[Tsunzo]

I wonder if it will be possible to place an order for the DS version with the hybrid pads and vice versa.

 

[goldwerger]

What an excellent in-depth review by @goldwerger, a true masterpiece and as such, worthy of the headphone! Thank you!

One aspect where my experience differs compared to the review: I tried Caldera Hybrid and Caldera Ultra Perforated pads and preferred Hybrids. Ultra Perforated had noticeably less bass impact, which became apparent when listening tracks like Jossie Telch - Borders (Eitan Reiter Remix). For me personally, Hybrid pads contribute substantially to the superb all-arounder nature of the headphone.

Thank you sincerely. I'm delighted this helpful.

I can completely see the preferecne for the Hybrid. Its outer rim is non-perforated, which may contribute to your experience. For me, lower bass with the Ultra Perf was at the point I haven't felt any need for more. But this would definitely be subjective; the community's rich experience pad rolling with ZMF headphones shows that user perceptions vary widely between given our varying ear shapes.

I'm happy to have both on hand. It may be a reasonable choice for folks to get both and find out, though it is a bit of extra cost. I suspect this thread will develop more impressions on these over time, and hopefully will help folks navigate what may work best for them.

According to Schiit, the Lyr+ will push 7.2 Vrms into 150 ohms. The Lyr 3 is rated at 5 Vrms. The Jot 2 outputs 9.6 Vrms via XLR out into the same impedance. So all are well below the ~20 Vrms that @goldwerger found to be the magic number. But, I really did feel the Jot 2 had no trouble driving the SS.

Two important points here:

1. There will DEFINITELY be exceptions - as I pointed out in my own review, this is a general rule of thumb I find helpful that proved to segment well most amps I tried between those that worked better vs. less so; but rules of thumb are just that. And in fact I pointed out an example for an amp that is an exception with lower voltage that worked very well (C9). Over time, we will probably have lots of impressions here and find out more. But, if one looks for a new amp, or wonders if their amp would go, without any other information - this is the most useful guidance I can offer on guestimating how well an amp would work (and why)
2. There is a really important different between "sufficient" and "optimal" - many of the amps that I tried and didn't like were sufficient. That got listenable volume and drove the Tungsten just fine. And, if I didn't hear better, I'd probably think that the Tungsten were great, and the pairing was good. But I've heard better, so I know what the Tungsten should sound like when driven very well. And the difference is material.

All that + my impressions are personal and subjective. What sounds good to me, may sound bad to you.. with humility, I hope to be stand corrected over time, as smarter people with better ears may find things that I missed!!!

 

[Zachik]

According to Schiit, the Lyr+ will push 7.2 Vrms into 150 ohms. The Lyr 3 is rated at 5 Vrms. The Jot 2 outputs 9.6 Vrms via XLR out into the same impedance. So all are well below the ~20 Vrms that @goldwerger found to be the magic number. But, I really did feel the Jot 2 had no trouble driving the SS.

I tried the SS with the Lyr+ and it’s not enough juice for them.

So if Lyr+ isn't powerful enough, the above implies Lyr3 is definitely NOT powerful enough!

 

[ckhirnigs113]

@goldwerger Really enjoyed your review as well. It was incredibly thorough! Quick question, when you tried the Tungsten with the MJ3, what settings did you use on the amp? Did you happen to try push pull in high gain with no feedback? That’s been my favorite combination with my Meze Elite. Obviously the Elite is much, much easier to drive vs the Tungsten.

I also have a Cayin iHA-6, that on paper has more power than the MJ3. I’m wondering if it might drive the Tungsten a bit better than the MJ3. I’ve yet to hear of anyone trying this amp with either variant of the Tungsten.

 

[xiled10]

Does anyone know what time + timezone the order page is open tomorrow?

 

[Tsunzo]

Does anyone know what time + timezone the order page is open tomorrow?

11AM Est, in less than 12 hours.

 

[wizzman121]

There will DEFINITELY be exceptions - as I pointed out in my own review, this is a general rule of thumb I find helpful that proved to segment well most amps I tried between those that worked better vs. less so; but rules of thumb are just that. And in fact I pointed out an example for an amp that is an exception with lower voltage that worked very well (C9).

^This. There is no doubt that the Tungsten needs some voltage to be driven properly. I spent some time with both versions at a meet a couple weeks ago. They both sounded great on my Bliss but they need more headroom than the Bliss offers to properly support your whole library.

One surprise is that my Cayin HA-3A tube amp drives the Tungsten really nicely out of the XLR output. It is the first headphone I have heard that both needed and sounded "right" out of the XLR output on the amp. I use the 4.4 out for my Utopia and the 1/4" out for my ZMFs.

The main point is we just need more folks to share there experiences as these get out into the world because yes they are voltage hungry but also some amps will really work well and others won't. I should be getting a chance to try both versions again next week to see which sounds best out of my new Violectric V550 which I think is going to be an incredible match.

 

[Ricey20]

Anyone know if a WA22 would put out enough volts for the Tungsten?

 

[goldwerger]

@goldwerger Really enjoyed your review as well. It was incredibly thorough! Quick question, when you tried the Tungsten with the MJ3, what settings did you use on the amp? Did you happen to try push pull in high gain with no feedback? That’s been my favorite combination with my Meze Elite. Obviously the Elite is much, much easier to drive vs the Tungsten.

I also have a Cayin iHA-6, that on paper has more power than the MJ3. I’m wondering if it might drive the Tungsten a bit better than the MJ3. I’ve yet to hear of anyone trying this amp with either variant of the Tungsten.

Thank you sincerely, much appreciated.

I honestly can’t recall (good question!). Can you tell from the switch positions on the picture which I listened to?

 

[mjstealey]

Thank you sincerely, much appreciated.

I honestly can’t recall (good question!). Can you tell from the switch positions on the picture which I listened to?

The Mjolnir 3 in the photo has: High Gain ON, Push-Pull Class A, and Feedback OFF
- Input is via balanced XLR which is presumably coming in at 4 V from the Yggy below it
- Reference to decoding the Schiit Glyphs

 

[ckhirnigs113]

Thank you sincerely, much appreciated.

I honestly can’t recall (good question!). Can you tell from the switch positions on the picture which I listened to?

Like @mjstealey said, you happened to be using the amp with the exact settings I was hoping you did not use. Selfishly, as an MJ3 owner, I was hoping you were using single-ended, low gain, SE Class A with feedback on. I wanted that to be the explanation for why you didn’t like the pairing with the Tungsten.

Turns out you were probably using the best settings to drive the headphones but still found it insufficient. I’m glad I have the info though!

 

[Garney]

^This. There is no doubt that the Tungsten needs some voltage to be driven properly. I spent some time with both versions at a meet a couple weeks ago. They both sounded great on my Bliss but they need more headroom than the Bliss offers to properly support your whole library.

One surprise is that my Cayin HA-3A tube amp drives the Tungsten really nicely out of the XLR output. It is the first headphone I have heard that both needed and sounded "right" out of the XLR output on the amp. I use the 4.4 out for my Utopia and the 1/4" out for my ZMFs.

What tubes are you running in the HA-3A?

The main point is we just need more folks to share there experiences as these get out into the world because yes they are voltage hungry but also some amps will really work well and others won't. I should be getting a chance to try both versions again next week to see which sounds best out of my new Violectric V550 which I think is going to be an incredible match.

Definitely. Hopefully a "database" can be complied as more folks get Tungsten sets and try out various amp pairings with them.

 

[mjstealey]

Like @mjstealey said, you happened to be using the amp with the exact settings I was hoping you did not use. Selfishly, as an MJ3 owner, I was hoping you were using single-ended, low gain, SE Class A with feedback on. I wanted that to be the explanation for why you didn’t like the pairing with the Tungsten.

Turns out you were probably using the best settings to drive the headphones but still found it insufficient. I’m glad I have the info though!

There is still one unknown here, and that is the output level of the digital source feeding the Yggy

For example, I use Qobuz from my laptop --> Gungnir --> MJ3 at work.
I need to set the Qobuz app to 50% output else I risk blowing up my eardrums at 9 o'clock on the MJ3 depending on which headphone I'm using. So I throttle the source output to provide more play on the MJ3 volume pot.
Perhaps a similar situation was going on at the Schiit booth?

 

[goldwerger]

The Mjolnir 3 in the photo has: High Gain ON, Push-Pull Class A, and Feedback OFF
- Input is via balanced XLR which is presumably coming in at 4 V from the Yggy below it
- Reference to decoding the Schiit Glyphs

Thanks you!

Like @mjstealey said, you happened to be using the amp with the exact settings I was hoping you did not use. Selfishly, as an MJ3 owner, I was hoping you were using single-ended, low gain, SE Class A with feedback on. I wanted that to be the explanation for why you didn’t like the pairing with the Tungsten.

Turns out you were probably using the best settings to drive the headphones but still found it insufficient. I’m glad I have the info though!

Sorry

There is still one unknown here, and that is the output level of the digital source feeding the Yggy

We do. For consistently across the board, I used my AK SP2000 with 4.4mm to dual XLR out (balanced) with 6V line out.

I always hook it directly to all amps (using my either 3.5 to dual RCA or 4.4 to dual XLR cables; depending on whether the amp is balanced or single-ended, or availability of free ports to politely get myself hooked up).

This way I always listen with the same source and DAC, as my focus at CanJam is usually testing headphones and/or amps.

(for the rare occasions I tests DACs, I have an array of USB cables and use the same source)

 

[Morpheas]

I heard the SS on a Jot 2 and it sounded great. Felt there was plenty of headroom left, too. This was in high gain via the XLR out. It was @gc335's setup.

According to Schiit, the Lyr+ will push 7.2 Vrms into 150 ohms. The Lyr 3 is rated at 5 Vrms. The Jot 2 outputs 9.6 Vrms via XLR out into the same impedance. So all are well below the ~20 Vrms that @goldwerger found to be the magic number. But, I really did feel the Jot 2 had no trouble driving the SS.

This does make me pretty interested in picking up a Jot 2 / Modius if the Liquid Plat/J2 doesn't work.

was able to purchase! They were sold out very very fast. I refreshed right at 10:00am, refreshed at 10:10am and they were sold out. Site says there will be refreshes every friday.