Just got my PS-1s .... WOW

[EdipisReks]

i didn't get a chance to hear the PS-1 with the GCHA (the time periods when i got to borrow each didn't overlap), but the GCHA definitely has great control.

 

[boodi]

Quote:

Originally Posted by donlin I have tried the Grace, Headroom Max, Aural Audition, Raptor, Grado HPA-1, Melos SHA-1.

donlin could you do a little comparo on those vs the gcha ?
I'm very interested in the matter , the HPA-1 , the Melos and the Aural Audition on top .

if you prefer just pm me

 

[jjcha]

Quote:

Originally Posted by donlin I have tried the Grace, Headroom Max, Aural Audition, Raptor, Grado HPA-1, Melos SHA-1.

I never was a huge fan of the synergy between my Grace m902 or PS-1. I never felt it brought out the best in the PS-1, so it doesn't surprise me you prefer another amp.

Best regards,

-Jason

 

[Oski]

Quote:

Originally Posted by donlin I think the key to PS-1's is using the right amp. I tried it with many and the PS Audio GCHA is the only one that I've heard that properly controls the bass and still lets the liquid midrange through.

I think this is made even more so because you chose to use flat pads with the PS-1. I mean it's already hard enough with bowls...but good to see that GCHA is working out.

 

[Zanth]

Quote:

Originally Posted by neilvg My experience has been that headphones in the upper tier (> $800) generally don't offer perfection, but a particular coloration or refinement in a certain portion of their reproduction. A lot of people feel let down by $$$ (and $$$$) phones because they expect to be transported, wowed, moved, touched, and blown away all at the same time. Most of these more expensive phones at least require a great deal of time spent getting to know them, and building a system around them. K1K's sound sibilant and can be thin with too much treble energy. R10's can also get piercing and require a good source and amp to blend the fantastic midrange with the bottom end correctly. L3K's to me need to be revoiced Can't stand that upper midrange, but bass impact is phenomenal. HE60's can err on the slightly metallic side with a very fast midrange. A good amp (such as the 007t) will generally slow these phones down and add some much needed warmth. No comment on HE90's as I've never heard them out of an HEV90 (to be fair), but from my experience they are not Daddy's to the HE60's at all, just entirely different phones. To me, the sweet spot for the money and to really get a taste for what the headfi ethos is all about, is the HD600/or 650. These phones are amazing, but when configured properly with good cabling and an awesome amp, will blow you away. To this date, for me (as if that matters) a balanced HD650 out of an SDS-XLR (but maybe some other balanced amps as well) just BLOWS ME AWAY. Nothing I have heard comes even close. Neil

This is an EXCELLENT post and one I thoroughly agree with. At some point, one has to admit to themselves that they 1) enjoy a certain sound 2) are willing to pay the big bucks for the small to minute elevation in quality from product A to product B and that 3) others may or may not agree with you.

I've heard everything now, save for the K1000's, L3000's and HE90's (that are on the short list of amazing phones) and I can't see me being completely bowled over by any of these to the point that I would want to sell my current setup. After hearing the W11JPN's and corresponding with those who have heard these and the L3000's, I believe that only the K1000's or the HE90's would really move me to get serious about swapping out the Grados, and even then, with the long list of those claiming the K1000's can sound bright or sibilant or thin (Ear V20's notwithstanding) then it really seems to me that only the HE90 with the HE90V would be the one, and that combo is far outside my price range. Thankfully, I've had the opportunity to listen in my system for extended periods of time and as such, have been able to formulate my opinion with some solid quantitative analysis. Still, in the end it really is all subjective and some wallets are more impervious than others when getting into the upper echelons of head-didome.

 

[Zanth]

Quote:

Originally Posted by boodi thanks for answer...it's probably true that breaking in improvement may be less noticeable on ps-1 then on other hi-end cans, because of the big bass that's fun from beginning . But I'm very confident they change , they're changing in fact the bass keep in tighting more; yesterday it was a whole super bloat really , and not extended ( I was quite suprised , my hp-2 trounced them in every regards ) , today is more solid . I'd just like to know others opinions .

From my experience, I did find the PS-1's improving over time, but nothing like say...the 325i's. I can't comment regarding the RS-1's because mine were used. That said, you won't get the tightness of bass that an HP-1000 offers. The HP-1000's, in my opinion, simply have the tightest most impactful bass available. Paired with a synergistic amp, and one will be wowed! However, I do feel the PS-1's get as deep and certainly provide MORE bass.

For me:

PS-1>HP-1000's>RS-1's for top end, in extension and in accurate reproduction (i.e., low to no sibilance)

RS-1>PS-1>HP-1000 for midrange. Though the PS-1's have the most liquid midrange, which is so enchanting and addictive, I feel that sometimes it is a bit thick for my liking when compared to the RS-1's which when say, listening to acoustic guitar or chamber ensembles, the wooden tonality rings truer to my ears than when using the PS-1's. With the HP-1000's, though flatter, they are sometimes too cold and certainly don't lend enough body to the instruments as the RS-1's or PS-1's. This richness in tone may come across as a colouration, but after playing woodwinds for 20 years, I have come to know well their proper sound, and only the RS-1's gets them dead on (then the R10's, then the PS-1's, then at a distance, the HP-1000's).

HP-1000>PS-1>RS-1 for bass. This applies to both deep bass and tightness. I feel that one is truly able to pick out every thread of bass lines with the HP-1000s while the PS-1's because of the abundance, can sometimes obscure the lower, less prominant lines. The RS-1's in comparison sound more like a one bass note reproduction, but admittedly this is because I use flats with them. Using bowls, it is much easier to pick out the bass notes but again, they don't seem to dip down as low as either the PS-1's or HP-1000's in most cases, but this is not a truism, as I have albums where all three get the notes, and the notes are down there...think Organ Works.

 

[wakeride74]

Synergy is very important for the PS-1. I listened to mine unamped, through the SM3 with NE5534 class a, Apogee mini-DAC, and PPX3 SLAM with various tube combos.

I have to say that I may not have spent the $$ on them if I had not heard them on the Slam. Incredible synergy! No bloat in the bass, it is very tight with great extension and powerful but controlled and in balance with the other ranges. The Slam sounded better than the Apogee but the Apogee still created a pretty good synergy considering it is more of a DAC than an amp.

So far my favorite combo is the Slam with Sylvania 5687 and an old Hytron 6SN7 (I can get specific numbers on those tubes if anyone wants them). Through the SM3 and unamped they sounded unrefined, bloated bass, severe lack of instrument separation and layering, and generally sloppy by comparison.

As far as burn in I did not notice much and would be hard to tell with the tube rolling anyways but Todd said the settle in after about 50 hours. Oh and flats are the only way to listen to the PS-1, anything else is just uncivilized.

 

[donlin]

Quote:

Originally Posted by wakeride74 Oh and flats are the only way to listen to the PS-1, anything else is just uncivilized.

So true!! Even though they are not unlistenable with bowls like the RS-1, the magic can only happen with flats.

 

[NotoriousBIG_PJ]

PS-1 bass is bloated and overwhelming with flats. Go with bowls for a more balanced sound and better soundstage. Actually I use squished bowls with mine...

Biggie.

 

[Zanth]

Quote:

Originally Posted by donlin So true!! Even though they are not unlistenable with bowls like the RS-1, the magic can only happen with flats.

Funny, I totally disagree. I find that the highs only really shine with the bowls and that the bass is much tighter and more articulate, diminishing the bloat and really elevating the level one can plummet into the netherregions of low bass.

Interesting how the "different strokes for different folks" fits? Though, I can't understand those who use bowls with RS-1's. My ears bleed.

 

[wakeride74]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zanth Funny, I totally disagree. I find that the highs only really shine with the bowls and that the bass is much tighter and more articulate, diminishing the bloat and really elevating the level one can plummet into the netherregions of low bass. Interesting how the "different strokes for different folks" fits? Though, I can't understand those who use bowls with RS-1's. My ears bleed.

After I got mine and tried both I talked to Todd and told him that the bowls sounded terrible and he said that he only used the flats on the PS-1 as well and agreed that was the only way to go. Things like this is why there is such a trial and error process here. You can read these great reviews see things misleading or misunderstood words like "controlled bass" and end up buying. Then once you get it you are at odds with some of what you were told.

What kind of amp are you using?

 

[grawk]

I was all beta cpads prior to the conversion...

 

[wakeride74]

Quote:

Originally Posted by grawk I was all beta cpads prior to the conversion...

I was giving that route some pretty serious thought but decided against it for fear of altering the sound that I get with the flats that is just to perfect to my ears. I only start to get uncomfortable after about 4-5 hours.

 

[Zanth]

Quote:

Originally Posted by wakeride74 After I got mine and tried both I talked to Todd and told him that the bowls sounded terrible and he said that he only used the flats on the PS-1 as well and agreed that was the only way to go. Things like this is why there is such a trial and error process here. You can read these great reviews see things misleading or misunderstood words like "controlled bass" and end up buying. Then once you get it you are at odds with some of what you were told. What kind of amp are you using?

If it were another dealer, I would be hesitant to acknowledge their opinion when they are the only port of entry into the world of flats. He is afterall the sole retailer for these pads. But, Todd is a standup guy and he wouldn't lead someone astray for 30 bucks. That said, I personally feel that the bass is too much when using the flats.

As for amps, I started my PS-1 journey using a prototype Melos (basically an Maestrobated Melos Gold Reference but without the preamp stage and using 12au7's vs. 6dj8's). The amp was not known to be fuzzy, bloated or overly warm, though I could tune it somewhat to that depending on tube type.

Then I moved over to the Ear HP4 which is the amp I use exclusively with the PS-1's. I have tested them with a variety of tubes though the most with a quad set of 1944 Sylvannia Gold Pin 6sl7's.

I have also used them with the renowned EMP Anniversary Edition using Telefunkens which really tone down the bass of the PS-1's. Even so, this little amp has to be the underdog of the century. It dimunitive size is in no way indicative of its power output. It has BASS! Very very nice amp and one that is just so perfect for the desktop. This amp will be leaving me very soon though, back to its owner. It was fun while it lasted.

I've also used the PS-1's with a variety of other amps. The Samuels Stealth which I have on hand, the Headamp GS-1, Grado HPA-1, Grado RA-1, Talisman T-35HP, Lehmann Black Cube, among others. I'm definitely a tube guy, though if I had to, I would use a GS-1 or T-35HP as my SS amp, if I couldn't afford one of Headroom Max's.

 

[donlin]

I would agree that the bass was too heavy with flats until I tried the PS Audio GCHA. That is what made the difference. With all other amps I tried the bass was too much with flats and I just don't like the sound of the bowls regardless of amp, so up until I had the PS Audio, I waffled between the RS-1 and the HP-2. For now, with the PS Audio, the PS-1 with flats is definitely my favorite.