[FenceFurniture]

only downside i ever had was not being able to mute hp output or preamp but my monitors have it via network software

My headphones have a similar feature.

I take them off.

 

[FenceFurniture]

I loved the sound through the XLR output, but since my new cable arrived yesterday and I discovered the ieMatched 4.4 output, in my opinion the 4.4 sounds considerably better—when I switched the output gain from 0 to 18 to compensate for the decrease in volume. Whatever is going on, the 4.4mm port sounds stupendous.

@srkbear I would be very interested to know what you think of the sound difference now, 5 months later, if you go BACK to the 4 pin XLR output with your headphones. What I mean is, I always seem to notice a retrograde step more after I have been listening to the improved (whatever component it might be) sound for a long period. It is then, when I go back to the old way that I get a much clearer and more instant "Oh yeah, that's definitely nowhere near as good".

 

[FenceFurniture]

Is there anyone out there using a Schiit Bifrost 2 Multibit DAC with the Pro iCAN Signature? If so, what is it like? A good pairing, or would something else in the DAC price range be better suited (around USD700).

I ask because I have just purchased a Bifrost with another brand of headphone amp, and the latter is being returned as not fit for service (in the design). So I really don't want to have to change the DAC as well if I can help it.

 

[srkbear]

@srkbear I would be very interested to know what you think of the sound difference now, 5 months later, if you go BACK to the 4 pin XLR output with your headphones. What I mean is, I always seem to notice a retrograde step more after I have been listening to the improved (whatever component it might be) sound for a long period. It is then, when I go back to the old way that I get a much clearer and more instant "Oh yeah, that's definitely nowhere near as good".

I get your point, and I admit that sometimes my setup sounds better or worse on any given day for inexplicable reasons. However, in this case I have A/B’d the XLR and pentaconn outputs for all of my headphones on my Pro iCAN Signature innumerable times over months, and the ieMatch definitively still sounds considerably superior to me—not only by listening analysis but via objective criteria.

Specifically, when I use the XLR with my Focal Utopias (which can take a significant pounding with relative ease), I’m forced to set the iCAN gain knob at 0–and on multiple tracks, especially with the xBass active, the headphones clip and bottom out repeatedly to the extent that I worry about voice coil damage. However, when I use the pentaconn jack with ieMatch, I’m able to crank up the gain to +18db, and no matter what I throw at the Utopias or how much analog bass I apply, I’ve never experienced any clipping at all—even well past comfortable volumes. Same thing happened with my Sony Z1Rs and Susvaras.

As a result, have permanently switched to my 4.4mm cables and will never go back to XLR. In the case of the Pro iCAN Signature, I think iFi’s implementation of their ieMatch tech knocked it out of the park.

 

[FenceFurniture]

(preamble)...
As a result, have permanently switched to my 4.4mm cables and will never go back to XLR. In the case of the Pro iCAN Signature, I think iFi’s implementation of their ieMatch tech knocked it out of the park.

Groovy! Thanks for that. I'm using Stellias, and Hedd monitors. From memory, the Stellias are even slightly easier to drive than Utopias. The point being that I have an Artic Cable terminated in 4.4mm so I can use it with my Shanling M6 Pro 21 DAP.

 

[srkbear]

Groovy! Thanks for that. I'm using Stellias, and Hedd monitors. From memory, the Stellias are even slightly easier to drive than Utopias. The point being that I have an Artic Cable terminated in 4.4mm so I can use it with my Shanling M6 Pro 21 DAP.

Envious of your gear! Those Hedd monitors have always fascinated me but I’ve never had the privilege of hearing them. I did audition the Stellias along with the Utopias, but since I already had a closed-back I chose the latter—although it was hard to part ways with that gorgeous Stellia design. But I purchased a set of Stellia pads to roll on the Utopias, and not only do they look a bit less utilitarian, they kicked up the Utopia’s low end considerably!

I find that I rarely use the Susvaras and I’m itching to try something else—my wish list to try out at the moment includes the Meze Empyrean Elites or the Dan Clark Stealths. What do you like about the HEDDs? Do they have a prominent bass presence?

 

[FenceFurniture]

I find that I rarely use the Susvaras and I’m itching to try something else—my wish list to try out at the moment includes the Meze Empyrean Elites or the Dan Clark Stealths. What do you like about the HEDDs? Do they have a prominent bass presence?

Yes, apparently the Elites are the goods. A reviewer here in Oz has sold his Utopias and Empyreans and just kept the Elites (they are not Empyrean Elites, btw), but I do love the gorgeous look of the brushed copper Empyreans (I have a copper fetish).

What do I like about the Hedds? The bass absolutely rocks man! Tight, clean, and low. I do use a Yamaha subwoof as a supplement, but it's set to just add a little filip to the bottom end (it's right next to my chair, here at the desk). The treble is nice and crisp too without being too bright. I have the Type 7 (first version) and am about to change over to the Type 20 Mk II or possibly the Type 30 Mk II. There are two reasons for the change:
1) the 20 & 30 also have a 4" midrange which I feel the Type 7 is wanting - needs that extra clarity in the mids - a little more penetration
2) Hedd has introduced a "Linerisation" feature (switchable on or off) to present all the various wavelengths at the same time. Naturally, this involves some wavelengths (higher, faster ones) having to be delayed while the others catch up, so there is an overall delay of ~10ms. For music it matters not, and for Youtube and some other web broadcasts I doubt that 10ms will be noticeable (given that YT is often out of synch anyway). I don't know how it will go for watching a DVD (10ms isn't much), but it may become more noticeable if I introduce a Hedd BASS 08 sub because that has a delay of 30ms. (so I think one feeds the tunes to the BASS 08 and from there to the Type 20 to get the sequence right - waiting on an answer from Hedd for that)

I have some previous experience with delayed phase speakers. In 1995 I acquired one of a handful of pairs of Accusound Phase Zero speakers. 4' high towers with a European Dome Tweeter and four 5" Magnavox drivers in a tapered array. They also came with a "Black Box" processor that had an A4 chip in it that flattened out the phase curve. This introduced a 100ms delay, which again for music, mattered not. It was switchable, like Hedd's Linearisation, and when it was switched on, the difference in the quality of the sound was breathtaking. Beautifully smooth and warm and rich! Unfortunately, these speakers were released right when DVDs and 5.1 took off, and of course a 100ms delay really screws lip-synch, let alone that they were strictly stereo. I'm not even sure if the speakers made it into retail shops, as they were essentially stillborn. I got mine because we did a trade - my photography for speakers.

For reasons I still can't fathom I got rid of the Black Box (I had two!) but I kept the speakers and combined them with a sub and two rear channels. They provided me with extremely satisfactory sound in this format for 20 years, but now I am getting out of all 5.1 gear (my partner's working from home has killed the AV room). Back in the day they were AUD4000 (so about USD2800-3000) and AUD500 of that was for the processor. Rubbish phone pic attached.

 

[FenceFurniture]

Does anyone have recommendations on a rack for the idsd pro signature and ican pro signature? The irack pro seems to be discontinued.

There may be some left in Oz:
https://addictedtoaudio.com.au/collections/ifi-audio/products/ifi-pro-irack

$399 is about €270-275 atm, and it includes our 10% GST (VAT).

That mob (A2A) are also flogging off Pro iCANs for AUD2079 and iDSD for AUD2960. They can no longer be found on the iFi website, so I guess they're discontinued.

One has to wonder what will replace them....and when...

 

[FenceFurniture]

A question for anyone using the Pro iCAN (Sig or not) with studio monitors:

If I have the studio monitors on, and I turn the iCAN off, will the amp do a big capacitor dump resulting in a very loud crack/pop being sent to the monitors from a full capacitor dump?
Also, is there a hum/buzz in the monitors (on) if there is no line feed to them (so with the iCAN powered off or unplugged from power)?

They might sound like crazy questions, but I am in the middle of a very unpleasant experience with a competitor's amp (brand new, and also very new to the market). When it goes into Standby mode after 20 minutes, if the monitors are still on (and they almost always are) the resulting CRACK/POP absolutely frightens the crap outta me, apart from potentially being damaging to my hearing, and probably not good for the monitors either. That's with two monitors that each have 2 x 100w amps in them. If I upgrade to Hedd Type 20, as planned, that crack would be going to a pair of 3 x 300 watt monitors. Yikes!

If I don't have this competitor's amp on and set to Pre-Out then the monitors hum if they are on, regardless of whether or not the amp is on, and even if it is not connected to power. It's a ridiculous situation apparently caused by not having an overall termination for the XLR outs. OTOH, with my Focal Arche, there is no hum under any circumstances – off, on, not plugged into the wall. Totally well behaved, as it should be. Oh yeah, no crack when it's turned on/off either.

 

[nickwerner]

There may be some left in Oz:
https://addictedtoaudio.com.au/collections/ifi-audio/products/ifi-pro-irack

$399 is about €270-275 atm, and it includes our 10% GST (VAT).

That mob (A2A) are also flogging off Pro iCANs for AUD2079 and iDSD for AUD2960. They can no longer be found on the iFi website, so I guess they're discontinued.

One has to wonder what will replace them....and when...

Thanks, unfortunately they don’t send to Germany and with added 19% GST for Germany it would be less of a bargain

 

[Ross Kyle]

A question for anyone using the Pro iCAN (Sig or not) with studio monitors:

If I have the studio monitors on, and I turn the iCAN off, will the amp do a big capacitor dump resulting in a very loud crack/pop being sent to the monitors from a full capacitor dump?
Also, is there a hum/buzz in the monitors (on) if there is no line feed to them (so with the iCAN powered off or unplugged from power)?

They might sound like crazy questions, but I am in the middle of a very unpleasant experience with a competitor's amp (brand new, and also very new to the market). When it goes into Standby mode after 20 minutes, if the monitors are still on (and they almost always are) the resulting CRACK/POP absolutely frightens the crap outta me, apart from potentially being damaging to my hearing, and probably not good for the monitors either. That's with two monitors that each have 2 x 100w amps in them. If I upgrade to Hedd Type 20, as planned, that crack would be going to a pair of 3 x 300 watt monitors. Yikes!

If I don't have this competitor's amp on and set to Pre-Out then the monitors hum if they are on, regardless of whether or not the amp is on, and even if it is not connected to power. It's a ridiculous situation apparently caused by not having an overall termination for the XLR outs. OTOH, with my Focal Arche, there is no hum under any circumstances – off, on, not plugged into the wall. Totally well behaved, as it should be. Oh yeah, no crack when it's turned on/off either.

I don’t notice any pops when i turn my amp off with monitors on , if worries just turn volume down as well .

As for hum no from the actual amp , any would be picked up from DAC or that etc if there was any

 

[Ermak]

I don’t notice any pops when i turn my amp off with monitors on , if worries just turn volume down as well .

As for hum no from the actual amp , any would be picked up from DAC or that etc if there was any

Also confirming no pops from my side.

 

[FenceFurniture]

Ok, thank you both. Sounding good, and as it should be.

To be clear:
It doesn't matter what volume this amp is on – 0,100 or mute – it does a full capacitance dump. The hum isn't from the amp as such. It's caused by the XLR cable picking up RF. If the cable is plugged into the monitor, but the amp end of the cable is sucking only air, then the monitor hums - this doesn't particularly matter, because one doesn't have it sucking air on the amp end normally (if one wants to hear some tunes).

When I then plug the amp end into the Focal Arche amp, the hum stops. It doesn't matter if the Arche has power or not, even with Arche power cable unplugged (so not earthed). There are no circumstances under which the monitors hum when plugged into the Arche. This is as it should be.

With the other amp (the new one) the ONLY time the monitor will stop humming is when it is on, and set to Pre-Out. If it is set to HP, powered off, or unplugged completely the monitors hum if the XLR cable is in the amp (or not).

 

[srkbear]

A question for anyone using the Pro iCAN (Sig or not) with studio monitors:

If I have the studio monitors on, and I turn the iCAN off, will the amp do a big capacitor dump resulting in a very loud crack/pop being sent to the monitors from a full capacitor dump?
Also, is there a hum/buzz in the monitors (on) if there is no line feed to them (so with the iCAN powered off or unplugged from power)?

They might sound like crazy questions, but I am in the middle of a very unpleasant experience with a competitor's amp (brand new, and also very new to the market). When it goes into Standby mode after 20 minutes, if the monitors are still on (and they almost always are) the resulting CRACK/POP absolutely frightens the crap outta me, apart from potentially being damaging to my hearing, and probably not good for the monitors either. That's with two monitors that each have 2 x 100w amps in them. If I upgrade to Hedd Type 20, as planned, that crack would be going to a pair of 3 x 300 watt monitors. Yikes!

If I don't have this competitor's amp on and set to Pre-Out then the monitors hum if they are on, regardless of whether or not the amp is on, and even if it is not connected to power. It's a ridiculous situation apparently caused by not having an overall termination for the XLR outs. OTOH, with my Focal Arche, there is no hum under any circumstances – off, on, not plugged into the wall. Totally well behaved, as it should be. Oh yeah, no crack when it's turned on/off either.

I notice a pop, likely a capacitor discharge as you suggest, when switching between solid state and tube modes. I turn my volume down to zero when doing so.

It’s very common for amps of all kinds to cause audible noise when disconnecting AC power, due to discharge of the filter caps. It’s recommended to have volume turned down anytime you do this. It’s a significant issue with guitar amps as well.

Update: I haven’t experienced any hum though, and I’m only using headphones. Will defer this question to others. Good luck!

 

[srkbear]

Yes, apparently the Elites are the goods. A reviewer here in Oz has sold his Utopias and Empyreans and just kept the Elites (they are not Empyrean Elites, btw), but I do love the gorgeous look of the brushed copper Empyreans (I have a copper fetish).

What do I like about the Hedds? The bass absolutely rocks man! Tight, clean, and low. I do use a Yamaha subwoof as a supplement, but it's set to just add a little filip to the bottom end (it's right next to my chair, here at the desk). The treble is nice and crisp too without being too bright. I have the Type 7 (first version) and am about to change over to the Type 20 Mk II or possibly the Type 30 Mk II. There are two reasons for the change:
1) the 20 & 30 also have a 4" midrange which I feel the Type 7 is wanting - needs that extra clarity in the mids - a little more penetration
2) Hedd has introduced a "Linerisation" feature (switchable on or off) to present all the various wavelengths at the same time. Naturally, this involves some wavelengths (higher, faster ones) having to be delayed while the others catch up, so there is an overall delay of ~10ms. For music it matters not, and for Youtube and some other web broadcasts I doubt that 10ms will be noticeable (given that YT is often out of synch anyway). I don't know how it will go for watching a DVD (10ms isn't much), but it may become more noticeable if I introduce a Hedd BASS 08 sub because that has a delay of 30ms. (so I think one feeds the tunes to the BASS 08 and from there to the Type 20 to get the sequence right - waiting on an answer from Hedd for that)

I have some previous experience with delayed phase speakers. In 1995 I acquired one of a handful of pairs of Accusound Phase Zero speakers. 4' high towers with a European Dome Tweeter and four 5" Magnavox drivers in a tapered array. They also came with a "Black Box" processor that had an A4 chip in it that flattened out the phase curve. This introduced a 100ms delay, which again for music, mattered not. It was switchable, like Hedd's Linearisation, and when it was switched on, the difference in the quality of the sound was breathtaking. Beautifully smooth and warm and rich! Unfortunately, these speakers were released right when DVDs and 5.1 took off, and of course a 100ms delay really screws lip-synch, let alone that they were strictly stereo. I'm not even sure if the speakers made it into retail shops, as they were essentially stillborn. I got mine because we did a trade - my photography for speakers.

For reasons I still can't fathom I got rid of the Black Box (I had two!) but I kept the speakers and combined them with a sub and two rear channels. They provided me with extremely satisfactory sound in this format for 20 years, but now I am getting out of all 5.1 gear (my partner's working from home has killed the AV room). Back in the day they were AUD4000 (so about USD2800-3000) and AUD500 of that was for the processor. Rubbish phone pic attached.

Thanks for correcting my nomenclature for the Elites, I’d seen it mistakenly called Empyrean Elites elsewhere, possibly because of the similar form factor, but you’re right!

I’m interested in an alternative to the Susvaras for a planar option—my other cans are all dynamic. And I’ve yet to find a pair that do anything the Utopia can’t, with a little EQ. I value your input about the HEDDs, which have always fascinated me—I need to check them out.

I am a fan of a robust, full bass response, and the Utopias out of the box fall a bit short there. But with the xBass on my iCAN and the switch to Stellia pads, I get plenty of bass. I’d like to find some planars that sound great in the low end without additional EQ, and the Susvaras just don’t. I’d also like to find an option on Amazon so I can return them if I’m not thrilled—especially at this price point.

The Dan Clark Stealths are available there, and they measure terrifically. But everywhere I’ve read the general consensus is that they’re a bit boring. Both the Empyreans and the Elites get great press, but I can’t find anyone gushing about their bass in particular—and again nothing I’ve read suggests that they outperform the Utopias.

Maybe I’m on a fool’s errand—I should be grateful that I have the Utopias and the Z1Rs. I just constantly keep finding myself on a quest for better and better audio, in an OCD kinda way. I wish there was a magical storefront with every headphone on earth on display, cued up to my favorite music, so I could be rid of the FOMO once and for all!