as well, for comparison purposes. Have a good one!
 

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