[k4rstar]

Spoke to someone and I'm getting a pair. Doubt I will review them but I had the Game One before and they were the most tolerable headset I had ever used.
 
Just looking for something that is comfortable w/ a mic and won't completely butcher music.

 

[joe]

Guys, I removed some posts which seemed to be more than competitive sniping. Let's keep to the topic.

 

[k4rstar]

Had a pair of these for a few days now. They feel a little more plastic and cheap versus the Game One, but are very lightweight and extremely comfy.
 
No real complaints, sound fine for music, good as far as gaming headsets go. Want to say it's a 558 driver. Have not bothered with the 7.1 software at all.
 
If anyone has questions let me know.

 

[Skipshrike]

It's nice to see that they're still making gaming headsets.
 
Looks to be very similar to the pc363d's, but with new software and straight to USB. The pc363d's had 3.5mm connections so you could swap use other headphones/mic's with their USB dongle. Additionally, this feature was useful because you could take a Y-cable and use the headset with your PS4 controller (although this nixes the virtual surround sound).
 
It'll be neat if you can plug them directly into the PS4 and get virtual surround sound.

 

[Ghost Pack]

A lot of argument for and against 5.1/7.1 seem to miss the underlying reason these solutions exist, most games have schiity audio processing, or it's included as an afterthought.

For games that don't included a spatial audio processing engine and are just relying on modified source clips, 7.1/5.1 virtualization in almost a necessity in order to get an accurate idea of where things are coming from.

However, in most modern Triple A games there exists an audio engine which is dedicated to producing a binaural effect using the surrounding environment. This engine is almost always more effective at generating spatial cues that the 5.1/7.1 emulation software, and in these cases just using stereo headphones works much, much better than trying to use a third party solution.

The big problem comes about when attempting to use a 5.1/7.1 emulating headset or software with games that already include a strong audio engine. This can really mess with positional cues and can actively worsen the gaming experience.

In the end which solution works better is hugely dependent on what game you are playing and the implementation of the software used. All gamers need some kind of audio engine to benifit from positional audio, it just varies where this engine is placed in the signal chain, wether it's in the game engine, in third party software, or in the headphone DSP.

 

[sneak310]

  Game Zero are foldable.
Game Zero have leather (pleather?) ear pads and forehead pad, 373D - velour.
Cable - removable for Game Zero, not so for 373D.
 
Judging from spec differences (SPL - Game Zero 108 dB, 373D 116 dB), different dynamics could be used.
But we need confirmation.
 
Guys, stop trying to convince sneak310.
If he does not believe in HRTF - well, all the better for us when we meet him on the battlefield.
You cannot wake someone who is just pretending to be asleep.

Nobody is pretending to be asleep and I do more than well "on the battlefield".

 

[Badfish5446]

A lot of argument for and against 5.1/7.1 seem to miss the underlying reason these solutions exist, most games have schiity audio processing, or it's included as an afterthought.

For games that don't included a spatial audio processing engine and are just relying on modified source clips, 7.1/5.1 virtualization in almost a necessity in order to get an accurate idea of where things are coming from.

However, in most modern Triple A games there exists an audio engine which is dedicated to producing a binaural effect using the surrounding environment. This engine is almost always more effective at generating spatial cues that the 5.1/7.1 emulation software, and in these cases just using stereo headphones works much, much better than trying to use a third party solution.

The big problem comes about when attempting to use a 5.1/7.1 emulating headset or software with games that already include a strong audio engine. This can really mess with positional cues and can actively worsen the gaming experience.

In the end which solution works better is hugely dependent on what game you are playing and the implementation of the software used. All gamers need some kind of audio engine to benifit from positional audio, it just varies where this engine is placed in the signal chain, wether it's in the game engine, in third party software, or in the headphone DSP.

All of  you... read this post and stop arguing... it's sane, logical and isn't rabidly defensive.  As with most questions of "Which is best?!?!"... it depends!
 

 

 

[sneak310]

  All of  you... read this post and stop arguing... it's sane, logical and isn't rabidly defensive.  As with most questions of "Which is best?!?!"... it depends!
 

 

 However the conversation wasn't on "triple A titles" but rather competitive shooters which are in stereo in the ones where hearing people really makes a difference.
 
I'm pretty sure idTech3 didn't have anything fancy with audio in the game itself and stereo always beat emulated surround.

 

[Ghost Pack]

   However the conversation wasn't on "triple A titles" but rather competitive shooters which are in stereo in the ones where hearing people really makes a difference.
 
I'm pretty sure idTech3 didn't have anything fancy with audio in the game itself and stereo always beat emulated surround.

Well, in the case of a game with simple stereo sound using basic non-hrtf panning then using a plugin that has access to the game's engine would very much improve positional tracking. If there is no such plugin, then using basic surround sound emulation (software or hardware DSP) "could" (read "try it and see") improve separation by emphasizing panning effects. This may or may not improve accuracy.
 
Mainly game companies just need to get their audio schiit together and start making more use of easily adaptable hrtf and acoustic scatter engines. Hopefully these become more prevalent with Nvidia VRWorks and other acoustic ray tracing engines included standard in the newer generations of graphics cards.

 

[ayaamane]

Hi, I have came across the announcement of this new PC 373D a few weeks back, and was thinking if it worth the upgrade over the PC 360 I'm using currently? Or maybe there is other model that is more value-worthy?
Besides that, my PC 360 is starting to pickup the output sound when I'm using the mic (aka my teammate is able to listen to what I'm playing/headphone output sound). Not sure if anyone has experienced this before and if there is a solution/fix for it...? Thanks in advance for your precious comments.

 

[mefxes]

I've played FPS games for at least 15 years now and never heard about even one pro fps player using other than stereo with headphones.
 
Not even one.
 
Not even at home, from where a lot of pro players stream nowadays and play the vast majority of their matches they use anything different than stereo.
 
Not even using in-ear, that another user mentioned saying it's impossible to get directional from it. It isn't. The highest level FPS pro tournament matches makes professional players to use in-ear earphones to listen to the game sound because they need to use ear muffles over them to damp casters and crowd sound. So if anyone can't get positions by stereo with in-ear, the problem isn't the earphones or stereo sound.
 
All pro players use stereo. They can use headphones or in-ear earphones depending on situation. No pro fps player ever used any kind of surround emmulation like 5.1 or 7.1.
 
Surround emmulation may be used to improve immersion. And that's it. Not performance. Not positional.
 
I'm writing just to clarify that due to ppl claiming they have the best performance in games due to surround emmulation. You don't. And won't ever. If you think otherwise, you're welcome to showcase your competitions here where you used surround emmulation. And when you attach emmulated surround to better performance you're basically misleading people through wrong advice and information.
 
@sneak310 @3stun @Mad Lust Envy @panzerfan 
 
And, well, there's no difference between normal stereo headphones and emmulated surround headphones other than software.

 

[sneak310]

  I've played FPS games for at least 15 years now and never heard about even one pro fps player using other than stereo with headphones.
 
Not even one.
 
Not even at home, from where a lot of pro players stream nowadays and play the vast majority of their matches they use anything different than stereo.
 
Not even using in-ear, that another user mentioned saying it's impossible to get directional from it. It isn't. The highest level FPS pro tournament matches makes professional players to use in-ear earphones to listen to the game sound because they need to use ear muffles over them to damp casters and crowd sound. So if anyone can't get positions by stereo with in-ear, the problem isn't the earphones or stereo sound.
 
All pro players use stereo. They can use headphones or in-ear earphones depending on situation. No pro fps player ever used any kind of surround emmulation like 5.1 or 7.1.
 
Surround emmulation may be used to improve immersion. And that's it. Not performance. Not positional.
 
I'm writing just to clarify that due to ppl claiming they have the best performance in games due to surround emmulation. You don't. And won't ever. If you think otherwise, you're welcome to showcase your competitions here where you used surround emmulation. And when you attach emmulated surround to better performance you're basically misleading people through wrong advice and information.
 
@sneak310 @3stun @Mad Lust Envy @panzerfan 
 
And, well, there's no difference between normal stereo headphones and emmulated surround headphones other than software.

I've gone over this stuff already and people got all mad and posts were deleted.

 

[rudyae86]

  I've played FPS games for at least 15 years now and never heard about even one pro fps player using other than stereo with headphones.
 
Not even one.
 
Not even at home, from where a lot of pro players stream nowadays and play the vast majority of their matches they use anything different than stereo.
 
Not even using in-ear, that another user mentioned saying it's impossible to get directional from it. It isn't. The highest level FPS pro tournament matches makes professional players to use in-ear earphones to listen to the game sound because they need to use ear muffles over them to damp casters and crowd sound. So if anyone can't get positions by stereo with in-ear, the problem isn't the earphones or stereo sound.
 
All pro players use stereo. They can use headphones or in-ear earphones depending on situation. No pro fps player ever used any kind of surround emmulation like 5.1 or 7.1.
 
Surround emmulation may be used to improve immersion. And that's it. Not performance. Not positional.
 
I'm writing just to clarify that due to ppl claiming they have the best performance in games due to surround emmulation. You don't. And won't ever. If you think otherwise, you're welcome to showcase your competitions here where you used surround emmulation. And when you attach emmulated surround to better performance you're basically misleading people through wrong advice and information.
 
@sneak310 @3stun @Mad Lust Envy @panzerfan 
 
And, well, there's no difference between normal stereo headphones and emmulated surround headphones other than software.

Just going to put it out there.......
 
 
If you are going to back up your claims, bring in the proof. Otherwise you sound like wikipedia. Just saying.....
 
 
In regards to what you say and to what little know about pro players and in terms of playing competitive FPS is that.............
 
Whether you play in emulated surround sound or regular stereo, it isn't going to turn your crappy -2/1 KD ratio into a 10/1 KD. This is a fact of which I have told many in MLE's thread.
 
However, this whole debate about whether emulated surround sound does help players be more competitive or give them that edge in FPS game is still very debatable. There really needs to be a test run, placebo (stereo) and non-placebo (emulated surround sound), to really find out what the final outcome of this really complicated debate we been having for a while.
 
Now from personal experience...going from stereo to emulated surround gave me a new kind of immersion in the game. Let's keep it at that, let's keep it simple.
In terms of directional cues, for me its evident that emulated surround sound gives me better positional cues than what regular stereo offers. There have been a few where it has saved my arse from being killed from behind or it has lead me to nearby gunfight just by following those gunshots. This is mainly concerning to the rear positional cues, to which until now....I have not been able to distinguish them while using stereo. It could be that I am use to emulated surround sound or I dont know what but stereo isn't doing it for me anymore when it comes to positional cues.
 
But the real question is, has it made me a better player? And I do play competitively to an extent...I am casual player with a good amount of competitive heart when playing a game....
 
But the answer is NO!.....why? Because I have played with Stereo and have gotten the same amount of kills. I have played with no sound and yet I'm at the top.
 
Now that doesn't mean emulated surround sound doesn't help me besides giving a way better audio experience compared to stereo but like I said before, the directional cues from emulated surround sound has gotten me out of some situations in game like BF4, CS GO, War Thunder, and other games that have 5.1/7.1.
 
If anything....if people want to actually want to say that an FPS player does get a slight edge with emulated surround sound. I can fairly say that emulated surround might help me get an additional 2 or 3 kills tops....an average maybe.
 
This is just my honest opinion and this whole debate about stereo is better or emulated surround is better is really getting out of hand. I know there is a lot of misinformation out there, especially the noobs out there. But I dont recall MLE or others stating that using emulated surround sound or VSS or whatever you want to call it, gave them and others a huge advantage in games or anything of that sort.
 
But let's not forget, technology is progressing and fast.....thinking Stereo is the ultimate when it comes to game audio will make you look close minded. Im pretty sure there was a time when everyone said Mono was the best, the standard and that Stereo wouldn't work well and look where it's at. Then we got 5.1 surround sound systems (physical) and people thought that was a gimmick and that it wouldn't offer something that stereo doesn't already do and look at where 5.1, 7.1, 5.1.2, 7.2.2, etc, etc is at and those systems are doing great if not better than expected.
 
Emulated surround sound at it's current stage is still not the best but its the best we had from several years ago or from when it started.
 
In the end, it's personal preference. Nobody is obliged to use just stereo or emulated surround sound but saying that one is better than the other isn't really the right way to clear things up, it just makes it worse.
 
Both stereo and emulated surround sound has it's pro's and con's....so just use what you think its best for you and in your opinion sounds the best.

 

[mefxes]

  Just going to put it out there.......
 
 
If you are going to back up your claims, bring in the proof. Otherwise you sound like wikipedia. Just saying.....
 
 
In regards to what you say and to what little know about pro players and in terms of playing competitive FPS is that.............
 
Whether you play in emulated surround sound or regular stereo, it isn't going to turn your crappy -2/1 KD ratio into a 10/1 KD. This is a fact of which I have told many in MLE's thread.
 
However, this whole debate about whether emulated surround sound does help players be more competitive or give them that edge in FPS game is still very debatable. There really needs to be a test run, placebo (stereo) and non-placebo (emulated surround sound), to really find out what the final outcome of this really complicated debate we been having for a while.
 
Now from personal experience...going from stereo to emulated surround gave me a new kind of immersion in the game. Let's keep it at that, let's keep it simple.
In terms of directional cues, for me its evident that emulated surround sound gives me better positional cues than what regular stereo offers. There have been a few where it has saved my arse from being killed from behind or it has lead me to nearby gunfight just by following those gunshots. This is mainly concerning to the rear positional cues, to which until now....I have not been able to distinguish them while using stereo. It could be that I am use to emulated surround sound or I dont know what but stereo isn't doing it for me anymore when it comes to positional cues.
 
But the real question is, has it made me a better player? And I do play competitively to an extent...I am casual player with a good amount of competitive heart when playing a game....
 
But the answer is NO!.....why? Because I have played with Stereo and have gotten the same amount of kills. I have played with no sound and yet I'm at the top.
 
Now that doesn't mean emulated surround sound doesn't help me besides giving a way better audio experience compared to stereo but like I said before, the directional cues from emulated surround sound has gotten me out of some situations in game like BF4, CS GO, War Thunder, and other games that have 5.1/7.1.
 
If anything....if people want to actually want to say that an FPS player does get a slight edge with emulated surround sound. I can fairly say that emulated surround might help me get an additional 2 or 3 kills tops....an average maybe.
 
This is just my honest opinion and this whole debate about stereo is better or emulated surround is better is really getting out of hand. I know there is a lot of misinformation out there, especially the noobs out there. But I dont recall MLE or others stating that using emulated surround sound or VSS or whatever you want to call it, gave them and others a huge advantage in games or anything of that sort.
 
But let's not forget, technology is progressing and fast.....thinking Stereo is the ultimate when it comes to game audio will make you look close minded. Im pretty sure there was a time when everyone said Mono was the best, the standard and that Stereo wouldn't work well and look where it's at. Then we got 5.1 surround sound systems (physical) and people thought that was a gimmick and that it wouldn't offer something that stereo doesn't already do and look at where 5.1, 7.1, 5.1.2, 7.2.2, etc, etc is at and those systems are doing great if not better than expected.
 
Emulated surround sound at it's current stage is still not the best but its the best we had from several years ago or from when it started.
 
In the end, it's personal preference. Nobody is obliged to use just stereo or emulated surround sound but saying that one is better than the other isn't really the right way to clear things up, it just makes it worse.
 
Both stereo and emulated surround sound has it's pro's and con's....so just use what you think its best for you and in your opinion sounds the best.

If you are going to back up your claims, bring in the proof. Otherwise you sound like wikipedia. Just saying.....

 

[rudyae86]

  If you are going to back up your claims, bring in the proof. Otherwise you sound like wikipedia. Just saying.....

I am the proof...I gave my opinion. Don't try to be a smarty pants
 
Edit: I bet you didn't even read half of what I wrote but that's okay, ignorance is everywhere nowadays *shrugs*
 
But I'm still waiting for your proof

 
 
What is even more interesting is that I have not seen you argue against emulated surround sound in MLE's thread.......
 
Seems like you just randomly like to bash on this particular subject in this particular thread....
 
Im just going to lol along the way.
 
Good day sir