[swannie007]

I simply can't believe that people still support these guys and give them money in exchange for promises(often broken) and pie in the sky delivery dates. Sheesh.

 

[gikigill]

The Onkyo is 1200 AUD. Pretty expensive due to the exchange rate.

 

[nudd]

The Onkyo is 1200 AUD. Pretty expensive due to the exchange rate.

 
The Onkyo is 69,000 Yen at e-earphone. How is that 1200 AUD?
 
Even if you go to Yodobashi and just straight up buy it at its full price without bargaining, it is 74,000 Yen according to Kakaku (just over $900).
 
If you go to Pricejapan and get them to ship it to you, including a 4000 yen fee, it is still only 74,000 Yen (including EMS shipping to Australia from Japan, which is totally awesome).

 

[gikigill]

Too expensive to import considering the warranty implications. I am comfortable importing lower value items but something this expensive is too much to risk.

 

[jdog]

Boy, this thread woke up!

Are you really surprised since Larry "chummed the waters" with the msata offering?   Looks like to me just another way to pass the time, like the old discussion about screen size....

 

[germay0653]

  Are you really surprised since Larry "chummed the waters" with the msata offering?   Looks like to me just another way to pass the time, like the old discussion about screen size....

Nah, he just chartered the boat to take us fishing.  The chum was already prepared and frozen a while back.

 

[Brubacca]

I simply can't believe that people still support these guys and give them money in exchange for promises(often broken) and pie in the sky delivery dates. Sheesh.

I supported them 2 years ago. Not since.

 

[vwinter]

I supported them 2 years ago. Not since.

Same here. Fool me once.

 

[Lookin4Treble]

Yep, and the naysayers are still at it...

 
And evidently so are the Light Harmonic apologists. 
 
We are all entitled to our own opinions/philosophies.  Mine is hold people to their word, and not to excuse away repeated episodes of planning ineptness.  I don't even agree with backer's publicly stating they don't expect the Wave in 2016. To me, it's enabling more of the same behavior when LHL reads that.  No!  They still have 8.5 months in 2016, so I think it's perfectly reasonable to expect this damn project get finished.

 

[wingsounds13]

I know that few believe it, but I am not apologizing for LH Labs, merely trying to increase understanding of some of the issues that they may have. I readily accept that they are utterly incompetent at scheduling, project management and time estimates. I do firmly believe that Larry Ho is an honest man, doing what he can to deliver an outstanding audio product. Unfortunately, there is much more to producing an audio product than just the audio circuit and its surrounding support. Larry can obviously handle the audio design, and his team seems competent at the rest of the hardware design. Unfortunately, none of them seem to have any significant skills at project management. Gavin's excellent marketing skills did not help the problem, as he was able to do an amazing job of selling products that did not yet exist. Perhaps he will do wonders for some other company that has the ability to keep up with his sales abilities and/or reign in his rather 'optimistic' product and project claims.

Perhaps people think that I am a moron or sheep because I am not aggressively and obnoxiously on the attack every time LH Labs fails in their project timeline estimates. I don't believe that being obnoxious is beneficial for my health and also feel that it does anything to advance the status of the existing projects being discussed.

I guess that I may be more patient than some around here too. I also sincerely believe that when the Wave is delivered that it will be an up to date product with top of the line performance and features, some not (yet) found in any competing products. If they do manage to include the mSATA drive capability in the Wave, this will certainly be an unmatched feature, at least until some competitor sees the need to copy it for their feature list.

Oh well... the story goes on and will eventually come to some sort of a conclusion. Until then, I will continue to enjoy my Pulse X infinity and hold it as evidence that Larry and company can produce an excellent sounding audio product.

J.P.

 

[nudd]

The thing is as time goes on they have ess and less unique features in the wave and more and cheaper and cheaper competitors.

 

[wingsounds13]

Ultimately I dont give a squat about "unique features". I don't care if other players share every 'feature' of the Wave. What counts to me is:
1. Sound quality.
2. A User Interface that is functional and reliable.
3. Sound quality.
4. Overall reliability.
5. Battery run time - there is no such thing as too much of this.
6. Good controls. I would really like a volume knob instead of buttons.
7. Storage capacity. Even with just two full size SDXC slots this one is taken care of, although eSATA is an excellent addition.
8. A clean and durable case. Nothing fancy needed here, I prefer simple lines - just get the job done.

J.P.

 

[gyx11]

I know that few believe it, but I am not apologizing for LH Labs, merely trying to increase understanding of some of the issues that they may have. I readily accept that they are utterly incompetent at scheduling, project management and time estimates. I do firmly believe that Larry Ho is an honest man, doing what he can to deliver an outstanding audio product. Unfortunately, there is much more to producing an audio product than just the audio circuit and its surrounding support. Larry can obviously handle the audio design, and his team seems competent at the rest of the hardware design. Unfortunately, none of them seem to have any significant skills at project management. Gavin's excellent marketing skills did not help the problem, as he was able to do an amazing job of selling products that did not yet exist. Perhaps he will do wonders for some other company that has the ability to keep up with his sales abilities and/or reign in his rather 'optimistic' product and project claims.

Perhaps people think that I am a moron or sheep because I am not aggressively and obnoxiously on the attack every time LH Labs fails in their project timeline estimates. I don't believe that being obnoxious is beneficial for my health and also feel that it does anything to advance the status of the existing projects being discussed.

I guess that I may be more patient than some around here too. I also sincerely believe that when the Wave is delivered that it will be an up to date product with top of the line performance and features, some not (yet) found in any competing products. If they do manage to include the mSATA drive capability in the Wave, this will certainly be an unmatched feature, at least until some competitor sees the need to copy it for their feature list.

Oh well... the story goes on and will eventually come to some sort of a conclusion. Until then, I will continue to enjoy my Pulse X infinity and hold it as evidence that Larry and company can produce an excellent sounding audio product.

J.P.

I just cannot understand how you can claim to share the same misgivings as everyone else, then single out Larry and Gavin for praise, and then absolve them of blame for all the problems you pointed out.

A company isn't simply many individuals working in parallel. Granted there's different kinds of management structure but the common theme is integration.

There is no integration or coherency of business goals or timelines within LHL. that explains the contradictory information, the overly skewed slant towards sales and marketing whilst the CS and production side of things were still massively underdeveloped.

Who do you blame for this? It's unfair to pin all of this on one or a few people. Everyone needs to take a share of it. But the key personnel whom make the major decisions must also be held accountable.

Also, I'm not sure how it is possible that Gavin can be classified as being great at his job. Unless his role in LHL, or in general the role of a marketing lead, is to go full maverick mode with no other considerations. Marketing should always be done within in context and with moderation. The Schiit philosophy of underpromise and overdeliver, instead of the other way round.

And has exhaustively been mentioned, time is ticking. The original GO was a game changer. But a year and a half on, the market has already caught up. The GOv2 is at the pinnacle of portable audio as of now. I've listened to it and enjoyed it more than most to come to the conclusion that it sounds absolutely phenomenal, especially in balanced. But I have no doubt that within 2 years, other products will have caught up or surpassed it. The digital topology of the Wave is exactly the same as the GOv2, so when we all agree how great it sounds right now, that's with the caveat of being able to listen to it right now.

It's illogical to speak of how great a DAP sounds compared to its alternatives when it's months away from even being rolled out (not to mention the later backers). all of this is of course just conjecture, but there is no way that the portable audio market going to stop and wait for the Wave to be released before playing catch up.

And that's just the audio side of things. Others have already mentioned. It's not about the sound. Perhaps it used to be when the campaign first launched, but when you play your backers for fools time and again, some limits inevitably get crossed.

 

[swannie007]

Very succinctly put. I am so glad I didn't back any of their projects having taken a wait and see stance after their first crowd funded project turned into a missal of broken promises and missed delivery schedules. What a shambles, and yet, they come back and fish the same waters and catch more gullible believers. Once bitten....... 

 

[germay0653]

 
Very succinctly put. I am so glad I didn't back any of their projects having taken a wait and see stance after their first crowd funded project turned into a missal of broken promises and missed delivery schedules. What a shambles, and yet, they come back and fish the same waters and catch more gullible believers. Once bitten....... 

Let's all agree to disagree and respect each other opinions.  Yes, LH F'd up on project management (communication, timeline and probably cost to them).  No one is questioning that or asking to give them a hall pass.  I'm certainly not happy about it but they have, eventually, delivered a product that performs.
 
Yes, hold them accountable but when you're trying to teach someone something do you continually berate them for their mistakes or do you try to affect change constructively.  When a teacher or boss is trying to get me to learn from my mistakes I would much prefer someone who tries to do so in a positive manner rather than to continually beat me up. 
 
Regarding obsolescence, two years is probably about average before something newer, better and faster comes out and that applies to all brands, not just LH Labs.  Those of us who have upgraditus know that all too well.  It empties our pockets and is just the nature of the beast.