[GreenNeedle]

Next up the surprise

I picked up an MP version of this headphone. Again from Germany but I paid less than I paid for the LP version. Got the MP for £52 (including shipping) whereas the LP version cost me £94. Reason there I assume is all in the description and language. The MP listing didn't mention sextett and all the listing info was in German.

MP on the left, LP on the right:




White with orange border:


LP at the back, MP at the front:


I have had a quick listen to compare but I've not used any "reference" music that I am well used to hearing. I just listened to FM stereo radio swapping them over 30 or so seconds each. My initial reaction is unsure really. The MP seems to sound louder. I would need to listen to some music I know well and from a better source than radio to really gauge things but on initial listening I am unsure if the MP is bassier than the LP. Certainly louder but the LP seems much clearer in the mids and highs. Maybe the MP does have more bass and it is obscuring the mids and highs? I will have to do a proper comparison when I have time. At the moment I still prefer the LP. It just sounds much clearer and better balanced from this quick comparison.

 

[GreenNeedle]

You may have noticed from the above pictures new pads (brown and grey.) These are much bigger in depth than the stock ones and I have had to trim the backs to fit onto the phones. They also have screens on the phone side which I haven't cut off yet:



A few of pictures of the LP with grey pads, sleeved cable, re-elasticated and shorter leather headband. They look "cool" enough for a young footballer to hang around his neck now, lol.






Now one with grey and white pad. Which one looks better?






I have had a quick listen on the LP version (again just listening to RM Stereo Radio) and these pads put the headphones further from your head. Again I need to listen for longer but initial observations are that while the bass sounds as loud, the mids and highs are quieter. pushing the headphones with 1 finger on the badges (not covering the back of the phone) to squash the pads to stock distance the mids and high volume comes back. The pads themselves are really comfy though and I have yet to cut the driverside cloth out.

Will come back with a proper assessment at a later date.

 

[GreenNeedle]

I've done some proper testing now so I will give a bit of a comparison. I understand that I may have different preferences to others as my "results" come out differently to the perceived preference from many users of the MP being the best version.

First test I quickly used my Yamaha RX-V361 just listening to a variety of music channels on the TV. Mixture of stuff, Rock anthems on the Kerrang Channel, then random oldies on the vintage channel, ad-hoc hits on one of the MTV channels (was Rihanna SOS at the time which I quite like anyway) and then tried the Clubland channel which was doing 90s anthems. No EQ used on the Yamaha. I use this on straight. TV box goes straight out to the AV through optical so no EQ from the TV either unless the TV channel is sending Dolby Digital because the Yamaha automatically detects that and I don't know how to stop it. Doesn;t matter what setting you use on the AV. If a dolby digital signal is received it automatically gives you dolby digital. Anyways these music channels are not dolby digital ones. lol.

First off were the Sennheiser HD438. These sound like I remember them sounding. Nice.
Next up were the LP with stock pads. Made the Sennheisers sound like toys!! Clarity you wouldn't believe. A lovely crisp sound. At least 20% louder than the Sennheisers!!!
Next up were the MP with stock pads. These were another 10% louder than the MPS, however they do not sound as clear!! One song which clearly showed this was November Rain. There is an acoustic guitar that strums one in each bar behind the electric. With the LP it sounded glorious. So clear and absolutely beautiful. With the LP I could hardly hear that acoustic. It was there but very much hidden which was a little sad.
Next up were the MP with the brown pads. This helped the sound by pulling the headphones away from my head. They are much deeper than new stock pads would be though. It stopped the bass being so "echoey" and you could hear the bass notes much better.
NExt were the LP with the brown pads. There is a night and day difference here. The bass is louder and with the headphone further away the mids and treble don;t carry as well. It is a reasonable compromise to boost the bass a tad while losing a little of that top end.

The winner on this test is a toss up between the LP with stock pads and the LP with the brown pads. Then MP brown > stock >>>>>>>HD438 (A vast way behind.)

Listening to a TV weather forecast so just speaking. The HD438 makes the voice sound warm and relaxed. The LP makes the voice sound quite natural and crisp. The MP gives some depth to the voice which I quite liked. Winner for purely speaking voice (TV shows etc minus music) would be the HD 438 followed by the MP followed by the LP.

Onto the proper source stuff through the Rotel RX-150A because music sounds better through that. Not bothering with the Sennheisers on this test because I bought the Sextetts because the Sennheisers sound terrible on this old receiver. EQ is basic on this receiver. bass is at 1 o clock and treble at 2 o clock so both are just boosted slightly.

First track I tried was GnR - Welcome to the Jungle as it is a song I play a lot. This is on original 1987 CD.
The winner here was the LP with brown pads >LP with stock pads > MP with brown pads > MP with stock pads.

The clarity of the LP wins again here. It seems to seperate all the guitars out much better. There are about 4 layers of guitars in some parts and you can clearly hear 1 on the left, 1 on the right, 1 in front of you and the lead inside your head (totally centred.) Each one is clear and nicely directioned. The brown pads just soften them a little but they are still clear while the bass is pulled up a level in volume.

The MP just does not have that clarity. I can hear now from a decent source that they are louder than the LP but nothing is as clear. The bass is more powerful but loses its clarity, and that bass seems to migrate or obscure the mids so while you can tell the guitars are coming from different speakers you can't hear bits of them and lose track of it all. The vocals are fine. Everything has a little more depth. Think listening to someone's voice outside and then listening to the same voice in a room. Their voice sounds a little deeper or the deeper part of their voice is more noticeable. That would be fine except I think it is happening to all the instruments as well and that is what is "blurring" the separation. Still sounds better than the Sennheisers. The LPs just sound much more like I would expect from my speakers. Clear, precise, seperates the instruments well and you can hear every little widdle diddle or lick. Nothing gets lost or obscured.


Next up was ACDC - Back in black. This is the 180gm remastered version. Stylus is the Ortofon FX15XE.
Of all the headphones I was undecided between the LP with brown and with stock pads. I kept switching. This is a really great sounding record so it was a good test. Very well mixed IMO.
This was a much closer thing. The result was the same as above but the LP sounded much better than the previous version. Maybe this record is much more forgiving, much simpler, less layers and a subconcious will to just rock out. I listened to "you shook me all night long" on each of the 4 tests for this because it just sounds really good on these headphones. Then I listened to the whole album on the LP with brown pads.

Finally for testing I put on Pink Floyd - dark side of the moon. This was a very close thing. Maybe because the album is much mellower and the clarity of the LP doesn't necessarily score as many points here.
I should add that Breathe sounded awful with the Ortofon stylus. Gilmour's little tinkering sounded so trebly and I couldn't stand it. The Ortofon is far too clinical for most pre 80s records. So I switched to the Shure M75ED which is warmer, louder and a bit more bsas orientated. Immediately had me closing my eyes and chilling again.
The result was the same but this was a very close run thing. The MPs had a nice and relaxed sound here which sort of goes with the album. However I like the LP more again because we now have a warm stylus on the player as well as a mellow relaxing record so the LP added a little needed life rather than everything (record, stylus and amp) being warm. My speakers are quite bright so I guess this is something I accustomed to. I bought them to counter the warmth of the Yamaha originally but they do the same for the Rotel.

I didn't test anymore. I have listened to Extreme - Pornograffiti and now Dire Straits-Dire Straits just through the LP with brown pads. These LPs are quite simply breathtaking for acoustic or clean guitar sounds. Absolute wow factor. I still don;t get the bass lite sentiment though. Maybe the Rotel and Yamaha are naturally quite bassy? Ride the lightening is the only album where bass was non existent quiet so far.

I haven't bothered to test the grey pads. They are bigger in depth and from my test I think that the sweet spot is going to be about 2mm less distance from my ear than the brown pads are which is quite a lot more than the stock pads but then they both look like originals and are very soft. I have been gently pressing the cups while listening with the brown pads. I might try and find something to hang the headphones on that I can squash the brown pads down a little. They are quite firm pads so hopefully in a short period they will squish those few mm and reach the sweet spot I hear when gently pressing them in a little bit. The shorter headband is working very well. Allied with the deeper pads they clamp nicely. Not too tight but not too loose. A perfect seal. The grey pads will end up being the "failed" last resort ones.

All in all I think it is my listening preferences that are dictating my results. I like warm amps and bright speakers and I assume this is translating into how I rate what I hear from the headphones.

I think I will probably hang on to the LP ones as a backup. Yet to make my mind up on whether to sell them on again. I might try them out again in a couple of weeks to see if my opinion has changed at all.

I have to say though. The difference from the Sennheiser HD 438, which I had thought sounded really nice, to the Sextett LP is vast. They are very good for watching TV or on the laptop but they just can;t compete for serious music listening. My wife would not understand what I meant and just say "they are louder but can;t tell any difference" but then she listens to MP3s through a tinny phone speaker lol ,which I could not bear to do. I would rather listen to the traffic.

I'll post up some pics of the pimped up winner complete with brown pads at some point. I stitched some elastic around the rear of the pad where I had cut just to tidy things up and make sure they held on properly. I would already have done it but I dropped my camera yesterday. lol.

 

[Monsterzero]

You would hate the EPs!
Glad youre digging your new cans!

 

[GreenNeedle]

You would hate the EPs!
Glad youre digging your new cans!

One pity is that (unlike the LP) the MP has the grills glued in so I can't see if everything is OK behind there. I'm sure they shouldn't sound like these do because so many people prefer them. There is no black stuff coming out from the headphones and I can see there is no foam in the back so this has already been taken out I assume which leads me to wonder if someone has been in there and maybe caused some damage.

 

[Monsterzero]

IDK man..all three of mine sound the same,except for the bass.There certainly is no lack of clarity on them.

 

[GreenNeedle]

Here are the tidied up brown pads. I had cut the back so that there was about 12mm of "sleeve" because the holes that were originally there were too small to go on cups. I didn;t want a load of the sleeve covering up the cups either. So I cut them down which despite my very careful cutting left some jagged edges:



They were also quite loose and got knocked off easily because these are a soft pleather whereas the stock ones are firmer with a "stamped" edge to them.

So I got the reel of elastic I used to redo the headband elastics (about 1mm diameter) and I stitched it around the circumference of the hole on the back. A knot on one end which the first few stitches stopped and then every half inch or so I pulled the elastic a little to make sure it would pull inward once finished. Then once I was about an inch from the end I pulled it tighter and tied another knot at where the end needed to be and stitched up the remaining unstitched circumference.

Once done I worked the elastic going around the cup several times just to even up the stress of the elastic rather than some bits tight, some bits loose and I ended up with this:




Looks nice and tidy.

 

[GreenNeedle]

And the following pics are of the completed "pimped" sextetts.

Just a reminder of what has been done:

It is still the stock cable which has just been desoldered, sleeved and then resoldered "as was."

4mm Leather headband made in the exact same style as the old leatherette/plastic one. I intentionally made it 3cm shorter (1.5cm at each end) to fit my head a bit better.

Headband elastics redone with 1mm black elasticated thread to look like stock.

Brown pads instead of the stock black ones which have had the rear trimmed and the inner driverside "speaker cloth" cut out so that they are still like the stock with the plastic driver grille open to the ear.

I wasn't sure the brown pads would look that good but that changed when I put them on. They just looked "right" at that point:











So with all that done these are set for a lot of usage.

 

[GreenNeedle]

Son (13 years old) tried the LP with brown pads today and said "wow, these are so clear." Then I made him try the MP with white pads and he said "not as clear as the other one" so I put the stock pads on them and he said "nope." Put the stock pads on the LP and he said "better but not as clear as the brown ones, so brown ones back on and he sat back happy again and listened to Oasis then RATM.

He seems to have the same opinion as me although I still think that a few mm more "squeeze" on these brown pads would be the sweet spot. They are about 1.5x deeper than the stock and they don't compress much when they are put on whereas the stock does a little.

Anyways, the LP are mine (at the moment) so on to pimping the MP. Which colour leather headband for the white pads? We have the same Antique dark brown as I put on the LP, then saddle tan, then antique saddle tan and lastly black oil tanned. With flash, then without, then from the side:







He will probably get this pair upstairs with whichever receiver I choose to let go up there. Not sure he will want the "racing" headband. (I mean like the rallye leather watch straps with the large holes.) Might even try some custom design with punches and such like. Will have to see what he wants (other than a blinkin Oasis logo. lol)

p.s. the antique brown on the left is unfinished, not been trimmed, burnished and not had mink oil on it yet so looks a bit rough. I have also sewn a line of elastic around the trim on the rear of these pads so they "grip" nicely and look tidier.

 

[Monsterzero]

Son (13 years old) tried the LP with brown pads today and said "wow, these are so clear." Then I made him try the MP with white pads and he said "not as clear as the other one" so I put the stock pads on them and he said "nope." Put the stock pads on the LP and he said "better but not as clear as the brown ones, so brown ones back on and he sat back happy again and listened to Oasis then RATM.

He seems to have the same opinion as me although I still think that a few mm more "squeeze" on these brown pads would be the sweet spot. They are about 1.5x deeper than the stock and they don't compress much when they are put on whereas the stock does a little.

Anyways, the LP are mine (at the moment) so on to pimping the MP. Which colour leather headband for the white pads? We have the same Antique dark brown as I put on the LP, then saddle tan, then antique saddle tan and lastly black oil tanned. With flash, then without, then from the side:







He will probably get this pair upstairs with whichever receiver I choose to let go up there. Not sure he will want the "racing" headband. (I mean like the rallye leather watch straps with the large holes.) Might even try some custom design with punches and such like. Will have to see what he wants (other than a blinkin Oasis logo. lol)

p.s. the antique brown on the left is unfinished, not been trimmed, burnished and not had mink oil on it yet so looks a bit rough. I have also sewn a line of elastic around the trim on the rear of these pads so they "grip" nicely and look tidier.

Nice work.You might consider cross posting in the Grado'd AKG thread. Probably get more love there as opposed to in this section.

 

[squee116]

Somewhat in conjunction with the thrust of this thread, I've found a guy at Northridge Electronics who's willing to convert vintage receivers and amps to lower the gain stage and remove the stepdown resistor to the headphone output so that the output impedance goes down, and allows a wider ranger of headphones to be used on vintage gear. I'm in talks to have him do that on my MAC 1900.

 

[GreenNeedle]

Nice work.You might consider cross posting in the Grado'd AKG thread. Probably get more love there as opposed to in this section.

Will do. I won;t put it all in though. Overload. lol

 

[Monsterzero]

Somewhat in conjunction with the thrust of this thread, I've found a guy at Northridge Electronics who's willing to convert vintage receivers and amps to lower the gain stage and remove the stepdown resistor to the headphone output so that the output impedance goes down, and allows a wider ranger of headphones to be used on vintage gear. I'm in talks to have him do that on my MAC 1900.

You might consider asking in the vintage receiver thread about building your own,as opposed to doing major intrusive surgery on your MAC...or try PMing @r2muchstuff RE: the non-permanent stepdown resistors he has made.He was kind enough to send me one for a trial run.

 

[squee116]

You might consider asking in the vintage receiver thread about building your own,as opposed to doing major intrusive surgery on your MAC...or try PMing @r2muchstuff RE: the non-permanent stepdown resistors he has made.He was kind enough to send me one for a trial run.

The idea of eliminating the stepdown resistor and just lowering gain is that the resistor alters the signal. Getting rid of the resistor lowers the output impedance and brings the signal back in-line to what it should be. You're not wrong though, if you can't undo the changes, values of the unit will not be the same post-changes.

 

[Monsterzero]

The idea of eliminating the stepdown resistor and just lowering gain is that the resistor alters the signal. Getting rid of the resistor lowers the output impedance and brings the signal back in-line to what it should be. You're not wrong though, if you can't undo the changes, values of the unit will not be the same post-changes.

OK I misunderstood your desired intent.If I am understanding you correctly your goal is to improve SQ by eliminating the resistor altogether?If thats the case I can add that I have an Audeze/ZMF cable terminated in speaker wires and while the sound to my ears is a bit cleaner vs HP jack,the difference is a long shot from night and day,and if given the option to get that extra 2% by altering the innards of a vintage jewel like your 1900,I'd pass.YMMV.

To be clear if the improvement was vast Id not think twice about it,but on my gear,to my ears the difference was quite minimal.