[doctorjazz]

Boy, am I sorry I got into this LH Labs sinkhole...
very distressing turn of events. Not sure how Gavin pointing the finger at Larry actually HELPS anything, except some try on his part to remove himself from the blame in all of this. Well, it never seemed it could be all Gavin, and it sure doesn't seem to be all Larry. Lots of bad stuff to go around...

 

[vrapan]

Boy, am I sorry I got into this LH Labs sinkhole...
very distressing turn of events. Not sure how Gavin pointing the finger at Larry actually HELPS anything, except some try on his part to remove himself from the blame in all of this. Well, it never seemed it could be all Gavin, and it sure doesn't seem to be all Larry. Lots of bad stuff to go around...

I am trying to see that Gavin reply but can't seem to find it can someone copy it here or just link straight to it?

 

[mscott58]

Boy, am I sorry I got into this LH Labs sinkhole...
very distressing turn of events. Not sure how Gavin pointing the finger at Larry actually HELPS anything, except some try on his part to remove himself from the blame in all of this. Well, it never seemed it could be all Gavin, and it sure doesn't seem to be all Larry. Lots of bad stuff to go around...

Only thing I can think of is that this was a bit of a ploy/scheme/orchestrated approach to share this tough information?

 

[doctorjazz]

Boy, am I sorry I got into this LH Labs sinkhole...
very distressing turn of events. Not sure how Gavin pointing the finger at Larry actually HELPS anything, except some try on his part to remove himself from the blame in all of this. Well, it never seemed it could be all Gavin, and it sure doesn't seem to be all Larry. Lots of bad stuff to go around...

I am trying to see that Gavin reply but can't seem to find it can someone copy it here or just link straight to it?

It looks like it has been removed...there was a link on the Vi Dac Thread, but when I use it now, it goes to the LH Pulse page, the Gavin post is gone...
things get curioser and curioser...

 

[vrapan]

Read it, still in there in the Geek Pulse DAC updates section if anyone wants it copied here let me know. I don't get the timing, Gavin's involvement months after he has moved on really makes no sense. Not that much in their campaigns, production schedules make any sense really. 

 

[Insidious Meme]

Hm.. Interesting read. Not happy how all this has played out,but at least I can tell they're going in the right direction. Focusing on fewer products is a good thing. Yeah still have to wait, but whatever.

 

[vwinter]

Why now?

He has to face people (officially on behalf of Audioengine no less) at RMAF in less than 2 weeks time.

I'll give him some small credit, he could have easily found excuses not to attend RMAF this year.

Excuses that he would have to peddle to his new employer. Your answer makes sense and I hope that's the extent of it.

He's tried in one fell calculated swoop to patch up his reputation, placate publicly and vocally irate backers that can be traced back to him, pass the buck, temper any second thoughts that may be in the mind of his new employer, and limit potential legal liability. And that's just off the top of my head.

I didn't even care about him when he more than likely was "overly-optimistic" about everything, over and over again.

What he tried to do here on the other hand was just so disrespectful to everyone involved in the sheer level of attempted manipulation that I was floored. To post something like that says to me that there is no remorse. Don't confuse what he's said with any semblance of underlying guilt. The way I see it, this is self preservation, nothing more.

Edited to remove quantification.

 

[jdog]

I've gone back and read Gavin's confessional again, and I just find what he says to be incredible to the point of unbelievable.  If the following portion is true, then it would seem that someone at LH Labs (either past or present) is extremely naive/inexperienced.  I realize that I am not in the business of developing/manufacturing electronics, but if you are dealing with a new vendor on a new product why in the world wouldn't you first request a small production run to make sure the PCB and components are all operating properly.  Just read this part where Gavin seems to be saying that LH Labs either actually or potentially lost "hundreds of thousands of dollars" on production of the Pulse: 
 
"There is a batch of boards that were manufactured and stuffed with hundreds of dollars worth of components on each one that had a 98% failure rate. Because of this perceived screw-up on the part of the PCB manufacturer, Larry fired that vendor. Then, because he didn't want to loose hundreds of thousands of dollars in components that couldn't be un-soldered and used again, and because he felt that he couldn't wait months for some of the long lead time components he'd have to re-order, he decided to go about the process of troubleshooting and repairing the failed boards so he could deliver them to you in a timely fashion.  Ultimately, after months of work, the boards couldn't be salvaged and he came to grips with the fact that he needed to bite the bullet and re-manufacture and assemble the boards.  He tried a couple different vendors and never got a board from them that worked. Upon further troubleshooting, though, he found out that the problem wasn't solely with the PCB after all, but there was also a problem with a specific batch of one of the active components in his design. He has talked with that vendor, brought the problem to their knowledge, and worked with them on the fix."
 
And then, if this major business embarrassment for LH Labs wasn't enough, Gavin throws his "full support" behind Larry, not just once, but twice:  1. "You probably don't care (I wouldn't if I were in your shoes), but Larry feels awful and sincerely wants to deliver what he committed LH Labs to deliver."  2.  "To my satisfaction today, I believe Larry is working hard to get things finished and shipped as quickly as possible. Having said that, I wouldn't hold my breath for mid October."
 
I don't really care why Gavin wrote what he did, he is purely and simply a creep...  And, I believe that Gavin has irreparably damaged Larry's and LH Labs' reputation.  Gavin had to know that his missive would leave contributor's with plenty of negative feelings, and I certainly don't think anyone who has read his message has been filled with "awesomified" good feelings.  At this point, I feel Gavin owes Larry a huge apology for his "CYA behavior"...  But it seems that Gavin just wants to wash his hands of this mess and offer some drinks to anyone who will listen to more of his B*llSH*t....
 
Here again is the link to Gavin's message, if anyone still cares: https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/geek-pulse-dac-high-rez-desktop-dac-system-audio--4/#/updates 

 

[MikeyFresh]

Excuses that he would have to peddle to his new employer. Your answer makes sense and I hope that's the extent of it.

He's tried in one fell calculated swoop to patch up his reputation, placate publicly and vocally irate backers that can be traced back to him, pass the buck, temper any second thoughts that may be in the mind of his new employer, and limit potential legal liability. And that's just off the top of my head.

I didn't even care about him when he more than likely was "overly-optimistic" about everything, over and over again.

What he tried to do here on the other hand was just so disrespectful to everyone involved in the sheer level of attempted manipulation that I was floored. To post something like that says to me that there is no remorse. Don't confuse what he's said with any semblance of underlying guilt. The way I see it, this is self preservation, nothing more.

Edited to remove quantification.

I am inclined to agree that the chief motivation behind that IGG update is likely self preservation, and unfortunately it's of little/no use to anyone at this point.

 

[noshortcuts]

.....

What he tried to do here on the other hand was just so disrespectful to everyone involved in the sheer level of attempted manipulation that I was floored. To post something like that says to me that there is no remorse. Don't confuse what he's said with any semblance of underlying guilt. The way I see it, this is self preservation, nothing more.
 

Agree with all but underlining "disrespectful" and "no remorse". It may be true that Larry is overly optimistic but I believe it's also true that Larry continues to work tirelessly to fulfill obligations while Gavin left him hanging with all the projects and responsibilities and just returned for entirely selfish reasons. But throwing his most recent employer/partner under the bus won't help him save face with current/future employers!

 

[noshortcuts]

I get the sense that Gavin and Casey left Larry to manage the whole LHL team, communicate with customers, design everything, and oversee all purchasing, assembly, quality control, distribution..etc. LHL may still have marketing/web design/accounting people on the team but do they do anything obviously helpful? If he hasn't already, I'm thinking Larry needs to fire people not actively helping. I also imagine he should hire an engineer to help with product design and a qualified person to manage purchasing and quality control with suppliers and manufacturers.

 

[superachromat]

Obviously, Gavin's message was trying to washing his hands and preserve his reputation. However, I don't see anyone would believe in what he says or feeling any better after reading his message.
 
To save for LHL's reputation and business, I think Larry should focus on pushing for delivering for the outstanding promises and stop releasing new products before the old promises are fulfilled. 

 

[Zojokkeli]

  Here again is the link to Gavin's message, if anyone still cares: https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/geek-pulse-dac-high-rez-desktop-dac-system-audio--4/#/updates 

 
Wow, some nerve he's got...

 

[walfredo]

  Obviously, Gavin's message was trying to washing his hands and preserve his reputation. However, I don't see anyone would believe in what he says or feeling any better after reading his message.
 
To save for LHL's reputation and business, I think Larry should focus on pushing for delivering for the outstanding promises and stop releasing new products before the old promises are fulfilled. 

+1
 
Gavin does not mind hitting Larry for his own gain.  Disappointing but not surprising.
 
Now, some in this thread feel that Larry is "innocent" and this whole fiasco is Gavin's fault.  I don't think this is true.  Larry is equally responsible.  Moreover, if he wants LHL and his reputation to survive, he needs to pull out what he promised (and was already paid for).

 

[BartSimpson1976]

  Moreover, if he wants LHL and his reputation to survive, 

 
That ship sailed long time ago!