[Reader]

I measured at least 30+ different dynamic headphones impedance curve, none of them is anything but flat (with maybe a few ohms up and down). That's my fact.

List them and post the curve.

It's super easy to find single driver dynamic headphones that have a non flat impedance curve.

https://www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/sennheiser-hd660s-review-headphone.34755/

https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...ynamic-dt-880-600-ohm-review-headphone.24694/

https://www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/sennheiser-hd650-review-headphone.18774/

https://www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/focal-clear-review-headphone.18585/

There are many many more, some well known high end ones like HD800s or Utopia have varied impedance as well. not going to waste my time on keep posting links.

This is more enough FACTS to call BS on you.

 

[freddyisaac]

List them and post the curve.

It's super easy to find single driver dynamic headphones that have a non flat impedance curve.

https://www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/sennheiser-hd660s-review-headphone.34755/

https://www.audiosciencereview.com/...ruthear-x-crinacle-zero-red-iem-review.44865/

https://www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/focal-clear-review-headphone.18585/

There are many many more, some well known high end ones like HD800s or Utopia have varied impedance as well. not going to waste my time on keep posting links.

This is more enough FACTS to call BS on you.

crinacle zero red is not a single DD and it is an IEM not a headphone

 

[Reader]

crinacle zero red is not a single DD and it is an IEM not a headphone

Thanks. My mistake in a hurry, meant to link something else

 

[Andrew_WOT]

https://reference-audio-analyzer.pro/en/report/hp/sennheiser-hd-800.php#gsc.tab=0

https://reference-audio-analyzer.pro/en/param14.php?idr=573&idmain=573#gsc.tab=0

 

[Andrew_WOT]

You can shuffle through this database to check impedances of individual models and while there are some outliers like Focal Clear, almost all of them (or at least those I am familiar with and was able to check) have flat or almost flat impedance response.

And no reason to get agitated and rude here even if disagree.

 

[Reader]

You can shuffle through this database to check impedances of individual models and while there are some outliers like Focal Clear, almost all of them (or at least those I am familiar with and was able to check) have flat or almost flat impedance response.

And no reason to get agitated and rude here even if disagree.

Apparently you can't read graphs... The fault is not entirely on you though, the way Y axis drawn is very misleading. The HD800 graphic looks so some what flat, but look at unit on the right side which is the actual impedance, I would say it went from just under 300 all the way up to around 600 ohm.

Let's make it clear, I am not agitated when someone disagree with me, I just like call BS on people misrepresent FACTS. And the impedance curve of a headphones is a matter of objective fact, not subjective opinions like whether the mid sounds smooth or intense.

 

[never satisfied]

Bit the bullet and bought a W4, still getting accustomed to it, but initial impressions are pretty positive. Functionality wise, seems to work and sound fine from an iphone when the included lightning cable is used, but other cables are hit/miss, zero problems from ipad pro usb-c unsurprisingly. Love the crazy amount of customization, don't really like any of the EQ profiles, and the filters don't make a huge audible difference so I stick with NOS, but the tone 1 and 2 tune settings really do seem to make a difference in smoothness. I started out with tone 2, and that can make the Andro ES pretty sharp to the point it's piercing in sibilants at higher volumes, but tone 1 noticeably smoothens higher frequencies for a more forgiving sound without losing any sparkle, definition or imaging precision. More positively, this thing delivers the extreme detail I was craving. The new ES version of the Andro seems a little damped, especially out of underpowered sources, but I can still hear the increased resolution behind it no matter the source, and warmer, less resolving sources just don't do it justice. The W4 has the juice and technical chops to turn the ES into a very analytical machine, but it still has that "glow" and muscley dynamics that keep it from becoming too thin, sterile, or bright. RU7 is still special, it has a grand, large presentation with impressive resolution for a discrete component DAC, but the W4 is just more cleanly separated and works well to deemphasize the warmer characteristics of the ES, bringing it closer to neutral and letting its technical capabilities shine in terms of staging, layering/separation, and detail retrieval.

 

[Andrew_WOT]

Apparently you can't read graphs... The fault is not entirely on you though, the way Y axis drawn is very misleading. The HD800 graphic looks so some what flat, but look at unit on the right side which is the actual impedance, I would say it went from just under 300 all the way up to around 600 ohm.

Let's make it clear, I am not agitated when someone disagree with me, I just like call BS on people misrepresent FACTS. And the impedance curve of a headphones is a matter of objective fact, not subjective opinions like whether the mid sounds smooth or intense.

They use fixed sensitivity scale (dB) on the left side for all graphs. So if sensitivity doesn't vary much with the impedance swing, the graph is flat or almost flat.
So this is what matters, not absolute impedance swing.
E.g. Focal Clear has big sensitivity swing in low freq

And if you look at FQ graph with amps using different OI, it changes shape, which affect sound characteristic of the phone. With higher OI amp they will have bassier response.

Now let's take a look at HD800, sensitivity to impedance does not swing that much or almost flat.

And paired with different OI amps, only loudness changes, not the shape of the FQ response, in other words, phone does not change its sound characteristics, not getting bassier or brighter.

 

[Reader]

They use fixed sensitivity scale (dB) on the left side for all graphs. So if sensitivity doesn't vary much with the impedance swing, the graph is flat or almost flat.
So this is what matters, not absolute impedance swing.
E.g. Focal Clear has big sensitivity swing in low freq

And if you look at FQ graph with amps using different OI, it changes shape, which affect sound characteristic of the phone. With higher OI amp they will have bassier response.


Now let's take a look at HD800, sensitivity to impedance does not swing that much or almost flat.

And paired with different OI amps, only loudness changes, not the shape of the FQ response, in other words, phone does not change its sound characteristics, not getting bassier or brighter.

So you just proved my point, my first comment was HD800 wouldn't change much and clear would... But you got the half the reason right and half the reason wrong, and I am not going to waste my time on you.

 

[Reader]

However, if an amplifier contained in a device the size of a USB stick makes the HD800S sound as good as one that weighs several kg, it only means one thing... that one that weighs several kg is not the best... at least for the HD800S
(personal opinion)

My comment was only when you use a USB stick in your chain. If you use a SoTA desktop DAC into a SoTA desktop Amp it would beat W4 alone, period. Whether you can tell in a double blind test or not is another matter.

 

[Reader]

Out of curiosity... but at what volume do you set the W4 to listen to the HD800S?

Got my HD800s out, balanced output, vol 70, EAPO preamp -10db, max bass boost is 8db.

 

[musicday]

W4 with FT5 had a great synergy in balanced mode70/100.

 

[Polky74]

W4 + iHA-6 + HEK Stealth = details + details amplifier + details finder

400+600+1300= 2300

The recipe for happiness.

 

[Polky74]

Dr. Mister President by Pink... a guitar... a voice... Music!

 

[ClieOS]

A few weeks ago I somewhat touched on the subject of voltage being the dominant factor in determining volume for the discussion around W4 vs. Tanchjim Space (as opposed to power). Don't really have a SPL meter at hand at the time to do further testing as my old SPL meter has broken for a while back then. So I ordered a new SPL meter and it just arrived this afternoon and thus I was able to finish up testing the theory. Here is the result

Space: 0.35V 54mA - 84.6dBA
W4: 0.36V 47mA - 85.3dBA

Xperia 1 IV as the source generating a 1kHz sine wave pure tone, driving a pair of VE Monk Studio ( *rated 75ohm and can take a bit of power so it is kinda perfect for this test) just placed in front of the SPL meter. An E1DA load board (set to unbalanced, no load) is placed between the USB DAC and Monk Studio serving as voltage/amp measuring point. Voltage was matched as closely as possible between W4 and Space but it isn't an exact match as the volume steps of the two USB DAC don't really match up completely. The SPL was observed as well as the output current (*measurement repeated 5 times with numbers averaged). From the result above, you can tell W4 is slightly louder than Space by just a tiny bit, probably the result of a slightly higher voltage output from W4 - if you were to compare the output power between the two however, Space is actually slightly more powerful (~19mW) than W4 (~17mW). I'll let you guys draw the conclusion.