[Craigster75]

Quote:

If you think the DNA sound better, the Mikros 90 is definitely not for me. I thought the DNA sounded no better honestly than a $50 headphone.

Maybe including the DNA was harsh, but I definitely prefer the Aviator even if they were the same price, let alone double the cost for the Mikros 90.

 

[Speakerphile]

These aren't supposed to be a bass heavy can.  They were voiced with the intention of sounding like their Electrostats, or hybrids.  If you like a healthy dose of bass, you will probably not like these.  

 

[obobskivich]

Yeah - I think I'm gonna have to go with ssrock on this; these probably aren't for me either if the P5 are superior.

Question though - you mention both anemic bass and rolled-off highs, are these pretty n-shaped then? Or what?

 

[Craigster75]

Quote:

These aren't supposed to be a bass heavy can.  They were voiced with the intention of sounding like their Electrostats, or hybrids.  If you like a healthy dose of bass, you will probably not like these.  

 
Quote:

Yeah - I think I'm gonna have to go with ssrock on this; these probably aren't for me either if the P5 are superior.

Question though - you mention both anemic bass and rolled-off highs, are these pretty n-shaped then? Or what?

Bass aside, I was completely unimpressed with their vocal presentation and even felt detail was mediocre.  I would say n-shaped is a fair description. 

 

[obobskivich]

Bass aside, I was completely unimpressed with their vocal presentation and even felt detail was mediocre.  I would say n-shaped is a fair description. 

See, that's just not cool. I was hoping they'd at least be Koss-like and be *good* at being an n-shaped headphone (because it'd at least represent a shift away from "boom boom bass" in new releases), but it sounds like these would be very underwhelming. Shucks.

Oh well, they look goofy (are they as goofy in person?) - so I don't feel like I'm going to miss not having them.

 

[Craigster75]

Quote:

See, that's just not cool. I was hoping they'd at least be Koss-like and be *good* at being an n-shaped headphone (because it'd at least represent a shift away from "boom boom bass" in new releases), but it sounds like these would be very underwhelming. Shucks.
Oh well, they look goofy (are they as goofy in person?) - so I don't feel like I'm going to miss not having them.

At least we can scratch one off the list

 

[obobskivich]

At least we can scratch one off the list :wink_face:

One down, nine thousand nine hundred and ninety nine left to go. Go try more random headphones and come back and tell me they suck (even if you're lying) - my wallet likes you already! :tongue_smile:

 

[timoteo]

I was at Best Buy this weekend and they had a number of headphones on display for listening. I have no idea what source they were connected to, except that they were all connected to the same source.You push a button to choose the type of music you want to listen to - rock, pop, classical, jazz, etc. and it plays a selection.
 
They had a range of headphones - several Sennheisers, several AKGs, Denon, Pioneer, Audio Technica, and a couple of others. Plus they had something I had never seen or heard of before - Martin-Logan headphones! I listened to all of the headphones before listening to the MLs. The better of the pairs of Senn's were quite good. The AKGs were good but seriously lacked bass, I thought. The Denons weren't as bad as I expected, and the Pioneers were crap.

Then I put on the MLs - I was anticipating good sound! What I heard was something else! I was astounded, amazed, stupefied - at home crappy these headphones were! These were truly the worst of the bunch. They cost nearly $400 and I thought they were flat-out the worst sounding of any headphone there! They sucked! They were not musical in any way, shape, or form. No highs, crappy midrange, no bass, no soundstaging at all, no detail, voices were all "wrong". Unless these were just not hooked up right (at Best Buy that could certainly be possible!), if someone gave these to me, I'd leave them on a table in the lobby of a nearby hotel with a note that said, "free - take me!".

I listened to some ML speakers 20 years ago and thought they had the most astounding treble I'd ever heard - the highs and some of the mids just floated in space like nothing I had ever heard. Bass was nice but I didn't like the way the electrostatic integrated with the woofer, but that's just a personal preference. They were still damn good speakers! Since that time I have seen a lot of different ML speakers show up at Best Buy, of all places. I sat down and listened to some ~$1000 MLs one day at Best Buy (electrostat midrange/highs with conventional bass as is typical for ML) and didn't get that "special" feeling I had for the MLs I listened to decades ago (those were more expensive speakers too). I noticed walking around their special audio area that ML had some a lot of inexpensive speakers in the price range of a few hundred bucks at most. They were not electrostats - just basic speaker technology as far I could tell. I didn't get chance to listen to them, but after seeing the profusion of inexpensive ML speakers and based on my feeling about the ~$1000 electorstat hybrids I had heard recently, I began to wonder if ML had lost their way - sacrificing audio quality for mass market sales in order increase sales and income.  After listening to those ML headphones, I am convinced that ML has lost its way and has become greedy.

These ML headphones seem to be an attempt to capitalize on their name and reputation, but if they keep making s**t (IMHO) like this, they won't be in business too much longer.

 

[Craigster75]

Quote:

I was at Best Buy this weekend and they had a number of headphones on display for listening. I have no idea what source they were connected to, except that they were all connected to the same source.You push a button to choose the type of music you want to listen to - rock, pop, classical, jazz, etc. and it plays a selection.
 
They had a range of headphones - several Sennheisers, several AKGs, Denon, Pioneer, Audio Technica, and a couple of others. Plus they had something I had never seen or heard of before - Martin-Logan headphones! I listened to all of the headphones before listening to the MLs. The better of the pairs of Senn's were quite good. The AKGs were good but seriously lacked bass, I thought. The Denons weren't as bad as I expected, and the Pioneers were crap.

Then I put on the MLs - I was anticipating good sound! What I heard was something else! I was astounded, amazed, stupefied - at home crappy these headphones were! These were truly the worst of the bunch. They cost nearly $400 and I thought they were flat-out the worst sounding of any headphone there! They sucked! They were not musical in any way, shape, or form. No highs, crappy midrange, no bass, no soundstaging at all, no detail, voices were all "wrong". Unless these were just not hooked up right (at Best Buy that could certainly be possible!), if someone gave these to me, I'd leave them on a table in the lobby of a nearby hotel with a note that said, "free - take me!".

I listened to some ML speakers 20 years ago and thought they had the most astounding treble I'd ever heard - the highs and some of the mids just floated in space like nothing I had ever heard. Bass was nice but I didn't like the way the electrostatic integrated with the woofer, but that's just a personal preference. They were still damn good speakers! Since that time I have seen a lot of different ML speakers show up at Best Buy, of all places. I sat down and listened to some ~$1000 MLs one day at Best Buy (electrostat midrange/highs with conventional bass as is typical for ML) and didn't get that "special" feeling I had for the MLs I listened to decades ago (those were more expensive speakers too). I noticed walking around their special audio area that ML had some a lot of inexpensive speakers in the price range of a few hundred bucks at most. They were not electrostats - just basic speaker technology as far I could tell. I didn't get chance to listen to them, but after seeing the profusion of inexpensive ML speakers and based on my feeling about the ~$1000 electorstat hybrids I had heard recently, I began to wonder if ML had lost their way - sacrificing audio quality for mass market sales in order increase sales and income.  After listening to those ML headphones, I am convinced that ML has lost its way and has become greedy.

These ML headphones seem to be an attempt to capitalize on their name and reputation, but if they keep making s**t (IMHO) like this, they won't be in business too much longer.

I completely agree with your comments and stated similarly earlier in the thread.  It seems like headphones from speaker manufacturers are big hits or big misses.  Velodyne also missed the mark with their $399 V-True.  However, PSB and B&W are two winners IMO from the group.

 

[Speakerphile]

Quote:

I was at Best Buy this weekend and they had a number of headphones on display for listening. I have no idea what source they were connected to, except that they were all connected to the same source.You push a button to choose the type of music you want to listen to - rock, pop, classical, jazz, etc. and it plays a selection.
 
They had a range of headphones - several Sennheisers, several AKGs, Denon, Pioneer, Audio Technica, and a couple of others. Plus they had something I had never seen or heard of before - Martin-Logan headphones! I listened to all of the headphones before listening to the MLs. The better of the pairs of Senn's were quite good. The AKGs were good but seriously lacked bass, I thought. The Denons weren't as bad as I expected, and the Pioneers were crap.

Then I put on the MLs - I was anticipating good sound! What I heard was something else! I was astounded, amazed, stupefied - at home crappy these headphones were! These were truly the worst of the bunch. They cost nearly $400 and I thought they were flat-out the worst sounding of any headphone there! They sucked! They were not musical in any way, shape, or form. No highs, crappy midrange, no bass, no soundstaging at all, no detail, voices were all "wrong". Unless these were just not hooked up right (at Best Buy that could certainly be possible!), if someone gave these to me, I'd leave them on a table in the lobby of a nearby hotel with a note that said, "free - take me!".

I listened to some ML speakers 20 years ago and thought they had the most astounding treble I'd ever heard - the highs and some of the mids just floated in space like nothing I had ever heard. Bass was nice but I didn't like the way the electrostatic integrated with the woofer, but that's just a personal preference. They were still damn good speakers! Since that time I have seen a lot of different ML speakers show up at Best Buy, of all places. I sat down and listened to some ~$1000 MLs one day at Best Buy (electrostat midrange/highs with conventional bass as is typical for ML) and didn't get that "special" feeling I had for the MLs I listened to decades ago (those were more expensive speakers too). I noticed walking around their special audio area that ML had some a lot of inexpensive speakers in the price range of a few hundred bucks at most. They were not electrostats - just basic speaker technology as far I could tell. I didn't get chance to listen to them, but after seeing the profusion of inexpensive ML speakers and based on my feeling about the ~$1000 electorstat hybrids I had heard recently, I began to wonder if ML had lost their way - sacrificing audio quality for mass market sales in order increase sales and income.  After listening to those ML headphones, I am convinced that ML has lost its way and has become greedy.

These ML headphones seem to be an attempt to capitalize on their name and reputation, but if they keep making s**t (IMHO) like this, they won't be in business too much longer.

 
The source is an SD-card with lossless digital tracks on it.  All headphones are hooked up to a multi-channel headphone amp similar to what you might find in a production studio.  
 
ML Speakers, IMO, are still quite good.  They do still make higher-end pure electrostats, which are on display at Magnolia Design Center locations among others.  That said, the hybrids on display at the location you were at were still quite good.  Also, their non-electrostat "traditional" speakers have received very good reviews and are gaining a name for themselves.  I would recommend actually listening to them next time you are in there.  Not sure what you meant by " a lot of inexpensive speakers in the price range of a few hundred bucks at most".  Perhaps you meant starting at a few hundred bucks at the least.  They certainly start at lower prices today than they did in the past, but IMO still provide great sound at their respective price points.  They also continue to produce a full line of speakers up to the $25,000+ CLX's.  They did what many companies did to survive the recession, which is to broaden their line to more price points.  But they have also done so while maintaining the quality of their products and by no means have become a cheap speaker company as your post seems to imply.  Their headphone line is new and does have room for improvement, but I am sure that they are paying attention and will eventually get it nailed down.  You are certainly entitled to your opinion, but if you are going to come down on ML at least get your stats right.(Pun very much intended)

 

[Craigster75]

Quote:

I completely agree with your comments and stated similarly earlier in the thread.  It seems like headphones from speaker manufacturers are big hits or big misses.  Velodyne also missed the mark with their $399 V-True.  However, PSB and B&W are two winners IMO from the group.

 
Quote:

 
The source is an SD-card with lossless digital tracks on it.  All headphones are hooked up to a multi-channel headphone amp similar to what you might find in a production studio.  
 
ML Speakers, IMO, are still quite good.  They do still make higher-end pure electrostats, which are on display at Magnolia Design Center locations among others.  That said, the hybrids on display at the location you were at were still quite good.  Also, their non-electrostat "traditional" speakers have received very good reviews and are gaining a name for themselves.  I would recommend actually listening to them next time you are in there.  Not sure what you meant by " a lot of inexpensive speakers in the price range of a few hundred bucks at most".  Perhaps you meant starting at a few hundred bucks at the least.  They certainly start at lower prices today than they did in the past, but IMO still provide great sound at their respective price points.  They also continue to produce a full line of speakers up to the $25,000+ CLX's.  They did what many companies did to survive the recession, which is to broaden their line to more price points.  But they have also done so while maintaining the quality of their products and by no means have become a cheap speaker company as your post seems to imply.  Their headphone line is new and does have room for improvement, but I am sure that they are paying attention and will eventually get it nailed down.  You are certainly entitled to your opinion, but if you are going to come down on ML at least get your stats right.(Pun very much intended)

Yes, I should clarify that I agree with Martin Logan's disappointing headphone comments based on how highly I regard their speakers, including their hybrids.  If ML's were within my budget, they would be one of the top contenders for my home theater system.

 

[obobskivich]

Yeah, ML *does* make nice speakers. I really was hoping when these were announced that they were going to jump in the ring with STAX and Koss - not try to release a celebrifone. h34r:

 

[Ric4001]

I was at a Best Buy today testing these at the same type of listening station.  I came away with completely opposite impressions.   The MLs were bright and very detailed but still had plenty of low end, but in no way boomy.  On solo piano and solo string material, you could hear the resonance of the strings.  It was beautiful.  The ATH-ESW9As sounded anemic by comparison -- no detail and very bland.  I went there to buy the ESW9a, but changed my mind after this comparison.  Not sure if I'll pick up the MLs or the P5s, but I was surprised at how bright the MLs were given how every review I've read calls them rolled-off in the high end.  And I'm a person who finds most headphones too dark.

 

[ssrock64]

Quote:

I was at a Best Buy today testing these at the same type of listening station.  I came away with completely opposite impressions.   The MLs were bright and very detailed but still had plenty of low end, but in no way boomy.  On solo piano and solo string material, you could hear the resonance of the strings.  It was beautiful.  The ATH-ESW9As sounded anemic by comparison -- no detail and very bland.  I went there to buy the ESW9a, but changed my mind after this comparison.  Not sure if I'll pick up the MLs or the P5s, but I was surprised at how bright the MLs were given how every review I've read calls them rolled-off in the high end.  And I'm a person who finds most headphones too dark.

What else have you had experience with? Any comparisons you can make?

 

[Beagle]

This is a really odd thread.  A few people have trashed the Mikros 90, yet other reviews I have read claim that they are amazing. Reminds me of what happened with the Pioneer SE-MJ591 and the Focal Spirit One.
 
Is it another case of people comparing them to other headphones rather than to the sounds of real instruments and voices? And it is yet another situation where nobody has them available for audition in my locale.