[Edwood]

Quote:

Originally Posted by hempcamp /img/forum/go_quote.gif There is not a shred of evidence for this, except in the gaming department. It's amazing what myths from 1997 still float around today, when they are even weaker myths than they were in 1997.

Yeah, just as much software works with the Mac as the PC. If I were to switch to the Mac tomorrow, I'd be set. I can then enjoy all of my music and playlists with Foobar 2000 and then while listening to my tunes, I can edit my HD movies with Sony Vegas........oh wait.......


Quote:

I agree, the Portege is a good competitor to the Air. Still, compromises are made with the Portege that aren't made with the Air and vice versa. --Chris

Yeah, the Portege R700 has all the accessories and features the Air is missing, but the CPU is just too slow.

-Ed

 

[hempcamp]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Edwood /img/forum/go_quote.gif Yeah, just as much software works with the Mac as the PC. If I were to switch to the Mac tomorrow, I'd be set. I can then enjoy all of my music and playlists with Foobar 2000 and then while listening to my tunes, I can edit my HD movies with Sony Vegas........oh wait.......

No one said all the same software runs on both. Someone did say that not as much software is available. This is not the same thing.

There are plenty of music and video editing options for the Mac. True, if you absolutely can't live without Foobar2000 and Vegas, then you'll want to run Windows. But to say that high-quality alternatives to these programs don't exist on both platforms is an outright lie.

Ed, how come you can be such a great contributor to other threads, but when it comes to Mac threads you just turn into an attack machine?

--Chris

 

[Redo]

Quote:

Originally Posted by hempcamp /img/forum/go_quote.gif Ed, how come you can be such a great contributor to other threads, but when it comes to Mac threads you just turn into an attack machine?

He has been a great contributer to this thread, giving lots of model numbers and examples. If you mean refuting when you say attack machine, then yes, you are correct.

 

[Sparky191]

Quote:

Originally Posted by hempcamp /img/forum/go_quote.gif There is not a shred of evidence for this, except in the gaming department. It's amazing what myths from 1997 still float around today, when they are even weaker myths than they were in 1997....

Why then make a big deal of being able to run Windows, and Windows applications on an Intel Mac? Theres probably lots of business applications, that won't run on a Mac and there isn't an alternative. Ditto web applications. That said I don't think its that big a deal either. You won't be switching to Mac if your primary applications don't run on it. Does it really matter anyway. Its just a machine and if it works for some people thats great.



Father Jack said it best. "I love my brick".
YouTube - Father Ted - I Love My Brick!

 

[hempcamp]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sparky191 /img/forum/go_quote.gif Why then make a big deal of being able to run Windows, and Windows applications on an Intel Mac? Theres probably lots of business applications, that won't run on a Mac and there isn't an alternative. Ditto web applications. That said I don't think its that big a deal either. You won't be switching to Mac if your primary applications don't run on it. Does it really matter anyway. Its just a machine and if it works for some people thats great.

I agree with you completely (except for the web applications part, that makes no sense). Please note that I never suggested anyone should switch to Mac, nor did I make a big deal about being able to run Windows on a Mac. I was only correcting the 15-year old falsehood that there is so little software for the Mac.

This thread is about the Mac Book Air. How did we get down this software road anyway?

--Chris

 

[RubyRedHead]

Maybe the thread should be named the Mac Air Admiration, or the likes. I think one problem is the people here who were knocking the Air computer feel that spotlighting its deficiencies think they are somehow helping the people who like the idea, and make them realize that they can get more features for less money. I too felt like this would be helping. As for running the Mac OS there is not another ultralite alternative and I will be the first to admit that the combination of weight and screen size and asthetic design have no equal, especially when you remember how many other ultralite notebooks run the Mac OS. So I say if you like the operating system Mac offers then get your credit card out and buy that sucker. It would make a nice music server even if you had to keep your music on a USB thumb drive or an external 2.5" drive etc.

 

[Sparky191]

Quote:

Originally Posted by hempcamp /img/forum/go_quote.gif I agree with you completely (except for the web applications part, that makes no sense). Please note that I never suggested anyone should switch to Mac, nor did I make a big deal about being able to run Windows on a Mac. I was only correcting the 15-year old falsehood that there is so little software for the Mac. This thread is about the Mac Book Air. How did we get down this software road anyway? --Chris

All Mac threads go this way. No one cares that Mac fans love their machines but someone always posts inaccurate facts about how Macs are so great. Its the inaccuracies that get corrected.

I have to disagree. IMO theres far more software for a PC. Look at this way you can still run legacy dos apps on PC. Its been the biggest platform for many many years. Logically how can there not be more software for the PC? We still use a 18yr old PC application at work. Runs nationwide and has about 1000 users. Lots of old Cobol, Pascal and other applications of that era still around in the business sector.

YOU may not need the software or indeed most "normal users". But I think you have to conceed there is more of it. How much more isn't really that big an issue its it? Or is it?

Some Microsoft Web Apps only work on a Windows Machine. Some don't even work in Firefox on a PC. We have some at work. Its stupid but they exist.

Ignoring all the above. The vast majority people buying a MBA only need the usual Web/Office applications. So its not an issue.

 

[hempcamp]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sparky191 /img/forum/go_quote.gif I have to disagree. IMO theres far more software for a PC....

This isn't about more versus less. The statement that was made (and the statement that is always falsely made) is that there is "so little" or "not enough" software for the Mac platform, and that is simply not true. That is not the same as saying that there are the same exact number of titles and applications.

There is a VAST array of software for the Mac. Millions of titles that do everything you can possibly imagine. Video editing to e-mail to text editing to X11, open source, closed source, semi-open source, free, expensive, you name it you got it. If it's in SourceForge and is based on standard toolkits, you can probably compile it for the Mac if someone hasn't done so already. Not to mention all the pro audio and video apps from Apple and Adobe and MOTU, office application software from Microsoft, graphics software from Adobe and Quark, the list goes on and on and on and on and on.

That there are many programs that don't run on the Mac OS is a given. If you absolutely must use one those programs, then yes, your options are limited. Either way, there's no excuse for comments like "there is so little software for the Mac."

--Chris

 

[Sparky191]

Quote:

Originally Posted by hempcamp /img/forum/go_quote.gif This isn't about more versus less. The statement that was made (and the statement that is always falsely made) is that there is "so little" or "not enough" software for the Mac platform, and that is simply not true. That is not the same as saying that there are the same exact number of titles and applications. ....here's no excuse for comments like "there is so little software for the Mac." --Chris

What comments are you referring to? I though this was all in response too...

Quote:

Originally Posted by ls20 /img/forum/go_quote.gif ...There is far more software , commercial and open-source , on the PC platform. ...

That includes non Windows software too. Unix, Linux etc.

I don't get why the year 1997 is significant either. The PowerPC wasn't exactly a stunning success and the G3 and iMac weren't out till the following year. People were still running OS 7 and 8.

 

[hempcamp]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sparky191 /img/forum/go_quote.gif What comments are you referring to? I though this was all in response too...

You're right, when I responded to you, the memory I had of what he actually said was incorrect. Sorry.

The point is still the same. It's not about how many titles exist but what those titles do. You still have oodles of choices to accomplish all the major tasks a computer is used for. There is no lack of Mac software, and there never has been.

Let's be fair. As for Linux/Unix software, you have been able to run BSD and Linux on the Mac since the 68k. You can still run Linux/Unix/BSD on the Mac. You can now run Windows on an intel Mac if you so desire. This is all kind of beyond the issue.

What is significant here is that you can easily compile much Linux/Unix source code to run in OS X since the underpinnings of OS X are BSD-based and natively include many of the toolkits and environments (X11) needed for such a task. No limitations there!

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sparky191 /img/forum/go_quote.gif I don't get why the year 1997 is significant either. The PowerPC wasn't exactly a stunning success and the G3 and iMac weren't out till the following year. People were still running OS 7 and 8.

Arbitrary year. The myth still existed then. Apple wasn't doing so well, but you still had an extensive amount of pro and consumer software at your disposal. Funny enough the reason I got into Macs was because I worked for a graphic designer back in 1997/98 whose giant off-site publishing house only supported PageMaker on the Mac platform. I naively believed the same myth at the time until I realized there wasn't a thing I couldn't do on a PowerMac 7500 that I could do on my generic PC.

But now that we're completely derailed, can we get back to the Air?

--Chris

 

[Sparky191]

I'll refer you back to my earlier comments.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sparky191 /img/forum/go_quote.gif ... YOU may not need the software or indeed most "normal users". But I think you have to conceed there is more of it. How much more isn't really that big an issue is it? ... ...Ignoring all the above. The vast majority people buying a MBA only need the usual Web/Office applications. So its not an issue.

You're being economical with the facts IMO. Yes there were a few Unix/Linux avalible for macs. But nothing like as many as on the x86 platform, and they weren't that easy to get working. I had YDL on a Quadra for a while myself. I only stopped using the Quadra because I couldn't source a 56k modem for it.
Ironically around that time I was also doing graphics and had to buy a PC along side my mac because some of the industry standard CAD and 3D software wasn't on the Mac. Yes there were alternatives but very expensive and the industry didn't use them. Games were also becoming very sparse on the Mac.

I don't see what the issue is really. Its just logical that the dominant platform, with 70~90% of the market for over a decade is going to have more software for it. The comment made was indeed that there was simply more. But thats all ancient history. So lets draw a line under all of that and start afresh.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

These days a Mac is at is basic level, a verison of Unix running on a PC. Which is great. As it gives far more options than you ever had in the past. I agree that most people will find an decent alternative to their PC applications. If you really do have something that you need that isn't on OS X ( I use Visual Studio and MS SQL for example) then its great you can install Windows.

My solution is simpler. I have a Mac and a PC.

In the same way I'm happy to use iTunes and an iPod and MediaMonkey and a filetree player along side each other. Why compromise, why not have the best of both?

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

One thing I like & dislike about the MBA. Is the whole wireless concept. I hate cable tangle. And I love the idea that MBA is wirefree, but you can wireless get to a DVD drive and backup disks etc. Yes you can do it already on any platform if you spend time setting it all up. But Apple have done it so simply.

At the back of my head I dislike so much radio traffic going around 24/7 in the modern world.

 

[kugino]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Redo /img/forum/go_quote.gif He has been a great contributer to this thread, giving lots of model numbers and examples. If you mean refuting when you say attack machine, then yes, you are correct.

it still amazes me how much ed loves to chime in in these mac threads...pc folk, who love to bring up marketshare numbers, are way too interested in a segment of the computing market that only has ~5% marketshare. why is that? you rarely see mac users bashing windows and pc threads...we just don't care. but come to a mac thread and there's ed, front and center, model # this and no usb port that and half a pound lighter here vs. better keyboard there. like mac guys even care

. doesn't boomana's thread about not chiming in on equipment you've never heard apply here as well? it's obvious that many (not all) of the mac bashers here have never used macs except in a perfunctory manner at the store or at a relative's house...and yet they're obviously experts in how much better pcs are. please.

 

[Towert7]

Interesting how thin they were able to make it, but like all other apple stuff, it's not for me.

 

[Towert7]

Quote:

Originally Posted by kugino /img/forum/go_quote.gif it still amazes me how much ed loves to chime in in these mac threads...pc folk, who love to bring up marketshare numbers, are way too interested in a segment of the computing market that only has ~5% marketshare. why is that? you rarely see mac users bashing windows and pc threads...we just don't care. but come to a mac thread and there's ed, front and center, model # this and no usb port that and half a pound lighter here vs. better keyboard there. like mac guys even care . doesn't boomana's thread about not chiming in on equipment you've never heard apply here as well? it's obvious that many (not all) of the mac bashers here have never used macs except in a perfunctory manner at the store or at a relative's house...and yet they're obviously experts in how much better pcs are. please.

Don't worry about it, real life is not as black and white as mac lovers would have you believe, nor as black and white as pc lovers would have you believe. Don't take offense when someone doesn't like a product that you like, after all, that's just silly.
^_^

 

[Redo]

Quote:

Originally Posted by kugino /img/forum/go_quote.gif why is that? you rarely see mac users bashing windows and pc threads...we just don't care.

What internet are you on?