[Hi-Finthen]

It just isn't much of a spectator sport to me and i am no fan of persons who professionally play the game. And certainly would not know which tee a woman would hit from when playing in the mens league as allowed by the rules commitee in this aberration to the game I do know. Either ruling is unfair, isn't it really?


Quote:

Originally Posted by Sleestack No offense, but I take it you don't know much about golf. In any case, MW, is 16 and nowhere near her golf prime. She's obviously good enough for the LPGA. Nevertheless, she does need to get some LPGA wins under her belt. As for the PGA,.. MW drives far enough for the PGA. She doesn't have the strength to work out of some of the hazards and rough the way the men can. People who play golf will understand that a long drive can be generated by effortless momentum (which is aided by her height), whereas some shots out of the rough and hazards require strength. Furthermore, IMO her short game is just not that good yet. She's obviously not ready to compete on the PGA ( and she might never be ready). That being said, she is out there getting some PGA experience and may be capable of playing on the PGA tour some day. MW is competing for wins on the LPGA with a long drive and a mediocre short game. When and if she develops her short game, I think she will dominate on the LPGA. Nevertheless, there is no guarantee that she will develop that part of the game. I do know that she would kick my butt on the course.

 

[Sleestack]

Quote:

Originally Posted by BlindTiger I've read Michelle developed a friendship with John Daly from pairing up together. I think this is great, both long ball hitters and we know JD had some ups and downs. And, I've seen MW hit from the blues in the TV coverage shown, unless they switched the ladies reds to blues for her. .

MW is definitely hitting from the same tees as the men. This is not a country club golf outing.

 

[Sleestack]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hi-Finthen It just isn't much of a spectator sport to me and i am no fan of persons who professionally play the game. And certainly would not know which tee a woman would hit from when playing in the mens league as allowed by the rules commitee in this aboration to the game I do know. Either ruling is unfair, isn't it really?

Understood. I don't think requiring everyone to hit from the same tees is unfair at all. That is the only way you are actaully letting them play on equal terms. What's the point of allowing MW to hit from a shorter tee. It would be akin to allowing people to use handicaps in the PGA... which would be great for me if I wanted to be on the PGA, but would make for some pretty poor TV.

 

[BlindTiger]

I'm a MW fan but I also like Pat Hurst and Grace Park. (both great Vets of the LPGA)
But, Stacy Prammanansudh is catching my eye lately, then I read she's 26 and married. I though she was part of the young up and comers on the LPGA like Paula Creamer and co. (OK 26 is still young)

 

[kugino]

Quote:

Originally Posted by BlindTiger I've read Michelle developed a friendship with John Daly from pairing up together. I think this is great, both long ball hitters and we know JD had some ups and downs. And, I've seen MW hit from the blues in the TV coverage shown, unless they switched the ladies reds to blues for her. I don't know about other golfers but playing in the heat is brutal. My friend almost had heat stroke once when he noticed he wasn't sweating. The heat radiating off the grass and not to mention the muggy, stagnant, Michigan air and giant mosquitos is no walk on the grass for anyone.

actually, the pros don't play from "blue" tees. they play from the "championship" tees, which are often colored black on many courses...or more realistically, they play from a set of tees which may not even exist on the official scoring card for that specific course. not many courses have 7200 yard sets of tees...

and midwestern heat/humidity is certainly more brutal than you'll ever get in hawaii. it's understandable that michelle would suffer from heat exhaustion...she'll prepare better next time...hopefully.

 

[Gigabomber]

Well, we know she will be famous and make more money because of this regardless of the "gender war" aspect. It was my understanding that all kinds of people of all ages play golf, so I don't really think it's a big deal. It is, however, a big deal when people start talking about it.

"I think golf is a lot more interesting with her PGA contention, regardless of her reasons."

is an earlier quote from this thread that I agree with. At the same time, I think it is no great victory to have her play golf with men at such a young age perhaps because I don't doubt it's possible, even if she isn't the best, respectively speaking.

You may only break a barrier if a barrier exists, and for all i know she doesn't care about the gender issue argument anyway. I haven't read word one about her feelings or words on the subect in this thread, are there any? Is this discussion about her motivations purely speculation or do we have any evidence?

 

[Hi-Finthen]

All good points Sleestack... Good T.V. and fan base and controversy really gets the interest up for the business!

 

[Genetic]

If only reason was still driving the golf cart.....

Cross gender sport challenge is her case, as it was said so many times in this thread, too early.

Is it a valid pathway?

I'm no expert in golf but I know a little bit about tennis. On the court we can safely bet that surely the first 500 mens in the world ranking (if such a ranking exist) could completely pulverized any top ten female player.

Knowing that, the fascination for a mature top female tennis player to «push the enveloppe» is present no doubt about it. But there's also the fear to degrade her own gender sport figure image.

In the situation we discuss here, the not so poor kid is banking on this perenial challenge with no respect for what all the other female players have built (and protected) over the past decades: namely the right to be viewed as true professionals.

Amicalement

 

[Sleestack]

Quote:

Originally Posted by BlindTiger I'm a MW fan but I also like Pat Hurst and Grace Park. (both great Vets of the LPGA) But, Stacy Prammanansudh is catching my eye lately, then I read she's 26 and married. I though she was part of the young up and comers on the LPGA like Paula Creamer and co. (OK 26 is still young)

Unfortunately, Stacey has made it clear that she won't being playing golf for very long. Don't forget Se Ri, the first of the Korean wave of female golfers. Se Ri only played golf for 4 years before winning on the LPGA tour!

 

[Sleestack]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Genetic I'm no expert in golf but I know a little bit about tennis. On the court we can safely bet that surely the first 500 mens in the world ranking (if such a ranking exist) could completely pulverized any top ten female player. Knowing that, the fascination for a mature top female tennis player to «push the enveloppe» is present no doubt about it. But there's also the fear to degrade her own gender sport figure image.

I grew up around tennis. My sister played the grand slam circuit for many years (although her ranking was never higher than 35). Tennis is very different than golf in that strength is a bigger part of the game. While there may come a day where gentics allow women to compete with men, the fact remains that right now, no women can compete on the men's tour.

Strength, while important, is not as big a factor in golf. The fact that MW beat out many of the men in the PGA events she entered (even though she didn't make the cut) simply would not happen in tennis right now.

 

[Zowbombs]

Plus golf is indirect competition.

 

[john_jcb]

Quote:

Originally Posted by kugino 3 strokes a round is actually quite a lot at that level. over four rounds, that's 12 shots! give any tour member a 12 stroke advantage and he'll win most tournaments. even just 1 stroke a round is a huge advantage.

12 strokes seems about right between the winner and the bottom each week. Remember too only 125 get an exemption each year so the difference is even less.

 

[kugino]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sleestack I grew up around tennis. My sister played the grand slam circuit for many years (although her ranking was never higher than 35). Tennis is very different than golf in that strength is a bigger part of the game. While there may come a day where gentics allow women to compete with men, the fact remains that right now, no women can compete on the men's tour. Strength, while important, is not as big a factor in golf. The fact that MW beat out many of the men in the PGA events she entered (even though she didn't make the cut) simply would not happen in tennis right now.

i remember when chris evert was married to tennis pro john lloyd, she was ranked no. 1 in the world but she said she could never beat john when they played each other.

 

[Genetic]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sleestack Strength, while important, is not as big a factor in golf. The fact that MW beat out many of the men in the PGA events she entered (even though she didn't make the cut) simply would not happen in tennis right now.

I said that wasn't an expert in golf....but...it seems that in pure logical terms, and for the sake of women players, strength should be the sine qua non condition of higher performance. In fact it's the foundation of the way golf is played these days. Evidence of this could be found just by looking how this sport equipment is going to sell you their new products based on the the constant obsession about the new and more powerfull items.

Closer to our subject, on the habilety level, girls and boys are about the same but males can do a lot more when they play against what the golf course designers had in mind. Is it me or I find that the modern golf courses designers are not only planning about where to put sand traps but the are influencing the personal physical profile of the male players?

In the top male players we have these days less and less chances to find guys built like Mike Weir. If the little guys are making the list of endanger species this should negatively affect chances of seen any female making the cut.

Amicalement

 

[MusicJunkie]

``She's better than Tiger was at 16,'' said Joe Ogilvie, the second-round leader at the Deere Classic. ``I played with Tiger, and Tiger wasn't this good"

That's a quote from Joe Ogilvie in an article on Yahoo sports. That says a lot. And Tiger didn't make a cut at a PGA tournament until he was 19.

I haven't seen Michelle play on TV yet but I am really curious and hope to do so soon. I want to check out her swing. If Johnny Miller goes on and on about how talented she is then she definitely is the real deal. He is notoriously hard on golfers.

MJ